Airtran??

[Pilot124]

Looking for some info on Airtran. I know you guys just voted down the last proposal (good for you) and that shows unity. How is life there, pay, QOL, moral, equipment and so on. Please, just Citrus pilots who have have something constructive to say good or bad. Thanks 124

 

[Spidey]

Looking for some info on Airtran. I know you guys just voted down the last proposal (good for you) and that shows unity. How is life there, pay, QOL, moral, equipment and so on. Please, just Citrus pilots who have have something constructive to say good or bad. Thanks 124

...Good...

 

[RadioClash]

717 is a nice airplane. I left a regional/commuter a few years ago and have no regrets coming over here. Most of the guys you fly with are great. Pay could be better for FO's. After 2 years here I hold a better schedule than what I did after 7 years at my previous company, more opportunities to move trips around. Don't have a contract in front of me but first year FO pay is $44.xx/hour, second year is $55.49 and 3rd is $60.59. Can't remember the rest and can't remember captains pay off the top of my head.

Insurance is high, for a family its around $350+ a month, depending on which plan you go with. We have a B fund, and a 401k (not company matched) you are on your own with the 401k.

New union leadership voted in, things should get better in that dept.

Trips on the 717 vary from 2 legs to 5 legs a day, not sure about the 737. I get anywhere from 14-17 days off a month and credit around 90 hours, sometimes more. Not sure how reserve is these days.

Hope this helps.

 

[Lear70]

Reserve has gotten worse because of the latest decision not to allow reserve pilots to drop reserve days. The good news is that means you will get more money. The bad news is you are stuck with 11/12 days off until you get off reserve. Trading out of a weekend for reserves isn't happening much lately and reserve is running 7-8 months.

Life as a lineholder as previously mentioned is fairly nice, although the trips have become much less commuter-friendly and hotel quality has gone downhill during negotiations as well.

Company is taking the stance of "we'll keep chipping away at their contract during negotiations so that just getting back the things they lost will seem like an improvement and they'll waste negotiating capital on it". Luckily the Association is aware of the tactic so hopefully its impact will be minimized.

The quality of life over a regional is undeniable, but they still have a long way to go. Personally if you could get picked up at CAL or Delta I'd take it over AAI. Possibly NWA or UAL if you lived in one of their bases and it worked out for you because of that (better long-term pay prospects because of widebody flying).

Upgrade is looking at 6-8 years for someone hired right now, plan accordingly.

I expect AAI's next T.A. will include a much better pay bump for F/O's, slightly better for CA's (closer to COLA), fix some scheduling and QOL issues with similar improvements to the B fund and 401(k) match.

There are better places to go, but there are also much worse places to be. Good luck!

 

[Sun Devil 2000]

Reserve has gotten worse because of the latest decision not to allow reserve pilots to drop reserve days.

TRUE

The good news is that means you will get more money.

FALSE: There are too many reserves right now and we are not flying at all. If credit gets above 80 hours scheduling is removing reserve days and cutting credit. So in essence more days off but, you don't get to choose them!

The bad news is you are stuck with 11/12 days off until you get off reserve. Trading out of a weekend for reserves isn't happening much lately and reserve is running 7-8 months.

TRUE

The quality of life over a regional is undeniable, but they still have a long way to go.

JURY IS STILL OUT!

Personally if you could get picked up at CAL or Delta I'd take it over AAI. Possibly NWA or UAL if you lived in one of their bases and it worked out for you because of that (better long-term pay prospects because of widebody flying).

VERY WISE STATEMENT!

 

[curtis46]

Been at A/T for 3 1/2 years;December schedule 19 days off 95 hours credit pay, all hollydays off.
What's make A/T a good place to be is the people you'll have the pleasure to work with.
There's also a large group of pilots who refused to sacrifice the junior guys by rejecting the TA,so guys like you can join,knowing that the first year pay is still livable along with a reserve system which makes the envy of most legacy carriers.
The only problem in my opinion is the apathy of our pilots group toward our union tasks.
I personnally volunteer by making myself available at the office one day per month ,so i can help in anyway possible.i heard there's about another 40 guys who offered their time also.
I'm confident A/T will be a place where we all will be proud to hang out our hat.
If you decide to join, welcome on board.

