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Any news from Washington from ASA/alpa?

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ASARJMan said:
There has to be a TA first. There is not one at this time. The MEC and CNC are only doing what the majority want.
Click to expand...

Really?

If so, then why is an MEC member running around saying that he believes the current table position would pass by 60%? If the MEC believes that a MAJORITY would pass it, why hasn't it been put to vote? Let me guess... the MEC thinks they have to wait in spite of us, because we'll just vote yes on the first piece of crap to come our way. We're stupid, and they know what's best for us, right?

Is that how y'all define "doing what the majority wants"?
 
John Pennekamp said:
Really?

If so, then why is an MEC member running around saying that he believes the current table position would pass by 60%? If the MEC believes that a MAJORITY would pass it, why hasn't it been put to vote? Let me guess... the MEC thinks they have to wait in spite of us, because we'll just vote yes on the first piece of crap to come our way. We're stupid, and they know what's best for us, right?

Is that how y'all define "doing what the majority wants"?
Click to expand...


What is there to vote on? They do not have a TA on the entire contract, yet, and there are probably 10 or more open issues. When they get a TA, and it passes the MEC sniff test, then and only then will we be able to vote.
 
Speedtape said:
What is there to vote on? They do not have a TA on the entire contract, yet, and there are probably 10 or more open issues. When they get a TA, and it passes the MEC sniff test, then and only then will we be able to vote.
Click to expand...

Why don't you go ahead and tell us what those open issues are, and what the MEC's vs. the company's positions are on them. We're waiting.

As far as I'm concerned, all we need is scope, QOL, and COLA. This was never meant to be a money contract!
 
John Pennekamp said:
Why don't you go ahead and tell us what those open issues are, and what the MEC's vs. the company's positions are on them. We're waiting.

As far as I'm concerned, all we need is scope, QOL, and COLA. This was never meant to be a money contract!
Click to expand...

The company doesn't want to pay any COLA, none at all. The company doesn't want to agree to the scope, or any scope actually, that we need. And if you want retro, we're far apart there too. the company did finally address retro by offering $2 million, but that's far from acceptable.
 
John Pennekamp said:
Really?

If so, then why is an MEC member running around saying that he believes the current table position would pass by 60%? If the MEC believes that a MAJORITY would pass it, why hasn't it been put to vote? Let me guess... the MEC thinks they have to wait in spite of us, because we'll just vote yes on the first piece of crap to come our way. We're stupid, and they know what's best for us, right?

Is that how y'all define "doing what the majority wants"?
Click to expand...

OK, once again, when did this particular MEC member conduct this survey? I wasn't polled. Anybody out there polled by this MEC member?

There are still open issues on the table. That's why there is no TA for members to vote on. Just for you JP, the company wants no COLA, no scope, and little retro.
 
The MEC is going to try and get everything that they can. This is done by pushing for everything you can until the last minute of negotiations before a release for self help durring the cooling off period. Unfortunately we probably won't get that opportunity- this thing will drag out as it has for quite some time.

One of two things needs to happen here- either cast the company proposal out for a vote, or do a comprehensive survey that allows 100% of the pilot group to participate. Also, our MEC should be educating our pilots on what is attainable here in order to help pilots!

Expressjet got their contract durring an expansion boom- CoEx wanted a deal done to grow. Regional growth is now over, and it will be a fight for survival from here on. The only growth anyone will see is at the expense of another regional. In short, we missed the pay boat.

It isn't what SkyWest has made or is making, but what they are willing to give us. That's what we are worth. Do you really think that SkyWest is going to give us 5 years worth of retro when we:

-Delayed the contract negotiations by waiting for a more stable time following September 11th.

-Have only been owned by SkyWest for two years. Why are they going to pay us for the three years of protracted negotiations they couldn't influence.

So we could strike and force the upper hand, but we aren't going to strike. Why??? Because it isn't going to be allowed in the political environment that exists today! We are, at best, going to be released after November of 2008. GET A DEAL DONE FOLKS!!!!!!!
 
ASARJMan said:
OK, once again, when did this particular MEC member conduct this survey? I wasn't polled. Anybody out there polled by this MEC member?
Click to expand...

Maybe you should be asking the MEC member that question. In fact, maybe all pilots should. Y'all voted for him, right? Hold them accountable!

ASARJMan said:
There are still open issues on the table. That's why there is no TA for members to vote on. Just for you JP, the company wants no COLA, no scope, and little retro.
Click to expand...

For the record, I have little interest in retro. A signing bonus would be nice. I'm very interested in improving our working conditions and providing job security. Being the highest paid CRJ pilots in the DCI portfolio seems like a very stupid move for job security. COLA on top of industry standard pay would be acceptable to me. Sell the raises for scope and be done with it.
 
VeeOne said:
The MEC is going to try and get everything that they can. This is done by pushing for everything you can until the last minute of negotiations before a release for self help durring the cooling off period. Unfortunately we probably won't get that opportunity- this thing will drag out as it has for quite some time.

