Pinnacle's Delta Numbers!!!!

[Striptyler]

The company came at us with low ball rates for the -900 and we told them to shove it up their arses. When the arbitrators rates come out, we will get FULL BACK PAY!!!

You talk $hit like its the pilots fault we are still being paid -200 rates. Its not like we had the power or ability to tell mismangement we did not want to fly the -900's. If it were up to the pilot group, we would have had industry leading pay and a new contract before these planes ever were on property.

And yes, our FO rates are insulting across the board..

Kinda funny that a colgan 2nd yr 1900 FO makes more than a crj-200 FO of same year at Pinnacle... Sure it's only 2 bucks an hour, but really...

 

[Flyprdu]

I agree. Worst 2nd year FO 50 seat rate in the world. I am not kidding.

 

[Striptyler]

Guess it doesn't matter... Both the Colgan and pinnacle FO will either quit or upgrade before hitting the 2nd yr pay...

 

[FmrFreightDog]

And good for them, and I do support the efforts of everyone over there. This just happens to be one of those times in the industry that the only growth that will come is at the expense of someone else. It sucks, but it is what it is.

You need to think very carefully about that sentiment before you stand behind it. Sit back, take a deep breath, and think to yourself, "I will take ground beef off someone else's family table to put prime rib on mine." If you're really, honestly ok with that line of thinking then you have no business in this profession. What do you hope to gain if Pinnacle leaves the Delta family? A few more airplanes?? A slightly better schedule?? An extra flight attendant in the back to stroke your ego??

I was in a position to watch the ASA pilots sit back for far too long before finally stepping up to the plate and fighting, really fighting, for a new contract. I was there, fighting for a better contract, long before you ever set foot on property, I'm guessing. I'm now in a position to watch (albeit from afar) the Pinnacle pilots step up to the same plate. So far, I'm far more impressed with the Pinnacle pilots' resolve than I ever was with the ASA pilots' resolve. They have organized faster, gotten pissed off faster, and taken things into their own hands to make a difference faster than the ASA pilot group ever did.

The Pinnacle pilots aren't your problem. Mother D is. Do you honestly want those 900s so badly that you're willing to see another union pilot lose his or her job? I sincerely hope that we, as a profession, are not at this point. If we are, then this "profession" is lost.

Believe it or not, we as pilots actually used to look after each other instead of fighting for scraps. Management didn't break us down, we self-destructed. Sadly, lots of people have gotten rich off that self-destruction and not one of them knows how to fly an ILS, land in a crosswind, or analyze the suitability of a contaminated runway for landing. So.... when you publicly advertise your desire for Pinnacle to lose their Delta contract, exactly whose "best interests" are you looking after? Your own or those of the people who continue to make money off your naiveite an inexperience with the true nature of this business?

I don't mean to be harsh, but a small dose of historical perspective would do you a world of good.

 

[pilotdiscretion]

Not that I can defend some of the Riddle tool bags, 'cause they are tool boxes, but at least they got some high altitude aerodynamics knowledge! Dude!

Aside from the fact that it's in poor taste to bash a dead pilot who can't defend themselves you don't seem to know much about the accident.

Section 1.5.1 of the NTSB final report on the accident states that the captain was a graduate of ERAU and had received high altitude training. Dude.

 

[Windsor]

Well said FreightDog

 

[McNugent]

You need to think very carefully about that sentiment before you stand behind it. Sit back, take a deep breath, and think to yourself, "I will take ground beef off someone else's family table to put prime rib on mine." If you're really, honestly ok with that line of thinking then you have no business in this profession. What do you hope to gain if Pinnacle leaves the Delta family? A few more airplanes?? A slightly better schedule?? An extra flight attendant in the back to stroke your ego??

I was in a position to watch the ASA pilots sit back for far too long before finally stepping up to the plate and fighting, really fighting, for a new contract. I was there, fighting for a better contract, long before you ever set foot on property, I'm guessing. I'm now in a position to watch (albeit from afar) the Pinnacle pilots step up to the same plate. So far, I'm far more impressed with the Pinnacle pilots' resolve than I ever was with the ASA pilots' resolve. They have organized faster, gotten pissed off faster, and taken things into their own hands to make a difference faster than the ASA pilot group ever did.

The Pinnacle pilots aren't your problem. Mother D is. Do you honestly want those 900s so badly that you're willing to see another union pilot lose his or her job? I sincerely hope that we, as a profession, are not at this point. If we are, then this "profession" is lost.

Believe it or not, we as pilots actually used to look after each other instead of fighting for scraps. Management didn't break us down, we self-destructed. Sadly, lots of people have gotten rich off that self-destruction and not one of them knows how to fly an ILS, land in a crosswind, or analyze the suitability of a contaminated runway for landing. So.... when you publicly advertise your desire for Pinnacle to lose their Delta contract, exactly whose "best interests" are you looking after? Your own or those of the people who continue to make money off your naiveite an inexperience with the true nature of this business?

