Piedmonsters: US vs THEM w/ Jr. Mans , etc

[Sig]

Regarding junior mans on days off, junior man extensions, and premium pay:

DO NOT. DO NOT. DO NOT allow scheduling to offer you extra pay for working on a day off without a JRM stamped crewcard in your hot little hand. In other words, they're buying themselves out of the contract mandated JRM cap. Worse yet, you're selling me and the rest of us out for doing it.

JRM vs. premium pay? SAME THING, folks- just one isn't contractually driven. They're offering double premium pay? Screw that. Get capped, and enjoy the holidays off. The extra four hours of double premium is not worth NOT getting JRM capped.

Never. Ever. EVER go below 10 days off. I'm getting a little peeved at some people picking up flying- but wanting it to remain "hush hush" while they do it. Conscience aside, why would you do that? You might as well accept a 16 hour duty day and fly the last leg.

Another point regarding DH:

Someone, ostensibly a gate agent, asked for clarification on whether a crewmember gets paid while occupying the jumpseat on a deadhead.

This is irrelevant.

DO NOT. DO NOT. DO NOT occupy the jumpseat on a deadhead to accommodate revenue passengers. This is a huge no-no. You're giving the company free money twice- first, you're only at 50% pay. Second, they know they have to bump revenue and compensate the displaced pax- this is planned money they'll spend. Third, if they build these schedules with DHs, they pay the price. You never have to occupy a JS- period. The only way I could justify doing that is to get non-revs on board that can't sit up front. Don't let a gate agent bully you- you have a paid seat, you will occupy that seat, and anything short of that will be treated as if the agent denied you boarding as a must ride.

/rant

 

[G2T]

Another point regarding DH:

Someone, ostensibly a gate agent, asked for clarification on whether a crewmember gets paid while occupying the jumpseat on a deadhead.

This is irrelevant.

DO NOT. DO NOT. DO NOT occupy the jumpseat on a deadhead to accommodate revenue passengers. This is a huge no-no. You're giving the company free money twice- first, you're only at 50% pay. Second, they know they have to bump revenue and compensate the displaced pax- this is planned money they'll spend. Third, if they build these schedules with DHs, they pay the price. You never have to occupy a JS- period. The only way I could justify doing that is to get non-revs on board that can't sit up front. Don't let a gate agent bully you- you have a paid seat, you will occupy that seat, and anything short of that will be treated as if the agent denied you boarding as a must ride.

Well said, applies to just about every company, and is something that a lot of people don't understand/think about. Nice Post.

 

[jellynuts]

i got 7 babies and a rap career to support... im flyin my ass off i don't care what you say!

 

[Sig]

im flyin my ass off i don't care what you say!

HA!

The reason I posted that was for the benefit of the FNGs and FYIGMs. I heard this from a captain:

"Shhh, I know I go down to 8 days off... but dam! 800 more bucks? Screw the contract."

Sig not happy rest of day.

 

[jellynuts]

HA!

The reason I posted that was for the benefit of the FNGs and FYIGMs. I heard this from a captain:

"Shhh, I know I go down to 8 days off... but dam! 800 more bucks? Screw the contract."

Sig not happy rest of day.

you obviously didn't catch my sarcasm. i rarely say something serious on this board.... i know things are tense here at piedmont scarelines but just try and relax a lil bit!

 

[NCFlyer]

Another point regarding DH:

Someone, ostensibly a gate agent, asked for clarification on whether a crew member gets paid while occupying the jumpseat on a deadhead.

This is irrelevant.

DO NOT. DO NOT. DO NOT occupy the jumpseat on a deadhead to accommodate revenue passengers. This is a huge no-no.

You never have to occupy a JS- period.

Sig,

I'm not trying to burst your bubble but this been gone over and over before.

According to our CBA Section 8.B.2

"All deadheading will be booked on a "flight crew must ride" basis. The company MAY REQUIRE (emphasis mine) a pilot to occupy the jumpseat if his passage would result in a denied boarding of a revenue passenger."

Volunteer - never!

If asked, you are obligated by our CBA to do so.

Anyone telling you that it is a voluntary thing up to the individual pilot is incorrect.

Has anyone been called by or to SBY for refusing? I don't know. I do know that I try to honor my side of the agreement even if we must force the company to do so at times.

Please don't believe everything that you hear unless it can be shown to you in the contract. Things aren't always what we think or what we want or what we wish they were. Also just because someone said that they did this or didn't do that and never got in trouble for it doesn't make it so. Just do your best to follow the agreement.

 

[Sig]

"All deadheading will be booked on a "flight crew must ride" basis. The company MAY REQUIRE (emphasis mine) a pilot to occupy the jumpseat if his passage would result in a denied boarding of a revenue passenger."

That's three names on my list, none of which are a gate agent. Whose company? It's a problem on other airlines- not so much on our metal.

May is a month.

*And now I'm foaming at the mouth peesed off. Yet another piece of crap they can use against us. It just dawned on me who is signing that gate agent's paycheck... as in (pay)checkmate on me. DANG.

*** Another idea: who owns that jumpseat anyway?

 

[Thug Life]

Well said, applies to just about every company, and is something that a lot of people don't understand/think about. Nice Post.

Plus if you take the JS you might bump a pilot trying to get home. Make the company buy you a ticket. Jumpseating is a privilage and is not to be used for crew movement!

 

[I_Love_Lamp]

Can you ask the captain to deny you the jumpseat so you have to sit in the back?

I miss the old 'monster.

Not so much.

 

[70-SS]

Can you ask the captain to deny you the jumpseat so you have to sit in the back?

I miss the old 'monster.

Not so much.

No just tell the company that the Captain said no you cannot ride, he is going to file a greivance and it is not your problem.