One of two things needs to happen here- either cast the company proposal out for a vote, or do a comprehensive survey that allows 100% of the pilot group to participate. Also, our MEC should be educating our pilots on what is attainable here in order to help pilots!

Expressjet got their contract durring an expansion boom- CoEx wanted a deal done to grow. Regional growth is now over, and it will be a fight for survival from here on. The only growth anyone will see is at the expense of another regional. In short, we missed the pay boat.

It isn't what SkyWest has made or is making, but what they are willing to give us. That's what we are worth. Do you really think that SkyWest is going to give us 5 years worth of retro when we:

-Delayed the contract negotiations by waiting for a more stable time following September 11th.

-Have only been owned by SkyWest for two years. Why are they going to pay us for the three years of protracted negotiations they couldn't influence.

So we could strike and force the upper hand, but we aren't going to strike. Why??? Because it isn't going to be allowed in the political environment that exists today! We are, at best, going to be released after November of 2008. GET A DEAL DONE FOLKS!!!!!!!
Click to expand...


Very well said.

I would only add that since ALPA and the company are EQUALLY responsible for dragging out negotiations for 2.5 years each, the issue is split and we don't deserve retro any more then they should be required to pay it.
 
ASARJMan said:
Guess you didn't read what I wrote Will. The company is offering NO COLA!, NO SCOPE! Pay on the 200 is still not up to industry standard.
Click to expand...

That's the best you can do, Mike. Still mad that I called you out?

If you want to believe I'm will, that's fine. If I was him, then I suppose I wouldn't have to come here to ask these questions, as I'd already know the answers. Good thing I know how to contact him... he's actually very accessible and holds some very "interesting" opinions on many issues ASA and otherwise. Regardless, none of that really changes the issue at hand, and your cheap shots fall far far short. More testiment to the sagging credibility of this MEC in office when that's the best its biggest supporters can offer.

I read and comprehended your post. I see that there is no COLA and no scope. The MEC had an opportunity to change that and refused. There could have been a TA, but now there will be nothing for quite a while.

I noticed you didn't mention retro in your response. I'll assume you agree with me on that point.
 
John Pennekamp said:
That's the best you can do, Mike. Still mad that I called you out?

If you want to believe I'm will, that's fine. If I was him, then I suppose I wouldn't have to come here to ask these questions, as I'd already know the answers. Good thing I know how to contact him... he's actually very accessible and holds some very "interesting" opinions on many issues ASA and otherwise. Regardless, none of that really changes the issue at hand, and your cheap shots fall far far short. More testiment to the sagging credibility of this MEC in office when that's the best its biggest supporters can offer.

I read and comprehended your post. I see that there is no COLA and no scope. The MEC had an opportunity to change that and refused. There could have been a TA, but now there will be nothing for quite a while.

I noticed you didn't mention retro in your response. I'll assume you agree with me on that point.
Click to expand...

Are you still speaking in the 3rd person? Did your alter ego tell you that he only got 9 votes? He must have been in touch with the pilot group! Do you answer your own questions when you ask them? Do you like to hear yourself talk? Did you have imaginary friends when you were in your formulative years? Were you, or are you a Thumb Sucker? Did you have a special blankee? Have you heard of the Napolean Complex?
 
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Speedtape said:
Are you still speaking in the 3rd person? Did your alter ego tell you that he only got 9 votes? He must have been in touch with the pilot group! Do you answer your own questions when you ask them? Do you like to hear yourself talk? Did you have imaginary friends when you were in your formulative years? Were you, or are you a Thumb Sucker? Did you have a special blankee? Have you heard of the Napolean Complex?
Click to expand...

Oh I'm so hurt. I might go cry... sniff, sniff.

How about this. Why don't you man up and sign your name to your personal attacks? Will you? It's real easy to be a tough guy sitting behind a computer isn't it?

W. Faruzzi
 
ASARJMan said:
The company's offer on retro is inadequate. And you do know what they say about "ass u me" don't you? :)
Click to expand...

On that we'll have to agree to disagree. I insist that if we hold out for full retro, we'll still be doing this two years from now. Aint going to happen.
 
John Pennekamp said:
On that we'll have to agree to disagree. I insist that if we hold out for full retro, we'll still be doing this two years from now. Aint going to happen.
Click to expand...

What the company offered is inadequate. Maybe we won't get full retro, maybe we will, or maybe we'll meet in the middle. We'll see, but it has to play out, and right now the company ain't playing. Hopefully the NMB will release us or give us a proffer in a week or two which will put more pressure on Delta, oops, I mean ASA to get this done.
 
John Pennekamp said:
On that we'll have to agree to disagree. I insist that if we hold out for full retro, we'll still be doing this two years from now. Aint going to happen.
Click to expand...

I would agree with that one. It can't be justified with what was going on after 9/11 and a couple of years, thereafter, in the economy and the industry.
 
I just switched channels and I think I'm seeing same thing on this one.

The Jerry Springer Show!
 

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