Flexjet Fleet Question

[CX880]

What's the word on the Global Express, I though it was supposed to be in service by Jan. Not enough buyers?

 

[Club ORD FO]

you must be thinking of the 605. that showed up in Jan. There are no plans for any globals.

 

[CX880]

Well a while back I was talking with someone at Flex and they were saying some customers want to fly long distance as in 10+ hours from the States to Asia. I'm pretty sure he said Flex was going to fly 1 or 2 Globals for these customers. I guess it could have been the 605 though.

 

[V1 Rotate]

They did type some people in the Globals, but in the end, they fell through.

 

[Flex-ible]

I heard the 5000 is the most likely large aircraft to be added - but that they will not introduce it unless they have at least five fully sold. They figure that to be the minimum fleet size to be practical.

 

[johnsonrod]

How many 605s are you guys expecting in 2008? Are the 605 crews separate from the 604 crews because of the Pro Line 21? Are any newhires getting placed on the 605?

 

[doylehargraves]

The day flexjet gets globals to compete with netjets, the sun will freeze instantly. They are too scared to make such a big commitment because they are small thinkers.

 

[Club ORD FO]

How many 605s are you guys expecting in 2008? Are the 605 crews separate from the 604 crews because of the Pro Line 21? Are any newhires getting placed on the 605?

604 and 605 is same type, you just need differences training. so yes, a new hire can be placed in the 608/605 fleet. not exactly sure on the number showing up this year. somewhere in the 5-10 range I think. total ballpark guess.

 

[CL300Pilot]

Close. The company acutally, from what I was told by DG, needs 5 globals to support just one. We keep hearing rumor of a potential managed aircraft, but we all know how rumors go.

I heard the 5000 is the most likely large aircraft to be added - but that they will not introduce it unless they have at least five fully sold. They figure that to be the minimum fleet size to be practical.

 

[Ludicris]

604 and 605 is same type, you just need differences training. so yes, a new hire can be placed in the 608/605 fleet. not exactly sure on the number showing up this year. somewhere in the 5-10 range I think. total ballpark guess.

Is the 608 a new model? Never heard of it.

 

[Club ORD FO]

Is the 608 a new model? Never heard of it.

oh sorry, typo. meant 604

 

[On Your Six]

604 and 605 is same type, you just need differences training. so yes, a new hire can be placed in the 608/605 fleet. not exactly sure on the number showing up this year. somewhere in the 5-10 range I think. total ballpark guess.

Interesting that pilots would be cross-trained on both given that the Pro Line 21 is quite different from the 604 systems. Why would Netjets need to separate pilot groups based on Pro Line 21 (e.g., Citation Encore vs. Encore+)?

 

[Guitar Guy]

Why would Netjets need to separate pilot groups based on Pro Line 21 (e.g., Citation Encore vs. Encore+)?

It was a joint decision between the company and the union training folks to make those separate fleets. Having flown the Ultra, the Encore and the EP at NJA, I'm quite surprised that the FAA allows a common type rating between those three models: different avionics and FMS's, limitations, systems, memory items, etc.

But I think NJA took the right approach separating the fleets. I was dual-qualified on the Ultra and the Encore at one point and there were a lot of differences between those two planes to keep straight.

 

[CA1900]

Why would Netjets need to separate pilot groups based on Pro Line 21 (e.g., Citation Encore vs. Encore+)?

What Guitar Guy said.

There are a lot of things that are legal that we just don't do in the interest of safety. Separating fleets with substantially different avionics is one example of going above and beyond the letter of the law. Not going into certain mountainous airports at night (even when legal) is another way.

It's more expensive to operate that way, but I believe it's worth the added cost.

 

[flynlow]

Sorry to bring this back to the top. Can any of you Flex guys tell me what the company uses to decide what fleet you will be placed in upon getting hired? Is it just the need to fill empty seats? Or does it have to do with gateways or past experience? I may be heading down to interview and was just curious about the chances of getting into the 604/605's v/s the Lears. I'd be NY/NJ based by the way if that makes any difference. Thanks.

 

[DirtyBeech]

It's all about the need. My sim partner was a
furloughed American pilot who also flew 141's and 17's in the guard. He was given right seat Learjet just like me. A guy in the class behind us was a retired major captain who was also in the Lear test program. CL300 for him. It's all about need, so don't take it personal if they don't show you the door to a Challenger. Besides, all upgrades are to the Lears, and they'll work you hard in the 300.

 

[flynlow]

Thanks. Not really worried about which airplane although I really enjoy flying international. Any ideas of how many overseas trips the 604/5's do? Do the 300's do any? I don't mind working hard. Thanks again.

 

[Flex-ible]

Sorry to bring this back to the top. Can any of you Flex guys tell me what the company uses to decide what fleet you will be placed in upon getting hired? Is it just the need to fill empty seats? Or does it have to do with gateways or past experience? I may be heading down to interview and was just curious about the chances of getting into the 604/605's v/s the Lears. I'd be NY/NJ based by the way if that makes any difference. Thanks.

Base makes no difference. Hard to tell if experience makes much difference either. Mostly, filling company needs, and right now that means Lear 45 or Challenger 300. Of the last 50 new hires, 45 were in one of those two fleets.

IMO you don't want the 605 right now. Fleet is not growing. November hires are still at the bottom of the seniority list.

 

[flynlow]

Any idea if the 300's are doing overseas work? I realize it's not the perfect airplane for it but it is possible from what I've seen.

 

[jetdrvr]

Yes, they do international work. How often, i'm not really sure of the answer.