A new way for ALPA to collect dues

[SaturnPilot]

Considering the RJ pilots out number the major pilots in ALPA I think they would survive. They might have to take pay cuts in the palace but they would survive. Actually really wouldn't care if they didn't.

it's not the number of pilots at the regional that matters, it's the amount of their income. Regional MECs do not collect enough dues to even operate themselves. When you throw in contract negotiations that cost over $500,000 per year, an independent regional union would be easy to break.

Personally, the one thing I would not want to see is an entirely non-union pilot force at the regionals. Their pay would get slashed and work rules taken down to the FARs with absolutely nothing else. The chance of gaining improvements to major airlines contracts would be even more difficult. It does nobody good to widen the pay / QOL gap in the wrong direction between regionals and majors.

Remember when getting hired by a legacy carrier was a step up?? Those were the good ole days

Amen to that

 

[SaturnPilot]

Sometimes there comes a point where you have to draw a line in the sand and say ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!!! And this is that time as it pertains to this useless union that clearly does not have my best interests in mind. alpo can take their agency shop provision, turn it sideways, and have it shoved straight up their corrupt a**! I truly don't know how they can look themselves in the mirror.

Why should you be exempt from dues when the rest of us have to pay them? Do you think you're better than the rest of us and we should carry your load?

 

[CopilotDoug]

It does nobody good to widen the pay / QOL gap in the wrong direction between regionals and majors.

And the gap is shrinking, only from the top down.

 

[pipejockey]

Why should you be exempt from dues when the rest of us have to pay them? Do you think you're better than the rest of us and we should carry your load?

Come on man, don't make me waste my time in responding to such a stupid question. You obviously didnt read the thread. This is about our illustrious union trying to subject our 401k contributions to our dues. If that happens I am through paying these clowns that purport to represent me when all they do is make the big wigs rich and don't do anything to at least hold our earning power steady. We are losing earning power each and every year, and these jokers continue to let it happen by sticking their heads up managements keisters!

I look forward to hearing of your termination due to failure to pay your dues. Please keep us updated.

Are you kidding me? How can you actually support dues being paid on what is for most of us our only retirement income? People like you are the reason this union and pilots in general are so cotton pickin impotent! It looks like you work for pinnacle, meaning I'm sure you barely have 2 nickels to rub together. Now watch, you are going to tell us how well the regional airlines pay you and how happy you are and how honored you will be to pay our union even more even though our pay goes down every year since our raises dont even keep up with inflation. You should be encouraging everyone who is an alpo member to stop paying dues if they get away with this horse crap. Are we all gonna get fired? If they think their grand scheme by nickel and dimeing us is going to increase their revenues, lets show them who is really in charge.

Come on people, we are nickel and dimed every freakin day on the job by our useless airlines management, and now you want to let our union do it? GROW A SET PEOPLE! I encourage you all to stop paying your dues if this goes through. Its one thing we let management take advantage of us, it is entirely another if we let the union do it as well. Talk about being caught between a rock and a hard place.

 

[PlaneDrvr]

Come on man, don't make me waste my time in responding to such a stupid question. You obviously didnt read the thread. This is about our illustrious union trying to subject our 401k contributions to our dues. If that happens I am through paying these clowns that purport to represent me when all they do is make the big wigs rich and don't do anything to at least hold our earning power steady. We are losing earning power each and every year, and these jokers continue to let it happen by sticking their heads up managements keisters!



Are you kidding me? How can you actually support dues being paid on what is for most of us our only retirement income? People like you are the reason this union and pilots in general are so cotton pickin impotent! It looks like you work for pinnacle, meaning I'm sure you barely have 2 nickels to rub together. Now watch, you are going to tell us how well the regional airlines pay you and how happy you are and how honored you will be to pay our union even more even though our pay goes down every year since our raises dont even keep up with inflation. You should be encouraging everyone who is an alpo member to stop paying dues if they get away with this horse crap. Are we all gonna get fired? If they think their grand scheme by nickel and dimeing us is going to increase their revenues, lets show them who is really in charge.

