letter from mesa...

[CFI2766]

Mesa Air Group announced recently that the company will guarantee pilots who
come through the PACE program at San Juan College a repayment to allow for a
guaranteed opportunity for Captain Upgrade to occur within 3 years of employment
with the company. If the pilot has not upgraded within 3 years, due to no fault
of his/her own, the pilot will be reimbursed beginning the first month they go
over their 3rd year anniversary ONE-TWELFTH (1/12) of the cost (flight) of the
PACE program. This would continue for every month until the end of their 4th
year.

Hi!

Mesa Air Group will recruit hundreds of pilots in 2007! To help meet their
requirement for pilots, San Juan College is offering a shorter 15 week PACE
program and revised the minimum qualifications for the program. I know you will
agree that Mesa is quite serious about recruiting pilots who possess a training
advantage that will likely help them succeed as first officers at the airline.

If you dream about making this career move, the timing couldn’t be better.

You want to put yourself in a position to succeed at the airline. With the PACE
program, you have a guaranteed interview with the company when you successfully
complete your training.

Mesa has confidence in the training and the pilots who come from our programs.
So much so, that the company will guarantee you an opportunity to upgrade to
captain within three years AND pay you back in some measure each month if you
don’t! I’ve been recruiting pilots for nearly 20 years for Mesa here at San
Juan College. This is an amazing opportunity – you could actually recover a
portion of your training costs IF you don’t upgrade at three years. Even if
you got $1,000 back at the three years/one month mark, you would be ahead!

Call or email me if I can answer questions for you – I wanted to pass this
information along to you as soon as I got the word.

Regards,


R L Shropshire
Aviation Coordinator
www.flightcareers.com

 

[eaglefly]

These desperate characters will tell anything necessary to sucker clueless saps in the door.

LOL !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[samballs]

My buddy got a email from that grwat comapany saying mins were 500 and 100 and will also accept close to these!!!

 

[Shaheen]

My buddy got a email from that grwat comapany saying mins were 500 and 100 and will also accept close to these!!!

Aaaaaaannnnndddddd....what's wrong with that?

Is it hurting because you (and the previous writer) didn't get your chance to fly for a regional airline at when you were 500/100?

Don't tell me that at those minimums, you'd have politely declined an offer to fly a twinjet/turboprop to continue working as a CFI.

 

[samballs]

Aaaaaaannnnndddddd....what's wrong with that?

Is it hurting because you (and the previous writer) didn't get your chance to fly for a regional airline at when you were 500/100?

Don't tell me that at those minimums, you'd have politely declined an offer to fly a twinjet/turboprop to continue working as a CFI.

I Was already flying a citation at 500 hrs. And yes my buddy turned down the offer because, well he has common sense, unlike the group you guys have there, you know the group willing to do anything mang says and work for nothing. but Oh thank god you guys gave JO a vote of no confidence, no one cares he makes the investors tons of money because guys are his little slaves

 

[doh]

My only comment is that you need to get this in writing (contractual). Otherwise, JO has shown a willingness to "interpret" that would make me nervous. Shaheen, you have to agree with that.

 

[Soverytired]

My only comment is that you need to get this in writing (contractual). Otherwise, JO has shown a willingness to "interpret" that would make me nervous. Shaheen, you have to agree with that.

Truer words were never written on the hub . . . .

If it's not in writing (and in triplicate, notarized, witnessed, and "lawyered"), it will become a "I never said that" or "You misunderstood".

Guaranteed.

 

[AvroJockey]

Aaaaaaannnnndddddd....what's wrong with that?

Is it hurting because you (and the previous writer) didn't get your chance to fly for a regional airline at when you were 500/100?

Don't tell me that at those minimums, you'd have politely declined an offer to fly a twinjet/turboprop to continue working as a CFI.