 

[Lear70]

The good news is that means you will get more money.

FALSE: There are too many reserves right now and we are not flying at all. If credit gets above 80 hours scheduling is removing reserve days and cutting credit. So in essence more days off but, you don't get to choose them!

Oh that sucks, I hadn't heard they were URP'ing people again... Sorry to hear that.

I came from PCL, was getting 13 days or so off and half of it was uncommutable. At AAI I took a 40% pay cut but got 16 days off regularly and was able to trip trade to make all of it commutable until the last 3 or 4 months I was there.

Definitely better QOL, although F/O pay sucks. When you get about 50 lineholders under you (not the reserve guys, but actual lineholders) you'll start getting most or all of your weekends off through creative trip trading (not SAP, just regular trades if you use the FLICA alerts and a good Windows-based phone), and your life will improve.

 

[curtis46]

BTW i'm a commuter with an household comprise of a wife 3 kids a german shepperd and a parrot(still trying to figure out how to make them fit as an avatar)!!
I take proud of serving our union,a family thing.
Didn't mean to highjack your thread,i had to post somewhere.

 

[Spidey]

Looking for some info on Airtran. I know you guys just voted down the last proposal (good for you) and that shows unity. How is life there, pay, QOL, moral, equipment and so on. Please, just Citrus pilots who have have something constructive to say good or bad. Thanks 124

Curtis46 is the kind of person that makes this place great! If you are ready to roll your sleeves up and work, this is a good place. Your app goes to the bottom of the pile of 17000 or near the top with recommendations. Good Luck!

 

[SkiFishFly]

FALSE: There are too many reserves right now and we are not flying at all.

Then why the heck is it dang near impossible for me to drop/swap in open time? I get the "insufficient reserves" message 99.999 percent of the time.


To the original post - life is pretty good. Pay could definitely be better. Good people to work with. Quite a few of the Captains were not willing to sell the FOs out and helped us vote down the recent TAs.

 

[Sun Devil 2000]

Then why the heck is it dang near impossible for me to drop/swap in open time? I get the "insufficient reserves" message 99.999 percent of the time.


To the original post - life is pretty good. Pay could definitely be better. Good people to work with. Quite a few of the Captains were not willing to sell the FOs out and helped us vote down the recent TAs.

Guess it depends on the seat and the Airplane.

 

[jke406]

Curtis46 is the kind of person that makes this place great! If you are ready to roll your sleeves up and work, this is a good place. Your app goes to the bottom of the pile of 17000 or near the top with recommendations. Good Luck!

OK, I'll bite. 17,000 applications? come on now. what percentage are in any way competitive?

honestly, I'm sure you'd agree he'd be "near the top" of the pile if he meets the mins, even without a recommendation.

 

[TV9Driver]

i've been here almost 3 years, average 15 days off and about 85 hours a month. I am able to get commutable lines every month.

As far as the pilot group sticking up for the f/o's - i'm not 100% sure of that one. The vote was approx. 60%/40%. So that means that about 600 pilots where willing to sell us down the river. (i don't have the exact numbers in front of me)

Also, most airlines have the "1 percenters" - the 1% of idiots working there. Here, i'd put that number at about 5%. I've noticed there are alot more "colorful" captains here than at the other airlines i've been at.

Insurance is abysmal (sp) and f/o pay is definitely subpar.

All that being said, AAI has a lot of potential - and like Curtis said, if you actively take part and help out, it will make this place alot better.

just my 2c

 

[RIDETHELIGHTING]

Don't forget there were some first year FOs that also sold us down the river. Wanting a bigger raise their second year. Very short sighted.

 

[Lear70]

I doubt too terribly many of the F/O's voted Yes. Especially given that the average raise was $5-$7 an hour and they'll be F/O's twice as long as they were initially promised.

