Delta asks union to part-scratch pilot contract: report

[9rj9]

First pay, then retirement, now they want parts of the contract so they can stick you together with a has-been airline, then furlough the unneeded masses....

http://www.reuters.com/article/marketsNews/idINN1028885420080410?rpc=44
NEW YORK (Reuters) - Delta Air Lines Inc (DAL.N: Quote, Profile, Research) is urging its union leaders to cede parts of a pilots' labor contract so it can move closer to merging with Northwest Airlines (NWA.N: Quote, Profile, Research), the Wall Street Journal reported, citing sources who knew about the situation.
If talks are fruitful, the airlines seek to announce their long-pending merger as early as next week and gather support from Northwest pilots later, the report said on Thursday.
Delta is promising 6,000 aviators pay rises, equity and a seat on the board of the combined airline if the union agrees to its request, the Journal said, quoting those sources.
Merger talks between the airlines cooled in March when pilots from both sides failed to agree on how seniority should work for the roughly 12.000 pilots in the combined carrier.
But talks were revived, and Delta and its pilots have been discussing a new contract that would be valid if the merger goes through, the Journal reported earlier, citing sources familiar with talks.
Delta was not available for comment and a Northwest spokesman declined to comment.

 

[Tanker Clown]

Boy, we all saw this coming. DALPA will cave. Good bye no furlough clause...or whatever the company wants.

 

[wms]

They'll keep the no-furlough clause because it only applies to pilots on the seniority list at DOS. There are plenty who were hired after that.

 

[Kugelblitz]

They'll keep the no-furlough clause because it only applies to pilots on the seniority list at DOS. There are plenty who were hired after that.

Indeed, and speaking from experience, the 6000 pilots offered pay raises means that only the top 20% of them will still be around to enjoy it.

 

[wms]

With the exception of everything that happens outside of the airplane, aviation is a great career.

 

[michael707767]

Indeed, and speaking from experience, the 6000 pilots offered pay raises means that only the top 20% of them will still be around to enjoy it.

yeah, that sounds about right.

PS,I love seeing all the 76 seat RJs at our gates in ATL.

 

[JonnyKnoxville]

yeah, that sounds about right.

PS,I love seeing all the 76 seat RJs at our gates in ATL.

Take back the flying. Delta already owns the 76 seat airplanes!

 

[jetflier]

Rumor has DALALPA giving 100 seat flying to their regionals as a compromise to force the merger without NWAALPA.

This would assure a bigger seniority grab from DAL as they guarantee the death of the nines so that they can get a raise and equity cash.

I find this hard to believe considering that both airlines are ALPA.

"Game On"

 

[PuffDriver]

They'll keep the no-furlough clause because it only applies to pilots on the seniority list at DOS. There are plenty who were hired after that.

Actually, date of signing would be after membership ratification, and everyone, new-hires, would be on the property by then.

 

[Ty Webb]

Rumor has DALALPA giving 100 seat flying to their regionals as a compromise to force the merger without NWAALPA.

If rumors are to be believed, then I'm number 2,202 on the new SWAirTran seniority list. . Don't get all bunched up over rumors.

 

[PuffDriver]

Rumor has DALALPA giving 100 seat flying to their regionals as a compromise to force the merger without NWAALPA.

This would assure a bigger seniority grab from DAL as they guarantee the death of the nines so that they can get a raise and equity cash.

I find this hard to believe considering that both airlines are ALPA.

"Game On"

The -9s are going away anyway. Your MEC know that, which is why they kept trying to come back to the table so many times. I doubt very much that the 100 seaters will go to regionals. The only way would be to place Delta butts in them as a "compass-type" arrangement. I would have to see the details of that arrangement prior to voting, but would likely vote no on that issue alone.

I would agree that national ALPA is responsible for this mess, and I would also state that NWA ALPA would have also, and have, shown their greed with this deal. The Delta MEC position is one of compromise on the SLI, the NWA position is one which will hurt the Delta pilots much more than the NWA pilots. As such, it does not adhere to merger policy--as it probably should even though merger policy has not been invoked.

 

[Lear70]

Who is the "has-been" airline you mention?

Personally, NWA and DAL are about the same from a customer AND pilot standpoint. I spent 5 years Jumpseating on NWA, 2 years jumping on DAL, and now a year as a revenue passenger every week on both.

Neither one stands out as being any better than the other. Mostly good pilots, a few "sky gods", some good flight attendants, some mean, old, hags, and both systems with some of the least-friendly gate agents in the business.

Just trying to figure out who you're bashing in that first sentence... and why?

 

[LandGreen]

Another rumor, since we are all talking rumors.

Steenland wants OUT so bad he might be willing to sell parts of the airline. This is his response to the pilots not cooperating. Wow!

Please say it ain't so! It is JUST a rumor.

 

[d.fitz]

The Delta MEC position is one of compromise on the SLI, the NWA position is one which will hurt the Delta pilots much more than the NWA pilots.

All this with no knowledge of anything, huh? Maybe it's the other way around. If you are 'in the know' then post your source.