 

[doug_or]

Spot on for the first half, and I would never accept the jump if it meant bumping a jumpseater getting to work/home, but why not take it if it means letting someone paying my paycheck get home? I will look out for my fellow employees first, but as whiney as they are, passengers are people too.

 

[NCFlyer]

That's three names on my list, none of which are a gate agent. Whose company? It's a problem on other airlines- not so much on our metal.

May is a month.

*And now I'm foaming at the mouth peesed off. Yet another piece of crap they can use against us. It just dawned on me who is signing that gate agent's paycheck... as in (pay)checkmate on me. DANG.

*** Another idea: who owns that jumpseat anyway?

Man, Sig you need to chill out.

You can play all the name game semantics you want about "Who the company is?", however I am almost certain the company, read that PDT management located in SBY, will say that any gate agent is acting on behalf of PDT whether that agent is actually a PDT employee or employed by another company.

Another thing, the contract used to say that the company may "ask" a pilot to occupy the jumpseat. Most of the pilots interpreted that to mean that the pilot had the right to refuse. So in the new contract the language was changed to "require" thereby leaving no doubt what was meant.

You ask, "Who owns the jumpseat?"

My simple answer is the "company" owns the jumpseat. Here again you can argue all day long if you want, but 1 thing for certain is that it isn't the pilots, union, or captain. Pilots have the privilege of using the jumpseat, at the captain's discretion of course, in compliance with the FAR's, FOM, and any other applicable regulations. If you don't believe me ask some of the Delta pilots who for many years were denied the privilege to ride even their own cockpit jumpseat or the PDT captain that received a 30 day suspension for putting a teenager on "his" jumpseat.

The entire jumpseat is irrelevant on the 100 anyway. The only way you could put another passenger in the cabin would be to have almost 0 bags or a cabin full of kids. I saw a 100 leave AGS a couple of months ago with 35 pax / 0 bags because it needed alternate fuel for CLT.

 

[Sig]

Man, Sig you need to chill out.

You got that right.

Agenda dropped, banner-waving pilot has been schooled and for the record: Boy, was I wrong. Oh- that wasn't semantics up there, that was a stark realization of the scope of Piedmont Airlines as a company. We're everywhere.

What's still got my boo-tocks clenching is the schedulers' latest scheme, and folks are falling for it. Worse yet, pilots are doing dumb things in the name of FYIGM.

This guy remind you of anyone? Your uncomfortably correct explanation of things leads me to believe you're a certain contract legend.

 

[NCFlyer]

Plus if you take the JS you might bump a pilot trying to get home.

It happens.

Jumpseating is a privilege and is not to be used for crew movement!

Jumpseating is indeed a privilege and as such if abused that privilege could be lost, and sorry to inform you but according to PDT's CBA it can be used for crew movement.

 

[Sig]

according to PDT's CBA it can be used for crew movement.

Boo. Hiss.




... true.

 

[NCFlyer]

You got that right.

Agenda dropped, banner-waving pilot has been schooled and for the record: Boy, was I wrong. Oh- that wasn't semantics up there, that was a stark realization of the scope of Piedmont Airlines as a company. We're everywhere.

What's still got my boo-tocks clenching is the schedulers' latest scheme, and folks are falling for it. Worse yet, pilots are doing dumb things in the name of FYIGM.

This guy remind you of anyone? Your uncomfortably correct explanation of things leads me to believe you're a certain contract legend.

My appologies if I was too harsh, didn't intend to come across mean.

I was just trying to set the record straight so that you or others don't put your neck on the chopping block for a silly misunderstanding. You know well so and so said that I could or didn't have to, and now you are doing the carpet dance in SBY.

As for pilots, we are our own worst enemies. Not understanding our rights according to the CBA, letting the company run all over us with intimidation. That's why we must read, understand, and stand up for the rights afforded us in the CBA. We also must help the many new hires that have no idea whether what crew scheduling is telling them is accurate or not.

I have no idea which legend you are referring too, I'm sure that it's not me. I am just a single pilot that wants to know what I am entitled to and what I should expect out of the company. When I don't get what I believe I am rightfully entitled to, I will use all means available to get what is rightfully mine.

 

[Sig]

Harsh? No way, man- do not apologize for that. Like the famous quote goes... the truth only hurts if it should. I think and speak in weird recursive/referencing ideas. A close look at some of my posts even shows anagrams in them.

AGREED: WE ARE OUR OWN WORST ENEMIES. And you seem to have a pretty danged good grip on gripes. We could all learn a lot from you.

 

[lear24]

Make the company buy you a ticket. Jumpseating is a privilage and is not to be used for crew movement!

Jumpseating on airlines other than your own is a privilege, the company whose jumpseat it is has full authority to put who they want in it, with the captain having the right to deny. You're thinking of being moved on another airline and asked by your company to ask for a jumpseat instead of them 'buying' you a ticket. NC is right, it is allowed, it was accepted by the pilot group, the same pilot group who is willing to fly below 10 days off, fly broken airplanes with the double secret verbal logbook method, etc.

 

[nethan]

Over at your Red Headed Sibling Airline the CBA says pretty much the same thing. However, we have all agreed (not in writing though) that "the company" is just that. So if scheduling calls and says, you are booked in the jump seat that is where we go. If it is just the gate agent asking, then it is up to the individual. I'd say it's about a 50/50 split as those who will volunteer to take it to get an extra person on and those who won't. Of course, since we got the nice shiny jets, it's actually an issue from time to time over here. We have had a few issues with guys taking it and bumping a jumpseater off. That has lead to some edumacation for all parties, and as far as I know the problem is mostly solved.

 

[WSurf]

Well unless its a Dash 8/300 there is really no point to worry about it!

Only way your getting in the Jumpseat in a 100 is if there 6 kids in the back!