ALPA votes 18 to 1 to throw out AAA/AWA award!

[DOVPILOT]

I am so disappointed with ALPA. WTF First they give up on age 65 then they do this? We had a legal process. It was followed and now because some old guys want to cry to their buddies they want to change the rules after the fact?

Us younger guys need to get more involved in the union.

yeah sleeves remember there will come a time when you get old and some F'N punk is trying to take your job. When you turn 60, I hope you have the liberty to retire and not have to work because some D!CK CEO took all your bennies....

 

[vtwin]

Stole your retirements? I've gone from a five year upgrade to total stagnation for the last three years. Meanwhile all the recalls have gone out east. Oh yeah, and you guys still have jobs. Talk about windfalls, go look in the mirror. On top of that you guys have the top 500 slots. The contract the company just offered is 80% improvements for the East. It's no wonder you guys got the industries worst contract shoved down your throats. You wouldn't negotiate. It's all "mine, mine, mine, gimme, gimme, gimme". All we have to do out west is sit back and watch you guys destroy yourselves. You sure are good at it.

Recalls go out east because that is where the retirements are.

Top 500 slots where always ours since the widebody flying was ours.
Those pilots would be gone in 3 years, oh what an eternal wait that would be,
oh the horror, huh Hpilot? I guess it is not enough for you that the east got fenced off from our own widebody flying also by Nicolau.

Total stagnation? does not sound like your bringing a lot of horsepower
to your integration arguement, seems I heard that used against us east guys...If you got to keep your position on the list, and you won't, that would really take care of your horrible and awful long 3 year stagnation would it not? Such an eternity. Windfall. You sound like a brat kid Hpilot.

We still have jobs? Oh thanks, you want those also I guess. Guess we had some career expectations after all, huh? George N.

80% improvements? What on earth....

"Mine, mine, mine, gimme, gimme, gimme", I can hear your voice cracking Hpilot.

That sounds like you returning the loot you recently stole from us AAA pilots
through this botched arbitration. 14-1, interesting. Stop kidding yourself, east retirements for east pilots, end of story, you dig?

No combined list, no joint contract, no quick upgrade for Hpilot until this gets sorted, just ask most east guys. You can count on east doing everything they can to scuttle this list lacking conditions and restrictions.

 

[TWA Dude]

I imagine you would be feeling much better if they told AAA to pound sand 14-1 though, huh? But they didn't did they? Hmmm, maybe they saw some merit in our opposition to your windfall? 14-1, interesting times.

All you have to do is put yourself in Prater's shoes. He's trying to calm down one pilot group. He's already stated that the EC must follow ALPA Merger Policy so there's no fear there. If I were him I'd try to broker a behind-the-scenes agreement without the EC getting involved. USAirways was very possibly a goner in 2005 so I think ALPA can handle the loss of a pilot group in defense of its set-in-stone bylaws.

 

[TWA Dude]

Total stagnation? does not sound like your bringing a lot of horsepower to your integration arguement, seems I heard that used against us east guys...

The stagnation came when airplane deliveries stopped after the merger announcement.

 

[Hpilot]

Recalls go out east because that is where the retirements are.

Top 500 slots where always ours since the widebody flying was ours.
Those pilots would be gone in 3 years, oh what an eternal wait that would be,
oh the horror, huh Hpilot? I guess it is not enough for you that the east got fenced off from our own widebody flying also by Nicolau.

Total stagnation? does not sound like your bringing a lot of horsepower
to your integration arguement, seems I heard that used against us east guys...If you got to keep your position on the list, and you won't, that would really take care of your horrible and awful long 3 year stagnation would it not? Such an eternity. Windfall. You sound like a brat kid Hpilot.

We still have jobs? Oh thanks, you want those also I guess. Guess we had some career expectations after all, huh? George N.

80% improvements? What on earth....

"Mine, mine, mine, gimme, gimme, gimme", I can hear your voice cracking Hpilot.

That sounds like you returning the loot you recently stole from us AAA pilots
through this botched arbitration. 14-1, interesting. Stop kidding yourself, east retirements for east pilots, end of story, you dig?

No combined list, no joint contract, no quick upgrade for Hpilot until this gets sorted, just ask most east guys. You can count on east doing everything they can to scuttle this list lacking conditions and restrictions.

-Total stagnation came after the merger to the titanic. We were hiring 20-30 a month before.
-Yes, 80%, read the thing
-Oh so you guys want to negotiate now after the fact. Sorry sonny it doesn't work that way. We could care less if you rot out East. Don't think that you'll be safe either. Like I said we'll sit back and watch you guys keep hurting yourselves. What are you masochists.

 

[Hpilot]

All you have to do is put yourself in Prater's shoes. He's trying to calm down one pilot group. He's already stated that the EC must follow ALPA Merger Policy so there's no fear there. If I were him I'd try to broker a behind-the-scenes agreement without the EC getting involved. USAirways was very possibly a goner in 2005 so I think ALPA can handle the loss of a pilot group in defense of its set-in-stone bylaws.

As long as we don't back down. Letting these sleaze bags push us around would be like capitulating to terrorists. It's not right.

 

[d328pilot]

"Mine, mine, mine, gimme, gimme, gimme", I can hear your voice cracking Hpilot.

This from a US Air pilot to an HP pilot?? Pot meet Kettle.

 

[Itsallsogood]

[The AWA delusion continues. Play fair? You stole our retirements from us, Nicolau should have utilized conditions and restrictions to prevent that from happening.