 

[Lear70]

Another rumor, since we are all talking rumors.

Steenland wants OUT so bad he might be willing to sell parts of the airline. This is his response to the pilots not cooperating. Wow!

Please say it ain't so! It is JUST a rumor.

That's not a rumor... that's fact, thinly-veiled.

He has a LOT of money to lose if he can't get this done in the next few months... One way or another, I believe he intends to take that money and run.

Whether the BoD lets him get away with piecemeal cutting up the airline is another matter... unless the DoJ requires it as a part of the deal with anti-trust issues.

Interesting to watch... Good luck to all!

 

[PuffDriver]

All this with no knowledge of anything, huh? Maybe it's the other way around. If you are 'in the know' then post your source.

Sorry, homey don't play that game.

If you do not wish to believe it, don't believe it. That's your choice. Burying your head in the sand, along with the guys who are honing on the posturing phrases from the Delta MEC of "we can kill any deal", might make you feel like you can disprove the whole thing by creating the slightest impropriety in posturing-only words. If that's what helps you feel better about your position, than I feel even better about mine.

 

[GogglesPisano]

Delta is promising 6,000 aviators pay rises, .

And Delta has 7000+ pilots on the property. It's so obvious now.

 

[400ADude]

If rumors are to be believed, then I'm number 2,202 on the new SWAirTran seniority list. . Don't get all bunched up over rumors.

I'm thinking you're probably number 6100.

 

[SkiFishFly]

Are they asking you to give up more scope??? Hasn't anyone over there seen where that has led them??

 

[BoilerUP]

If Delta pilots and their elected leadership are dumb enough to give away scope, after everything that's happened with small jets and the "portfolio", then they deserve to have their 100 seat flying outsourced.

 

[murano]

I find this hard to believe considering that both airlines are ALPA.

"Game On"

*GASP* Say it ain't so. An ALPA carrier screwing another ALPA carrier? Oh the horror!

 

[Acey]

And Delta has 7000+ pilots on the property. It's so obvious now.

Actually, Delta had roughly 6700-6800 pilots before even the new hires starting coming on board. I believe this is just another case of gross ignorance on the part of the journalist. Even a cursory glance over at airline pilot central would give you a better figure than 6000. I don't think it's deliberate or they would have spelled it out for their even more ignorant readers (including we who waste precious breath taking the time to read through all of their crap).

It could be that Delta is looking for relaxed furlough language, but it's total speculation at this point based on another not-too-reliable media report.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

Guys number one, the number that they are using is active aviators. Not total pilots on the list. There is a huge difference, but that is the number that they have been given.

Two, parts of NWA are for sale and if this deal cannot get done, parts may be bought. MidEx is in this mix as well.

Three, My highly placed sources could be wrong, but the 100 seater is not on the chopping block. If there were to be a relief in traditional scope, it would be for a specified period of time, and all pilots hired to do the flying would be Delta seniority listed pilots.
What they are talking about with scope is our "scope" language in section one that pertains to Merger and Fragmentation. section one of the contract is called scope and that is where this protection lies, hence the name usage.

 

[General Lee]

Rumor has DALALPA giving 100 seat flying to their regionals as a compromise to force the merger without NWAALPA.

This would assure a bigger seniority grab from DAL as they guarantee the death of the nines so that they can get a raise and equity cash.

I find this hard to believe considering that both airlines are ALPA.

"Game On"

I find that hard to believe, and I would be very surprised if Moak allowed 100 seaters at DCI. I think almost every DL pilot would vote that one down.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[samballs]

I find that hard to believe, and I would be very surprised if Moak allowed 100 seaters at DCI. I think almost every DL pilot would vote that one down.

Bye Bye--General Lee

You said the same about 76 seaters

 

[FDJ2]

Rumor has DALALPA giving 100 seat flying to their regionals as a compromise to force the merger without NWAALPA.

Yep, that's a rumor and probably like most not based on any actual information.

 

[RedDogC130]

If rumors are to be believed, then I'm number 2,202 on the new SWAirTran seniority list. . Don't get all bunched up over rumors.

how can you be 2,202 when you get stapled, you will be 6,501.

 

[FlyingDawg]

New rumor it that Republic Airways Holdings just placed a E-190 order. RAH operates Shuttle America aircraft for Delta.

 

[Meiguy]

New rumor it that Republic Airways Holdings just placed a E-190 order. RAH operates Shuttle America aircraft for Delta.

Riiiiggghhhtt...Great time to be placing new aircraft orders and no where to put them. Are you inferring that they will be flown at DAL because of the "relaxed scope". Don't think that will fly. That would be a ballsy move to order a bunch of E-190 before anything was voted on anyways. Not to mention that part of the scope hasn't change and won't change.

 

[retired guy]

Riiiiggghhhtt...Great time to be placing new aircraft orders and no where to put them. Are you inferring that they will be flown at DAL because of the "relaxed scope". Don't think that will fly. That would be a ballsy move to order a bunch of E-190 before anything was voted on anyways. Not to mention that part of the scope hasn't change and won't change.

He implies, you infer.