I didn't even apply to Mesaba until I had my ATP...didn't think I had the experience. 500 hr pilots shouldn't be flying transport category jets, or turboprops for that matter...PERIOD! This is a disaster waiting to happen. Sure, they can fly, but anyone can learn how to fly these things. The infrastructure/culture at most of these regionals can't continue to support these pilots without an eventual accident.

 

[Oakum_Boy]

1/12th after three years for a total of four years if through no fault of your own you don't get an upgrade.

WTFO.

 

[CopilotDoug]

1/12th after three years for a total of four years if through no fault of your own you don't get an upgrade.

WTFO.

Yeah...requires that you be a little more intelligent than a Mesa employee to interpret

 

[Flyer1015]

Anyone notice the key word?

"of the cost (flight) of the PACE program."

PACE may cost $10k-$12k but the flight cost is only the Baron portion, which if you spend 10 hours (which is about average), comes out to:

10 hours Baron @ $264/hr = $2640

10 hours Instructor @ $30/hr = $300

Total average flight cost: $ 2940.

Your monthly refund: 2940/12 = $245 !


Whoop de dooo!!! You get back $245 back per month! SIGN ME UPPP!!!:smash:

 

[siucavflight]

1/12th after three years for a total of four years if through no fault of your own you don't get an upgrade.

WTFO.

I dont understand how this can confuse you, if it does how are you able to calculate crossing restrictions?

 

[Oakum_Boy]

I'm not confused. What confuses me is why anyone would work at MESA. That letter just brings to light how desperate they are. What kind of dirtbag, fine print carrot are they waving? Who is gonna jump up and down to go to MESA now? Just like the $500 signing bonus to get hired at X regional. Beer money for a couple weeks? You've got to be kidding.

Construction work offers better than MESA.

What if your dog ate your limitations? Is that fault of your own?

 

[CopilotDoug]

I'm not confused. What confuses me is why anyone would work at MESA.

Lack of research and education of the airline industry

 

[CX880]

This is a disaster waiting to happen. Sure, they can fly, but anyone can learn how to fly these things. The infrastructure/culture at most of these regionals can't continue to support these pilots without an eventual accident.

That's why before I fly I check the ATP website to make sure I'm not on one of their partner's airline. It would be interesting to see what's going to happen next year, what kind of crazy mins or bonuses regionals are going to come up with, god forbid they should raise the salaries.

 

[Flyer1015]

That's why before I fly I check the ATP website to make sure I'm not on one of their partner's airline.

Are you talking about Allatps?

In that case, you need to "avoid":

American Eagle
ASA
Colgan Air
ExpressJet
Pinnacle
PSA
Skywest
TSA


Oh wait, that's pretty much all the regionals...

 

[Shaheen]

I Was already flying a citation at 500 hrs. And yes my buddy turned down the offer because, well he has common sense, unlike the group you guys have there, you know the group willing to do anything mang says and work for nothing. but Oh thank god you guys gave JO a vote of no confidence, no one cares he makes the investors tons of money because guys are his little slaves

So, your buddy turned down the offer by an airline, huh.

Of course no offer could be made until he applied, interviewed, and passed the interview process successfully, right. So, if he had so much common sense not to fly for a regional airline at low hours, why did he apply?

Sounds like both of you got turned down by Mesa.

By the way, I don't fly for Mesa. Mesa is a regional airline with challenges like any other regional airline. While you're on your 'high horse', look up a thread where Mesaba pilots are also being bashed. It will help you lighten up your load.

Hope this helps.

 

[relief tube]

Mesa Air Group will recruit hundreds of pilots in 2007! To help meet their
requirement for pilots, San Juan College is offering a shorter 15 week PACE
program and revised the minimum qualifications for the program.

All the more reason to keep my wife and parents off of non-revving on Mesa. I just hope United and Delta know of the kids that are flying their planes.

 

[CopilotDoug]

By the way, I don't fly for Mesa.

