What's everyones backup career ?

[Amish RakeFight]

I could see Jmonkey doing this job. Aftr workin for ASA he is probably qualified.:laugh:

Just watch out for the guy about to hit you in the head with a pipe wrench. I told you those routes are highly coveted.

 

[hindsight2020]

I was going to go back into the military, get a commission by way of the National Guard, I am prior enlisted Marine, but funny thing is, I cannot take a leave of absence from AT, survive on E-5 pay and then 2LT pay to do all the training, just so when I get back there may no longer be a job to have...so I guess when it all fails I will go be a high school teacher and take a pay cut afterall...oh the irony

I don't think you're looking at it properly from a long-term perspective. I'm a Reserve baby and aside from my meager pay as a bumming 2LT (soon to be 1LT....yeii.....) you couldn't pay me to go take a major airline job, regardless of the fact I don't qualify for one (which is quite telling in it of itself). I don't know how old you are, or how long you've been at AT, and if you live in domicile or not, but having a Guard/Reserve job is great insurance to have as far as flying currency goes in case of a furlough.

Also, unless you're a CA at AT (at which point I doubt you'd be young enough to qualify for UPT unless you had the mother of timing luck) there is really not much opportunity cost in terms of pay differential that you're giving up. In the two years you'll be in training you'll make about first year FO pay, heck more if you account for the non-taxable allowances. It may not work for a major CA, but it sure beats being a regional FO, which is all I'd be able to snag in the civilian world. In that respect, not pursuing airline work was a fairly easy decision for me to make, the alternative was and is an outright joke.

You can make OK money as a bum while you sniff out an ART/AGR job (my plan), while being at home most nights and weekends, aside from voluntary trips you take, and worst case scenario I'd still make more money as a part-time mil pilot/ part-time walmart greeter than day #2 as a furloughee. Combine both jobs in the same location and you're set. Granted I'll still be renting on my variable income status, living meagerly and not capitalizing, but I won't be on the poor house. And the time invested in pursuing an ART job is more worthwhile to me than whatever lost seniority and pay differential I'm giving up by not chasing a freggin' CA upgrade slot so I can start making a livable wage. So if I were you, I'd tell myself that part-time Guard gig you speak of is probably better for your whole life picture than a CA slot at AT. To each their own of course. P/T Guard jobs don't address SJS so there's a non-economic valuation question that can only be addressed individually.

Now, what that perspective doesn't take into account is what has been alluded to in this thread. There is this insistence on the part of pilots to chalk up their lack of skill transferability and unwillingness to do something other than fly to a false sense of "big picture" which is in reality defeatism. That sense of stoicism that some people say they hold on the face of the unstable nature of 121 work is not a position worth of sympathy at all. In so much as you rather stab your eyeballs in than hold a desk job, it is equally voluntary on your part to put yourself in a poor economic position by stubbornly pursuing an employment avenue that constantly kicks your a$$.

You can't have the cake and eat it too. I think it's very telling that when the OP wanted to hear what alternate means of employment people would consider/hash out, in what clearly is a very shaky industry for a 30-year outlook, the responses ranged from outright dismissal of the question (midget porn..haha..oh wait I'm still unemployed...ha- huh?) to the heroic classic "I'm just gonna fly until I get laid off, then I'm gonna do like Peter and sit on my a$$ and do nothing unitl I can fly again, regardless of economic terms, sorry kids, it was out of my control to being with". And people wonder why it's so difficult for pilots to protect their income power...there's no bargaining power when you're unwilling to walk away (price elasticity= 0 ).

Face it, private aviation is turning into a part-time job. Not everybody can work for brown, purple or SW. I think everybody could hedge their bets a little better than chalking it up to "whatever happens, I'll be here to fly whatever's left". That's not noble, that's defeatism and short-sightedness.

 

[say again]

Smoke a big fat J and become a junkie down in Jamaica!!!

 

[RadioClash]

Hindsight,

Unfortunately I am too old for UPT, I'm 34, on 3rd year pay at AT and am looking at the Army NG and the possibilty of going back into Artillery. I don't have SJS and am not chasing a CA upgrade, just trying to provide for my family, and by no way do we live beyond our means. I have to look at all possibilties and no kidding will probably end up being a teacher if all else fails.

 

[hindsight2020]

Hindsight,

Unfortunately I am too old for UPT, I'm 34, on 3rd year pay at AT and am looking at the Army NG and the possibilty of going back into Artillery. I don't have SJS and am not chasing a CA upgrade, just trying to provide for my family, and by no way do we live beyond our means. I have to look at all possibilties and no kidding will probably end up being a teacher if all else fails.

Noted. Makes sense. The latter part of my post was meant as a general thought towards pilots as a labor force, wasn't directed at your individual circumstance, did not mean to suggest you were the one specifically with SJS. Good luck with AT.

 

[JoeMerchant]

Don't forget to vote! Local, State and Fed.

...I agree....Dude's vote will cancel yours out...

 

[JoeMerchant]

Maybe. How's your primary "pro bono F&H" job?

ALPA makes F&H's job easy....A two year old could divide a group of airline pilots....

Amazing....

So you advocate your jobs being eliminated based on free market forces. You don't mind starting over as many times as the free market can recycle you.

And when you get laid off again and again, you want nothing from gov't. No job retraining, no loans, nothing...

Being an Air Line Pilot is not an asset to our nations economy? You like be equated to a hotel maid.