I don't mean to be harsh, but a small dose of historical perspective would do you a world of good.

If they were making some sweet coin on those things I don't think anyone would want to see them lose the flying. As a former ASA guy you should know what it feels like to get low balled by another carrier willing to work in your back yard for cheaper. That's exactly what Pinnacle has done, and it's flaunted in our face everyday right in front of our freakin crew lounge.

 

[Windsor]

If they were making some sweet coin on those things I don't think anyone would want to see them lose the flying. As a former ASA guy you should know what it feels like to get low balled by another carrier willing to work in your back yard for cheaper. That's exactly what Pinnacle has done, and it's flaunted in our face everyday right in front of our freakin crew lounge.

Again, you miss the point. Its not the pilots making the decisions to go out and start flying for other airlines, Mismanagement does. Our pilot group is pretty pissed about the ATL mess as well. To show our anger, pilots have stopped bidding for ATL. On our latest vacancy, the company couldnt fill all the open slots. If you're angry about 9E coming to ATL, come on down to MEM on May 1st and show Pinnacle's mismanagement you're pissed.

 

[WildBlue]

If they were making some sweet coin on those things I don't think anyone would want to see them lose the flying. As a former ASA guy you should know what it feels like to get low balled by another carrier willing to work in your back yard for cheaper. That's exactly what Pinnacle has done, and it's flaunted in our face everyday right in front of our freakin crew lounge.Today 09:35
How do YOU know what it pays to fly those things at Pinnacle. Nobody knows because the issue was sent to an arbitrator. Once the arbitrator publishes his ruling, every pilot gets back pay. At least give us credit for not accepting management's low-ball offer and exercising our contractual right to send it to an arbitrator.

At least we have some say in how much we are paid. The system isn't working too well with Bush, but that can change. Some DCI pilots have absolutely no say at all.

 

[McNugent]

That's fine and great you are going to the arbitrator. I'm just giving reasons why you aren't welcomed to ATL with arms open from the ASA people. All we see you as is another carrier put in place that's eating away at business that at one point not too long ago happened to be that of ASA and some Comair.

So we've gone from 2 DCI carriers to 6 or 7 in the course of just over a year. How would you like it if ASA showed up in MEM DTW and MSP with a bunch of new airplanes after you had been stagnant for years?

 

[Flyprdu]

So we've gone from 2 DCI carriers to 6 or 7 in the course of just over a year. How would you like it if ASA showed up in MEM DTW and MSP with a bunch of new airplanes after you had been stagnant for years?

Someone did. They're called Compass. It's happening everywhere. Stop being such a crying Nancy.

 

[WildBlue]

I don't care if we are greeted with open arms or not. Pinnacle pilots didn't make the decision to over there any more than the Skywest make decisions about where they are flying.

And don't think for a minute that Pinnacle pilots aren't familiar with the problems of multiple regional providing feed for NWA. NWA has been playing musical airplanes/pilot jobs with Mesaba and Pinnacle long before Delta management started playing their games. Now, we have the prospect of being whipsawed by Compass, whose pilots are "represented" by the NWA MEC.

It is disappointing that any other pilot within the Delta group has hard feelings for Pinnacle pilots because of management decisions. I guess some folks will never grow up and take their frustrations out on the people that make these decisions and not the pawns.

 

[gojo]

That's fine and great you are going to the arbitrator. I'm just giving reasons why you aren't welcomed to ATL with arms open from the ASA people. All we see you as is another carrier put in place that's eating away at business that at one point not too long ago happened to be that of ASA and some Comair.

So we've gone from 2 DCI carriers to 6 or 7 in the course of just over a year. How would you like it if ASA showed up in MEM DTW and MSP with a bunch of new airplanes after you had been stagnant for years?

I agree with you, but I think were dealing with a new breed of pilot today. Unfortunately solidarity in this profession is becoming a thing of the past, at least at the regional level. It seems that many of the new pilots are ok with increased growth at someone elses expense. Is there a way to stop this way of thinking? I don't know at this point. It's that way outside of aviation also. Think of Skywest as becoming the Walmart in aviation!

 

[Medeco]

That's fine and great you are going to the arbitrator. I'm just giving reasons why you aren't welcomed to ATL with arms open from the ASA people. All we see you as is another carrier put in place that's eating away at business that at one point not too long ago happened to be that of ASA and some Comair.

So we've gone from 2 DCI carriers to 6 or 7 in the course of just over a year. How would you like it if ASA showed up in MEM DTW and MSP with a bunch of new airplanes after you had been stagnant for years?

You need to stop talking as if you speak for all ASA pilots.

Medeco

 

[McNugent]

Someone did. They're called Compass. It's happening everywhere. Stop being such a crying Nancy.

I'm not crying. I haven't said anything that isn't true. You guys wonder why ASA people feel the way they do, I'm just telling you ya shmuck.