But you wish you did. How diplomatic to say Mesa has challenges like other Regionals. Sounds like watered down talk for 'Mesa Sucks'

 

[hyperboy]

Relief tube

What a tool! You sound so dumb and ignorant. Mesa is safe, open your eyes. Purdue program we are not the only ones. You just think it is cool to bash MESA. Not cool. We are all whores. You went to the regional that called you first.

Funny or were you the one that negotiated a 4 million dollar contract ,with a signing bonus and an option of two years and a no trade clause?

 

[Wanna Fly!!]

All I ever see here is a bunch of people whining about getting a job that pays money. Do you pilots think you deserve more and more? Get another job in another industry that pays better then. Go become a stockbroker on wall street and make $100,000 a year and be happy. Go get a degree and get paid more. I am a career person and am thinking about making a transition to do my life long dream- flyin aircraft for whatever it pays. I know I won't make $hit to start and it will take a long time to make any $$. However, it has been a passion even since I got on that first aircraft. I'm still sorting through the best way to do it and at 38, I cannot afford to make the wrong choice. All I see is people complaining about the mesa guys, and the people complaining about instructins, so I don't know which way to turn now. I have a degree in aviation management and have worked in this industry for about 15 years now and thought it was professional until I started reading all of the whiners out here. Come on guys- at least there is some $ to be made. Remember, nothing good is free. Anyone got any good advice- and don't rip on everything, I won't read it!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I know there is good and bad about everything, but when you whine all of the time, you look unprofessional. Sometyimes I think I'm reading posts from a bunch of 18 year olds here.

 

[DashCojones]

All I ever see here is a bunch of people whining about getting a job that pays money. Do you pilots think you deserve more and more? Get another job in another industry that pays better then. Go become a stockbroker on wall street and make $100,000 a year and be happy. Go get a degree and get paid more. I am a career person and am thinking about making a transition to do my life long dream- flyin aircraft for whatever it pays. I know I won't make $hit to start and it will take a long time to make any $$. However, it has been a passion even since I got on that first aircraft. I'm still sorting through the best way to do it and at 38, I cannot afford to make the wrong choice. All I see is people complaining about the mesa guys, and the people complaining about instructins, so I don't know which way to turn now. I have a degree in aviation management and have worked in this industry for about 15 years now and thought it was professional until I started reading all of the whiners out here. Come on guys- at least there is some $ to be made. Remember, nothing good is free. Anyone got any good advice- and don't rip on everything, I won't read it!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I know there is good and bad about everything, but when you whine all of the time, you look unprofessional. Sometyimes I think I'm reading posts from a bunch of 18 year olds here.

...You'll fit right in at Mesa's PACE program.

 

[bizzum]

All I ever see here is a bunch of people whining about getting a job that pays money. Do you pilots think you deserve more and more? Get another job in another industry that pays better then. Go become a stockbroker on wall street and make $100,000 a year and be happy. Go get a degree and get paid more. I am a career person and am thinking about making a transition to do my life long dream- flyin aircraft for whatever it pays. I know I won't make $hit to start and it will take a long time to make any $$. However, it has been a passion even since I got on that first aircraft. I'm still sorting through the best way to do it and at 38, I cannot afford to make the wrong choice. All I see is people complaining about the mesa guys, and the people complaining about instructins, so I don't know which way to turn now. I have a degree in aviation management and have worked in this industry for about 15 years now and thought it was professional until I started reading all of the whiners out here. Come on guys- at least there is some $ to be made. Remember, nothing good is free. Anyone got any good advice- and don't rip on everything, I won't read it!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I know there is good and bad about everything, but when you whine all of the time, you look unprofessional. Sometyimes I think I'm reading posts from a bunch of 18 year olds here.

