IXLR8
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This just in ... merger talks continue with "less generous terms."
- Thread starter GogglesPisano
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Superpilot92
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Thats not true, i have been saying it all along and a large number of people i talk with at NWA feel the same. The problem is we need to be focusing on this as a ALPA pilot group not the red-tails vs the widgets! We can all come ahead in this or all get left behind and pissed for the rest of our careers. I dont want that i am sure none of us do. Bottom line is neither MEC has presented this to vote so we havent seen "the deal" we all hear one side of the story. I agree the mudslinging needs to stop!!
MGMT is going to pursue this and either we get in there and have it our way or they are going to line their pockets their way :smash:
GogglesPisano
Pawn, in game of life
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If incentives are taken off the table, what to the DAL pilots gain from this merger?
March 28, 2008, 4:46 pm
Northwest-Delta: We Don’t Need No Stinkin’ Pilots
Posted by Heidi Moore
The airline industry may be a place where good ideas go to die.
The best idea in the industry, for instance, is on the rocks. Delta and Northwest had the unprecedented, and widely heralded, idea to get the blessing of their pilots before agreeing to a merger. Unfortunately, the talks have died, stopped by bickering over which airlines get to call the shots on how pilots rank in seniority. Northwest, desperate to do a deal before a new Justice Department comes in under a new president, has suggested that the two parties jettison the pilots’ prenuptial agreement and give the pilots less favorable financial terms.
Sigh.
Which gets us back to how airline mergers usually work: they don’t. The two airlines strike a deal, and then spend the rest of their lives trying to navigate labor disputes. It’s a long, litigious, ugly process. Look at US Airways and America West, who have spent the two years since their merger in labor hell.
Of course, you would expect Northwest to throw themselves at Delta and promise anything to get this deal done. FTN Midwest Securities analyst Michael Derchin put it best in a Feb. 27 research report, in which he wrote:
The group that has the most to gain from the merger is the [Northwest] pilots and all [Northwest] employees who are paid less than the [Delta] employees and will get an immediate bump up in wages, have a greater ability to fly a wide body aircraft sooner, and get an equity stake in the new [Delta]. [Delta] pilots and management feel because [Northwest] pilots have the most to gain they should compromise on the seniority list. As one pilot said to me, “they can’t have their cake and eat it too.”
Delta looked high-minded for trying to do it another way, and get the pilots onboard from the beginning. But what they’re learning is that the process will be equally ugly no matter when you do it: whether now or later, airlines and their labor unions are just fated to fight.
March 28, 2008, 4:46 pm
Northwest-Delta: We Don’t Need No Stinkin’ Pilots
Posted by Heidi Moore
The airline industry may be a place where good ideas go to die.
The best idea in the industry, for instance, is on the rocks. Delta and Northwest had the unprecedented, and widely heralded, idea to get the blessing of their pilots before agreeing to a merger. Unfortunately, the talks have died, stopped by bickering over which airlines get to call the shots on how pilots rank in seniority. Northwest, desperate to do a deal before a new Justice Department comes in under a new president, has suggested that the two parties jettison the pilots’ prenuptial agreement and give the pilots less favorable financial terms.
Sigh.
Which gets us back to how airline mergers usually work: they don’t. The two airlines strike a deal, and then spend the rest of their lives trying to navigate labor disputes. It’s a long, litigious, ugly process. Look at US Airways and America West, who have spent the two years since their merger in labor hell.
Of course, you would expect Northwest to throw themselves at Delta and promise anything to get this deal done. FTN Midwest Securities analyst Michael Derchin put it best in a Feb. 27 research report, in which he wrote:
The group that has the most to gain from the merger is the [Northwest] pilots and all [Northwest] employees who are paid less than the [Delta] employees and will get an immediate bump up in wages, have a greater ability to fly a wide body aircraft sooner, and get an equity stake in the new [Delta]. [Delta] pilots and management feel because [Northwest] pilots have the most to gain they should compromise on the seniority list. As one pilot said to me, “they can’t have their cake and eat it too.”
Delta looked high-minded for trying to do it another way, and get the pilots onboard from the beginning. But what they’re learning is that the process will be equally ugly no matter when you do it: whether now or later, airlines and their labor unions are just fated to fight.
Superpilot92
LONGCALL KING
- Joined
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- 3,719
Some forum nazi, said it was to "raunchy" I guess a beautiful woman in her underwear bothered him, lame i know.
The bad part is it was way less revealing than my old painted up superchick.I finally agree with what you are saying! BOTH of our MECs SUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
To be honest...I am more affraid of my MEC selling me out than our managment. In my opinion the DALPA has screwed us by putting our opening offer on the table and having the closed door sesions with our mgmt. Now if this is not a scary statement, I don't know what is.
BF surprise here.....
Way to go NW pilots, maybe when this deal is done you'll get nothing and like it!imp:
737
Like I said a couple of weeks ago, expect to hear "that was then, this is now." The transaction framework agreement is dead. It was dead over two weeks ago. NWA management still wants the merger though.
Hey zipper:
Isn't it about time for your afternoon bottle and a nap?
Before you know it, school will be out!
I love it how some twa loser has anything to say regarding seniority integration, since he waived his up for the amr buyout of his company! Give your lawyer a call, he seems to be the only one caring about what you have to say!
Now, don't go away mad, just go away!
737
Don't worry dude you are going to get what u deserve verry soon my man.
Noserider76
Teahupoo
- Joined
- Jul 9, 2004
- Posts
- 789
This is a terrible time to be burning through the cash to put this together. My very unofficial poll says about 75% at DL are against the merger. Now it looks like we've F'ed away the only part that had any redeeming value at all. Management is sure to get the fences they didn't want if they force this deal, especially with no incentives.
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The only management that apparently still wants this merger is NWA. I'm not too sure DAL is interested at this point. DAL maybe looking at different strategic alternatives.
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tomgoodman
Well-known member
- Joined
- Mar 13, 2006
- Posts
- 2,356
Good Cop's turn next
Stand by for RA to say: "OK guys, I managed to stall this take-away for another week, but you have to act now. I've done all I can, and the BOD is about ready to go ahead without giving you anything." If the MECs do agree on a list, this gives them the political cover of having had "a gun to their heads" when the wailing and gnashing of teeth begins.
Stand by for RA to say: "OK guys, I managed to stall this take-away for another week, but you have to act now. I've done all I can, and the BOD is about ready to go ahead without giving you anything." If the MECs do agree on a list, this gives them the political cover of having had "a gun to their heads" when the wailing and gnashing of teeth begins.
johnsonrod
Well-known member
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- Feb 25, 2006
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Superpilot92
LONGCALL KING
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Or you guys are getting played like pawns. This is probably completely a mgmt screwjob and by all accounts you guys are falling for it. Steenland is on his way out so he can come across like he is the bad guy forcing the deal. Mean while RA is going to keep petting you guys hoping you wag your tails. straight out of management play book. Good cop bad cop, buehler?
hockeypilot44
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 26, 2005
- Posts
- 893
It's interesting that NWA management doesn't find NWALPA relevant, let's see if DAL management thinks the same about DALPA.
Played like pawns?
Has any management ever even considered pilots before announcing a merger. The fact that we have even been considered is groundbreaking.
Let's see how this all plays out. So far the only players who seem interested in pursuing this are NWA management and NWALPA.
I expect the next move to be from NWALPA trying to sell their expedited arbitration scheme again.
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