All the same, I know a lot of CA's voted No based on F/O pay, health insurance, and Reserve rules alone and a lot of those CA's weren't affected by most of those things, so I greatly appreciate every single NO vote cast by those guys!

AAI will likely be a great place to work, but it's going to take a LOT of angst to get it there; management's certainly not likely to do the right thing for the employees... even though we ALL know they can afford it.

 

[PRINCE AKEEM]

Another benefit is that the 'slow jams' on the C Concourse are quite nice!

 

[Murphy]

Of the people polled in my new hire class from two years ago, 5 NOs and 3 YEAs so right in line with the overall vote.

 

[Daddy]

I hear you guys have a TA...any details?

 

[Citrusflyer]

I hear you guys have a TA...any details?

You're dreamin' dude. No TA.....we're not even talking.

 

[tubelcane]

What reason would any fo at Airtran possibly have to vote for either of those TA's? 3 in one class! I haven't polled mine, but I hope there weren't 3 yes votes in it.

 

[PCL_128]

Looking for some info on Airtran. I know you guys just voted down the last proposal (good for you) and that shows unity. How is life there, pay, QOL, moral, equipment and so on. Please, just Citrus pilots who have have something constructive to say good or bad. Thanks 124

As someone who lives in base, life is pretty good. Like Lear, I took a sizable paycut to come here from Pinnacle, but the increase in QOL, even as a reserve pilot, has been worth it. For the commuters on reserve, it's probably a different story since we lost the ability to drop reserve days. They end up spending time in a crashpad for a big chunk of the month, especially since reserve FOs just aren't flying that much right now. Reserve is running around 6-8 months for 717 FOs, not sure about 737. Figure a few extra months of build-up lines after that before holding a hard line.

I'm expecting anywhere from 4-6 years for upgrade. At current FO payrates, that wouldn't be fun, but we should have a new TA within the next couple of years that will boost the FO rates. Captain rates are already at about industry-standard for SNB equipment, so the next TA should boost those to pretty good rates also.

I disagree with Lear about preferring CAL, NWA, or UAL over here. CAL has just hired too many people already. Seems like a big furlough-fodder risk there. NWA is just an absolutely miserable company. I can't imagine putting myself through a few decades of misery at that place. UAL just scares me with the talk of mergers and financial issues. Doesn't seem like a stable place to be. If you live in any of their bases, though, then it would definitely be preferred. Living in base is always the top priority in my mind.

Basically, most of the people here are great to fly with, the stews are younger and not pissed off all the time, you get a decent amount of time off, and the pay will probably be improving. With the new union leadership, I think this is a great place to go with a good future.

 

[PCL_128]

Don't forget there were some first year FOs that also sold us down the river. Wanting a bigger raise their second year. Very short sighted.

I don't know of any. This first year FO voted NO!!!

 

[jke406]

OK, this has to be asked since no one else has: if DAL is hiring heavily, why would anyone willing to fly out of ATL prefer to work for Tranny?

 

[jneely]

OK, this has to be asked since no one else has: if DAL is hiring heavily, why would anyone willing to fly out of ATL prefer to work for Tranny?

Delta Exec Says Carrier Cutting Costs
Tuesday December 4, 2:44 pm ET
By Harry R. Weber, AP Business Writer Delta President Says Airline Cuts Costs to Offset Fuel Prices

ATLANTA (AP) -- A Delta Air Lines Inc. executive said Tuesday the nation's No. 3 carrier is freezing hiring in certain areas as part of a cost-cutting move aimed at dealing with high fuel prices that will weaken the company's fourth-quarter results.
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​