Come on people, we are nickel and dimed every freakin day on the job by our useless airlines management, and now you want to let our union do it? GROW A SET PEOPLE! I encourage you all to stop paying your dues if this goes through. Its one thing we let management take advantage of us, it is entirely another if we let the union do it as well. Talk about being caught between a rock and a hard place.

Pipe,

Don't pay any attention to PCL_128; he is a worthless "PFTer" who Bought his job at Gulfstream, went to pinnacle for a while and now works for airtran, so he isn't even a alpa member now, but has always been a 'brainless' (or brainwashed), 'alpa chearleader' Not even worth responding to, waste of time.

When the pilots at USAir decided to leave alpa, their choice, their right; and the former AWA pilots said they would not pay union dues to the new union, PCL never once advocated that they should be 'fired.' So, I guess according to him, you have to pay dues to alpa or be fired, but any other union, guess it doesn't matter. Still wonder why he doesn't start a drive at airtran to bring alpa in there??? If they are soooooo great.

That said, I'm with you, pipe, this is Bull$hit, and I have definitely done supporting alpa, Financially or otherwise. alpa has done more damage to this profession in the last 10-15yrs than manage ever has, and NO ONE in the alpa leadership has ever taken a 'paycut.'

PD

 

[pipejockey]

Pipe,

Don't pay any attention to PCL_128; he is a worthless "PFTer" who Bought his job at Gulfstream, went to pinnacle for a while and now works for airtran, so he isn't even a alpa member now, but has always been a 'brainless' (or brainwashed), 'alpa chearleader' Not even worth responding to, waste of time.

That said, I'm with you, pipe, this is Bull$hit, and I have definitely done supporting alpa, Financially or otherwise. alpa has done more damage to this profession in the last 10-15yrs than manage ever has, and NO ONE in the alpa leadership has ever taken a 'paycut.'

PD

Thanks! I didn't know that about Mr.PCL. Also good to know I am not the only one who has had enough of this union! Stay strong!

 

[PCL_128]

Come on man, don't make me waste my time in responding to such a stupid question. You obviously didnt read the thread. This is about our illustrious union trying to subject our 401k contributions to our dues. If that happens I am through paying these clowns that purport to represent me when all they do is make the big wigs rich and don't do anything to at least hold our earning power steady. We are losing earning power each and every year, and these jokers continue to let it happen by sticking their heads up managements keisters!

Unless you work for a carrier that only has a 401k plan, you're already paying dues on your 401k contributions. If your company has an A-fund or a B-fund, then your 401k contributions have always been calculated into your dues totals. Only the carriers with nothing but a 401k plan will see a dues increase.

You should be encouraging everyone who is an alpo member to stop paying dues if they get away with this horse crap.

Yeah, bankrupt the only organization that looks out for air line pilots. That'll show 'em.

 

[PCL_128]

Pipe,

Don't pay any attention to PCL_128; he is a worthless "PFTer" who Bought his job at Gulfstream, went to pinnacle for a while and now works for airtran, so he isn't even a alpa member now, but has always been a 'brainless' (or brainwashed), 'alpa chearleader' Not even worth responding to, waste of time.

I love you too, PlaneDrvr.

When the pilots at USAir decided to leave alpa, their choice, their right; and the former AWA pilots said they would not pay union dues to the new union, PCL never once advocated that they should be 'fired.' So, I guess according to him, you have to pay dues to alpa or be fired, but any other union, guess it doesn't matter.

USCABA doesn't have an agency shop agreement with USAirways.

Still wonder why he doesn't start a drive at airtran to bring alpa in there??? If they are soooooo great.

Patience is a virtue.

 

[eaglesview]

USCABA doesn't have an agency shop agreement with USAirways.