Chickens voting for Frank Purdue....

So let me get this straight....ALPA has no responsibity or solution to the "starting all over" routine you speak of, but you want a middle class family in Fargo to pay taxes to retrain me when market forces do their thing....That is amazing and shows how out of touch you are with the general membership....

We as a union could solve this problem of starting all over....Every other profession has the ability...it can't be that difficult...

If I have to start over....I am capable of taking care of myself....I don't need Uncle Obama to take care of me....It isn't the Federal Govts.(ie tax payers) job to take care of us because we can't figure out a way not to have to start all over again at the bottom....

You're right Rez...Amazing.....

 

[Fly4hire]

Start a a store called ATF(&M)

Alcohol, Tools, Firearms, and Motorcycles

 

[Redmeat]

A two year old could divide a group of airline pilots....

You got that right.

'Herding cats'

 

[Redmeat]

Start a a store called ATF(&M)

Alcohol, Tools, Firearms, and Motorcycles

I like it, one stop shopping.:laugh:

Gonna franchise? I may need it.

 

[JoeMerchant]

You got that right.

'Herding cats'

Ford & Harrison are "shooting fish in a barrel"....

 

[Lear70]

Hindsight: What do you suggest?

Some of us tried to go military but couldn't get into the aviation side for whatever reason, so we stayed civilian, and are now too old to have it as a backup (I'm 36, I don't think they're going to let me into the Warrant Officer course for helicopters which would be my choice).

Your idea is great for the under-30 RJ crowd, but those of us who are left need a better solution than just telling us to figure out a backup plan then provide no real alternatives.

I have operated a small side business for 10 years that has often made even better money than what I make at work, so I'm not hugely concerned for myself, but many don't and there aren't many options for replacing a $60k-80k position.

That's why many of us have been facetious, as there are still only about 40% (or less these days) prior military who have it to fall back on, and many really don't have a solution. Certainly they can pare down and prepare for the worst (which I was advocating earlier) but, at the end of the day, if things go bad, you can't just give up and end it all... life goes on and you make the best of it.

"Necessity is the mother of invention".

 

[Smarta$$]

Back to the ER as a Nurse...never took my hand out of it and people are always sick and or hurting themselves...if it is a layoff I might try and take the time and go to PA school.

It pays as much as a commuter captain...but is a lot more work and not as fun!

Gaylord focker? Is that you?

 

[satpak77]

Guys...I see some pretty funny responses here, but I was actually looking for serious answers besides Porn Star and Rodeo Clown, etc.

Seriously, what are your plans?

 

[JJET44]

Fly for an oil company..

Oh wait, I already do .

Hey Fly,
Do us all a favor. Next time you fly the boss, go back and kick him in the ba11s.

 

[800Dog]

I plan on marrying the General's rich wife soon after she dumps him! Should happen very soon. Will post some pics of our wedding. Plan to just kick it on what used to be his boat!

 

[TWA]

Chippendale's.

Seriously... I'm that hot. Chicks dig scars, and airline glory lives forever.

I'm thinking of using some of my uniforms in my costume. I have 5 different color combinations... maybe mix and match a little. The Flexjet blue compliments my eyes...

You sir, just lost your man card.

 

[Lear70]

You sir, just lost your man card.

ROFLMAO!

I was wondering how long it would take someone to bite... NO pun intended, whatsoever!

 

[Lear70]

Guys...I see some pretty funny responses here, but I was actually looking for serious answers besides Porn Star and Rodeo Clown, etc.

Seriously, what are your plans?

I know you're serious, and there's no good answer. Seriously.

Some people always planned to fall back into Real Estate - well, that obviously isn't going to work for about 2 or 3 years.

Some people were thinking about regionals... along with 1,000+ people already on the street and another 1,000 likely after the summer when furloughs start to sound good to the Legacies (especially those who have merged and need to lean out capacity).

Some people have been talking overseas flying. The IBEX CRJ contract just came up to 10 consecutive days off per month on their commuting contract and $8,000 per month tax-free if you stay out or buy an off-shore PRIMARY residence and live there.

India, Asia, Europe, even some parts of the sand box, all are looking for pilots in a serious way and will continue to do so and could probably employ every aviator here who gets laid off.

Problem is, su esposa /esposo... will they be able to hack it with kids going to foreign country because 10 days off isn't enough when commuting takes a day or two each way; you'd have to bring your family or keep them somewhere close.

So, you have three choices:

1. You collect unemployment, food stamps if you can qualify, and both you and the wife work $12-$15 an hour jobs or one does some serious eBay sales. Not hard to set up, and there's always a niche, but it's long days at your computer for $200 or so a day (why do you think I'm on here when I'm not flying or out with the crew or home with the fam?)

2. You find some niche job that's missing in your area. I've stumbled across 3 or 4 with my tinkering in cars, boats, and eBay stuff. You can find it if you look hard enough.

3. You can leave the country and go ex-pat. Hard to make it back after that - a lot of people never do, some because they just don't want to take the pay cut, some because they truly love the international flying once they get hooked and don't want to come back to a domestic schedule that may be long-term or permanent.

Them's the choices. Pick one.

Now... if you were looking for specific options under #2, you can't steal my ideas, but I have a few I wasn't planning on using because they either bore me or I don't have the patience for them.

 

[Dude]

If it gets really bad I'll open up my own Nathan's Famous Hot Dogs. Free cholesterol, baby. Joe, you get free dogs and kraut.