Delta shares fell nearly 5 percent in afternoon trading. Shares of several other major carriers also fell.
President and Chief Financial Officer Ed Bastian said at the Calyon Securities U.S. Airline Conference in New York that high fuel costs will "dampen" Delta's operating margin -- the ratio of operating income to sales revenue, expressed as a percentage -- in the quarter ending Dec. 31.
He said Delta's current projection for operating margin is flat to minus 2 percent. Previously, the company projected an operating margin of 3 percent to 5 percent for the quarter. For all of 2007, Bastian said Delta is still projecting an operating margin of around 6 percent.
The company did not provide any updated profit, sales or earnings per share projections for the fourth quarter.
Delta shares fell 93 cents, or 4.8 percent, to $18.65 in afternoon trading Tuesday. Standard & Poor's reiterated its hold rating on Delta's stock.
Cost cuts will be key to helping Delta deal with higher fuel prices, Bastian said, noting that jet fuel prices are up nearly 50 percent since the beginning of 2007. He suggested there could be job cuts, but he didn't offer any numbers or specifics.
Bastian said Delta will cancel or reduce flying of some aircraft. Capacity for 2008 is expected to still be up 2 percent, reflecting a decline in domestic capacity of 4 percent to 5 percent and an increase in international capacity of 15 percent, Bastian said. By 2009, Bastian said, 40 percent of Delta's flying will be on the international side.
Delta has initiated a hiring freeze on any non-customer facing positions. It also wants to improve self-service kiosk options for customers and increase the number of people buying tickets online, Bastian said.
Delta is still evaluating whether to sell any noncore assets, including regional feeder carrier Comair Inc., Bastian said. No decision on Comair has been made, he said.
Meanwhile, Bastian offered little insight into whether Delta will combine with another airline.
Bastian said that the board of the Atlanta-based company is still evaluating whether to enter into a deal.
Bastian said the value to shareholders of remaining a standalone carrier versus a combination are being considered. He did not say when the review would be complete, and analysts at the conference did not ask him to elaborate.
Amid increased speculation about industry consolidation and Delta's possible role in it, two of the airline's executives have left in the last three weeks: vice president of operations Joe Kolshak and vice president of corporate communications Jeff Battcher.
Delta has said Bastian would keep his dual role of president and CFO instead of the airline hiring a separate CFO.
Last month, Delta denied reports that it was talking to UAL Corp.'s United Airlines about a combination. Since then, it has said little about the issue, and United's top executive recently refused to fully address the issue.



hows that for an answer. jeff neely.

 

[PCL_128]

OK, this has to be asked since no one else has: if DAL is hiring heavily, why would anyone willing to fly out of ATL prefer to work for Tranny?

Depends on what you want to do. If short-haul domestic is your kind of flying, then the schedules at AirTran on the 717 are typically better than the -88 schedules at DAL. If you want to fly widebodies or international, then go to DAL. Personally, I couldn't stand the idea of sitting in a cockpit for 16 hours going from JFK to Mumbai in a 777, but to each his own.

 

[jke406]

Depends on what you want to do. If short-haul domestic is your kind of flying, then the schedules at AirTran on the 717 are typically better than the -88 schedules at DAL. If you want to fly widebodies or international, then go to DAL. Personally, I couldn't stand the idea of sitting in a cockpit for 16 hours going from JFK to Mumbai in a 777, but to each his own.

Fair enough...

 

[jke406]

hows that for an answer. jeff neely.

every airline is dealing with higher fuel prices and a softening of domestic market. it would appear that a company concentrating almost exclusively on domestic flying (air tran) is in worse shape than one that's diversified.

so I guess I'd have to say that's not much of an answer at all.

 

[PCL_128]

it would appear that a company concentrating almost exclusively on domestic flying (air tran) is in worse shape than one that's diversified.

I doubt it. We have the lowest seat-mile costs in the business, so I doubt we're in any more trouble than anyone else.

 

[jke406]

I doubt it. We have the lowest seat-mile costs in the business, so I doubt we're in any more trouble than anyone else.

true, but...
low seat mile cost = low salary

 

[jneely]

my point was they are talking about hiring freezes and job cuts less than a year out of bankruptcy. whether that is pilots remains to be be seen.
jeff neely