Give em time. Everyone is so wrapped around the axle with the USAir boys. It's quite simple, the majority got pissed and trew ALPA out. Hope we get that motivated at UAL soon.

 

[PCL_128]

Give em time. Everyone is so wrapped around the axle with the USAir boys. It's quite simple, the majority got pissed and trew ALPA out. Hope we get that motivated at UAL soon.

Correction: the majority (the AAA pilots) decided to rape the minority (the AWA pilots). ALPA had nothing to do with it, despite what the Easties would like you to believe.

 

[PlaneDrvr]

I love you too, PlaneDrvr.



USCABA doesn't have an agency shop agreement with USAirways.


Well, not sure, but if alpa had an 'agency shop agreement' it would probably reside in the current CBA (collective bargaining agreement); which is still in force. So, wouldn't the new union have the same agreement?

If that is the case, will you call now for all of the former AWA pilot to be 'fired' if they don't pay union dues???

Just wondering?

PD

 

[eaglesview]

Correction: the majority (the AAA pilots) decided to rape the minority (the AWA pilots). ALPA had nothing to do with it, despite what the Easties would like you to believe.

Your right, ALPA did what they usually do,nothing, and got the boot

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Your right, ALPA did what they usually do,nothing, and got the boot

Wrong.

 

[pipejockey]

Only the carriers with nothing but a 401k plan will see a dues increase.



Yeah, bankrupt the only organization that looks out for air line pilots. That'll show 'em.

All I have is a 401K. And if alpo goes bankrupt because we refused to pay our dues in protest of this thievery it is their own fault. How long do you think it would be before they realize we are dead serious about this and they back off on this policy? Before it is even implemented hopefully? A day? A week? As long as we all withdrew our dues authorizations on the first day, that should get the message across.

So tell me Mr.PCL, what has alpo done for you the past 7 years? Did they pay for your pft at gulfstream? I was given the scoop on you!

 

[PlaneDrvr]

All I have is a 401K. And if alpo goes bankrupt because we refused to pay our dues in protest of this thievery it is their own fault. How long do you think it would be before they realize we are dead serious about this and they back off on this policy? Before it is even implemented hopefully? A day? A week? As long as we all withdrew our dues authorizations on the first day, that should get the message across.

So tell me Mr.PCL, what has alpo done for you the past 7 years? Did they pay for your pft at gulfstream? I was given the scoop on you!

No, Pipe, his Daddy paid for his job at gulfstream.

He's just a 'PFT wanker' and thinks he knows everything. And, my thoughts, the only thing in this industry Lower than a F$%king 'PFTer' is a F$%king 'scab' in fact one is only just a little bit above the other. NO respectable pilot with any integrity would EVER 'pay' for a job. 25+ years in this business, and have Never paid for any training, and never paid for a type rating, Never have and Never will. And, kinda ironic that PCL ended up at airtran, which started out as Value(less)Jet, which started as a PFT operation.

For what its worth.

PD

P.S. Pipe, the sooner alpa goes down the tubes the better, too corrupt, to useless, get rid of it and start over. Maybe the USAir pilots, along with AA have the right idea.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

All I have is a 401K. And if alpo goes bankrupt because we refused to pay our dues in protest of this thievery it is their own fault. How long do you think it would be before they realize we are dead serious about this and they back off on this policy? Before it is even implemented hopefully? A day? A week? As long as we all withdrew our dues authorizations on the first day, that should get the message across.

The regionals that only have a 401k have not been paying ALPA dues before a pilots contributes into the 401k. (gross)

This effort by ALPA was started last year by members of the EB. Or that dreaded monolith called 'ALPA National'.

What it comes down to is... guys like you have had an exemption so to speak. Whereas the legacy guys and FedEx pilots who have A, B and/or C plans have been paying dues on their gross income... the regionals or 401k only pilots, like yourself have not.

This effort by ALPA is simply an effort for all members to have dues assessments applied fairly.