Its not whining, it's called being treated as a professional. 8 days of a month, not getting paid for canceled flights that is out of your control, not getting paid what you actually fly, only scheduled block, and for what you get paid for, you get low pay. Oh and you will be commuting because after you moved into base, it closed and now you are away from home for 6+ days at a time. It is frustrating, especially when the companies tell you constantly how "much" you cost and you need to be "competitive," as the management teams speed away in their new BMW's and brag how they have "500 million extra cash to spend" Is that fair? NO! Finally the industry seems to be turning around, with the bottom feeder regionals not being able to fill classes. The "dream" of being an airline pilot takes about 3 months to wear off, so your comment about "not caring what I fly or for what pay" will change fast. It's that attitude that has caused this abuse of people now, because people were willing to work for what ever pay and work rules so they could fly that "shiny RJ." Good luck with your career, just don't forget that there are others that are not on their second career, and want things to change.

 

[Flyer1015]

bizzum, very well said! If we ever meet, first round is on me!

 

[Wanna Fly!!]

Bizzum,
all I am asking for is that I get the truth here and not with a bunch of bad language, that's all. I've been in the Military- you want to talk about low pay, vacations, being away from the family? I also made it throught 4 years of college- no pay, no vacation, people treat you like garbage all day long. So, once again- this is about a dream, not a shiny damn jet! I coul care less if I "flew rubber dog$hit out of Hong Kong", or whatever. I would like to simply make a career out of it. I've been in this industry for long enough (Gulfstream Aircraft) and know the industry and it's problems. But when I get on a post like this and simply ask for advice I get this "...You'll fit right in at Mesa's PACE program" from someone, agaibn I wonder of the quality of people here. I am a skeptic of the Mesa program, thus the questions. But, if I cannot get an intelligent answer from anyone here without the politics involved, then I'll keep researching. If I ever talk to Mesa, then I'll put these questions to them and see. I'm not an id 10 T and can usually sniff out the crap.
So, again I ask- what would some of you recommend to get the dream of flying whatever for whomever!
It appears that nobody would do this job as all I see is complaining here. Can anyone provide any good words, or are all of you so unhappy in this career that you would t=rather do something else? If so, what and whay are you not pursuing it? If I'm 38 and looking at doing something for the love of it, then why don't the unhappy ones here do it? Believe me, BMW's and the other "Stuff" does not make life as money is not the answer to your unhappiness. I've been in aviation for a while with a degree and I'm not making the $100,000 that some of you think you deserve for flying. The industry is not what it used to be because of 9/11, but it's getting better, very slowly, but it is.

 

[rtmcfi]

Wanna Fly-
Perhaps not everyone on here is a incurable whiner. Perhaps you are doing the correct thing by checking out this site to see what people who actually live this lifestyle think. The next step for you is to pay attention to what these folks are saying. You are not the only career changer. You are not the only one with a dream. The people posting here are not all that different from you. Take their advice. Learn from their mistakes. Don't discard there posts as mere whining. If you love flying, get your ratings and fly a Cessna. The quickest cure for that love is a job at a regional. Above all, if you foolishly fail to consider all that you have read, don't say you were not warned.

 

[Wanna Fly!!]

rtmcfi-
Now that's what I am looking for here. Again, at 38 With a dream may be stupid, but I've been rich and poor and am looking to see if this dream is even worth it. But when Bizzum puts up this as experience-
A/C Flown: DHC-8 CL-65 Barbie Jet
Ratings: The usual
Curr Position: F/O
Total Time: alot
Posts: 121
Should I take him seriously? Why wouldn't you put your credentials up here? I also see alot of 1/2 naked women (not that I don't like them), but the maturity factor plays in here. So aI wonder what to believe. If I hear that the best way to go is 172 land first, then CFI for the next couple of years, so be it. Just like all of you, looking for the best way and gaining valuable information from those here working hard to make a living is invaluable to me!! I remember way back in the day at Metro State and Alpha Eta Rho how we were supposed to be professionals. All I see here is the opposite and think that some pilots here are like the rest of this country wanting a plasma on the wall and a beamer in the 3 car with 10,000 sq ft just like Paris Hilton. So I don't know, but thatnks for the informationa ll of you.