14-1(awa) saw a reason to look further into this award, I guess they are not playing fair.]


What a fuxing moron. WhhAAAAAAAAAAA........ You stole ours....... WWWHHHAAAAAAAAA Play Fair? Whhaaaaaaaaaaaa You, Mr. Tool, are an idiot. It was 18-1 to delay the inevitable for you numbnutz to back down. Delusional? Denial? Anger? Hostile? Bitter? You name it. It is Not AWA.

 

[Itsallsogood]

Quit please

 

[vtwin]

All you have to do is put yourself in Prater's shoes. He's trying to calm down one pilot group. He's already stated that the EC must follow ALPA Merger Policy so there's no fear there. If I were him I'd try to broker a behind-the-scenes agreement without the EC getting involved. USAirways was very possibly a goner in 2005 so I think ALPA can handle the loss of a pilot group in defense of its set-in-stone bylaws.

What kind of behind the scenes agreement? You agree we got screwed and you have to give a little then?

Loss of a pilot group? Please tell me your not participating in the TWA lawsuit against ALPA and trying to defend them on this integration?

Can you say hypocrite.

 

[vtwin]

-Total stagnation came after the merger to the titanic. We were hiring 20-30 a month before.
-Yes, 80%, read the thing
-Oh so you guys want to negotiate now after the fact. Sorry sonny it doesn't work that way. We could care less if you rot out East. Don't think that you'll be safe either. Like I said we'll sit back and watch you guys keep hurting yourselves. What are you masochists.

No, there will be no negotiating, just demands made and ultimatums now.
"Sonny?" Real cute, considering I am an old geezer out east.

If we rot out east, so will you, remember where the revenue comes from.
We can't get hurt any worse than we are already by this lopsided award and we intend to fix it. Maybe we will get hurt maybe not, kinda keeps you up
at night huh? What a dancing partner you have.

 

[vtwin]

The stagnation came when airplane deliveries stopped after the merger announcement.

I know, you guys use stupid arguments why can't we?

 

[xanderman]

Umm... You need to read the actual merger policy...

By the way, we expected him to follow the loosely scripted merger policy of no windfalls for either group and, to preserve career expectations also.

While I can understand you are upset you need to realize that the merger policy very clearly states that "no windfalls for either group at the expense of the other." Now if you cannot realize or simply refuse to acknowledge that your company was very near a charbroiled status then this argument will fall on deaf ears. What I mean is this. How can you argue we stole your retirements when your company was not going to provide them anyhow? Career expectations?!? What were they specifically. About what you are doing now right? Not one pilot can say they are going to be in X seat flying X equipment in 10 years let alone 1. Specifically we see that Nicolau saw it this way as well. Windfall? Okay I'll let you call it that. But frankly there was no windfall especially at the expense of your pilot group. You guys were done. Face it. The reality is that all of us are in the same position we were in before the merger was consummated. Narrowbody CPT's are still narrowbody CPT's etc. So I guess you will continue to argue that you had all those retirements coming and that was going to get eveybody back on property and your F/O's were all going to upgrade. Well last time I checked nothing has gone to plan in this career. If you guys can't admit that you were hanging on by a very fine thread then to he!! with you all. I could not care less when it comes to you or your bloated egos...

 

[vtwin]

While I can understand you are upset you need to realize that the merger policy very clearly states that "no windfalls for either group at the expense of the other." Now if you cannot realize or simply refuse to acknowledge that your company was very near a charbroiled status then this argument will fall on deaf ears. What I mean is this. How can you argue we stole your retirements when your company was not going to provide them anyhow? Career expectations?!? What were they specifically. About what you are doing now right? Not one pilot can say they are going to be in X seat flying X equipment in 10 years let alone 1. Specifically we see that Nicolau saw it this way as well. Windfall? Okay I'll let you call it that. But frankly there was no windfall especially at the expense of your pilot group. You guys were done. Face it. The reality is that all of us are in the same position we were in before the merger was consummated. Narrowbody CPT's are still narrowbody CPT's etc. So I guess you will continue to argue that you had all those retirements coming and that was going to get eveybody back on property and your F/O's were all going to upgrade. Well last time I checked nothing has gone to plan in this career. If you guys can't admit that you were hanging on by a very fine thread then to he!! with you all. I could not care less when it comes to you or your bloated egos...

You really believe your garbage don't you? Wrong on every point. Your not benefiting from east retirements in this so called award? Really? Who is paying the price for those? I submit east pilots stapled below you. Your own CEO never undergirded your delusion that you saved us, never. Now your rabid with entitlement. You got lucky with some lunatic who ratified your
greed inside a framework that should work for everybody and a whole lot of
pilots out east are really p-ssed. Apparently 14-1(awa) national ilk know
that their flight pay loss might be in jeopardy if they don't right this wrong.

This list will NEVER stand and is not worth the paper it is printed on, so like I said before, don't go buying that captains house. Take S_itsall to the park
and throw frisbee with him or something else.

For arguements sake even if you saved us and you did not, do we owe you?
You wanna get paid. You where hanging on to a thread also, a training camp for Southwest, and a scab operation down under, so the hell with you also.

 

[Guppiedriver]

The ALPA Executive Board votes 18-1 to throw out the arbitration award. Details to follow........

Tell the truth now. This is actually what happened: The ALPA Executive Council, made up of the ten ALPA Executive Vice Presidents and the four National officers, voted 13 to 1 on Thursday night to order the two parties to meet and discuss the Nicolau award, reporting back to the EC by June 30th.

The arbitration will stand, time to move on.