So instead of paying less than you have been (a good deal for you) you'll be paying the same in terms of percentage (fairly applied to all) as everyone else.



Now... if you really don't think you should pay your fair share and you should go back to the good deal then your chance to participate in American politics is here.

This must pass by 2/3 vote.

The 2008BOD is this fall. If you have enough political skillset you can work the issue and convince enough (2/3) delegates to vote this down.

Respectfully, no one learned much about politics when getting an ATP. However, politics is how the business of the Association is conducted. Right. Wrong. Good. Bad. its just the way it is... Its is how our founding fathers decided how we are to be democratic.

There is plenty of time. The choice is yours.

 

[Bdfg1]

ALPA had nothing to do with it, despite what the Easties would like you to believe.

YES BELIEVE THIS MAN! Alpo never once presented an inaccurate senority list to an arbitrator. Never happened. Wasn't alpo!

 

[Evansaero]

I Promise...

To mail back my 10 year ALPA pin and burn my ALPA card if you touch my 401k...

You are on Notice

 

[eaglesview]

Wrong.

My apologize, you are correct. I meant to say ALPA did nothing right and got the boot.

 

[PCL_128]

Well, not sure, but if alpa had an 'agency shop agreement' it would probably reside in the current CBA (collective bargaining agreement); which is still in force. So, wouldn't the new union have the same agreement?

I would argue that the agency shop agreement isn't grandfathered in. If a pilot was terminated for not paying dues to USCABA, then it would have to be settled in grievance, and I think he'd have a decent case.

If that is the case, will you call now for all of the former AWA pilot to be 'fired' if they don't pay union dues???

No, I think any West pilot would be a complete moron to voluntarily send money to an organization whose sole purpose is to rape him and his fellow West pilots.

 

[PCL_128]

I Promise...

To mail back my 10 year ALPA pin and burn my ALPA card if you touch my 401k...

You are on Notice

ALPA isn't touching your 401k. ALPA is assessing dues based on your gross income. Big difference.

 

[PCL_128]

Alpo never once presented an inaccurate senority list to an arbitrator

I don't know what "Alpo" is, but if you're referring to ALPA, then the above statement is correct.

 

[Evansaero]

ALPA isn't touching your 401k. ALPA is assessing dues based on your gross income. Big difference.

To me there is no difference when ALPA wants to tax me on monies I won't even see until I'm 59 1/2.

Not even the Dems in Congress are stupid enough to try that

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

To me there is no difference when ALPA wants to tax me on monies I won't even see until I'm 59 1/2.

Not even the Dems in Congress are stupid enough to try that

You still don't understand what is happening here....


Would you like to?

 

[PCL_128]

You still don't understand what is happening here....


Would you like to?

I think it's obvious that most of them don't care to. They just want to hurl obscenities at ALPA, whether they're justified or not.

 

[Bdfg1]

I don't know what "Alpo" is, but if you're referring to ALPA, then the above statement is correct.

Court documents say otherwise. Obviously you'll believe alpo before you believe court testimony.

 

[PCL_128]

Court documents say otherwise. Obviously you'll believe alpo before you believe court testimony.

Depends on who is giving the testimony. If it's coming from a USCABA member, then I'd sooner trust Bill Clinton's testimony.

 

[Bdfg1]

Depends on who is giving the testimony. If it's coming from a USCABA member, then I'd sooner trust Bill Clinton's testimony.

USCABA? If you are talking about USABA then no. The above statement is not correct. What about alpo and USAir testimony? Would you believe that? Or would you believe alpo when they tell you what they testified in court is not really true?

I suggest you do your homework a little better. It will make you look less the fool when discussing this matter.

 

[PCL_128]

If you have testimony from ALPA Officers to reference, then reference it. I've seen nothing so far.

 

[Bdfg1]

If you have testimony from ALPA Officers to reference, then reference it. I've seen nothing so far.

Obviously you have access to this thing called the INTERNET. Like I said, do YOUR homework. I won't do it for you.