 

[bizzum]

rtmcfi-
Now that's what I am looking for here. Again, at 38 With a dream may be stupid, but I've been rich and poor and am looking to see if this dream is even worth it. But when Bizzum puts up this as experience-
A/C Flown: DHC-8 CL-65 Barbie Jet
Ratings: The usual
Curr Position: F/O
Total Time: alot
Posts: 121
Should I take him seriously? Why wouldn't you put your credentials up here? I also see alot of 1/2 naked women (not that I don't like them), but the maturity factor plays in here. So aI wonder what to believe. If I hear that the best way to go is 172 land first, then CFI for the next couple of years, so be it. Just like all of you, looking for the best way and gaining valuable information from those here working hard to make a living is invaluable to me!! I remember way back in the day at Metro State and Alpha Eta Rho how we were supposed to be professionals. All I see here is the opposite and think that some pilots here are like the rest of this country wanting a plasma on the wall and a beamer in the 3 car with 10,000 sq ft just like Paris Hilton. So I don't know, but thatnks for the informationa ll of you.

What do you want to know about me? Here is a start. I have been at the regional level for 3yrs now, 2 airlines, and have over 3,000/hrs. What do you want to hear about the airlines? My previous post is about mesa, and it is all true. The management stuff I put in there is also true of most regionals and majors. You wanted to know about life as an airline pilot, what I wrote about sums it up. The part I take offense too is that part about working for whatever pay to live your dream. How would you like it if I rolled into your office and told your boss that I would do YOUR job for half of what you got paid? Its not easy to just get out of the industry, as I love to fly. I also have a avit degree, which is about as useless as it comes outside of aviation. This job has the potential to be great again, so, right now if you want that rosy picture painted of life as an airline pilot, you will not get it from me. If you choose not to listen to me, that is your deal, but you asked for advice.

 

[OzBushWhacker]

Believe it or not flying rubber doggie do out of hong kong pays a fair amount of cash! Even more if the tail is brown..

You career change guys have been the bane of flying for a living for years.

 

[Flyer1015]

rtmcfi-
Now that's what I am looking for here. Again, at 38 With a dream may be stupid, but I've been rich and poor and am looking to see if this dream is even worth it. But when Bizzum puts up this as experience-
A/C Flown: DHC-8 CL-65 Barbie Jet
Ratings: The usual
Curr Position: F/O
Total Time: alot
Posts: 121
Should I take him seriously? Why wouldn't you put your credentials up here? I also see alot of 1/2 naked women (not that I don't like them), but the maturity factor plays in here. So aI wonder what to believe. If I hear that the best way to go is 172 land first, then CFI for the next couple of years, so be it. Just like all of you, looking for the best way and gaining valuable information from those here working hard to make a living is invaluable to me!! I remember way back in the day at Metro State and Alpha Eta Rho how we were supposed to be professionals. All I see here is the opposite and think that some pilots here are like the rest of this country wanting a plasma on the wall and a beamer in the 3 car with 10,000 sq ft just like Paris Hilton. So I don't know, but thatnks for the informationa ll of you.

You had asked about Mesa and their PACE program, and people gave you their opinion about Mesa.

Listen to what others said about the QOL at Mesa.

Imagine you've got an IAD-LGA leg, scheduled for 1 hr 15 minutes block. At IAD, you are in a ground delay for 1 hour. Then you finally takeoff, due to congestion, you hold in the air for 30 minutes (on top of the flight time it takes to get from IAD-LGA). You land at LGA, and have to wait another 45 mints before you finally make it into a gate.

Total time spent in the CRJ: 1+1.25+.5+.75 = 3.5 hours

Total time you get paid for that flight: 1.25 hours (your scheduled block).

Mesa doesn't do block or better in that regards. That's just one example of their bad QOL.

Almost every other regional does block or better... Eagle, XJT, Skywest, etc.

So why don't you just go there? You'll be happier at the end of the day.