Frontier reaches TA with pilots

[USARET]

Frontier Airlines Reaches Tentative Agreement With Frontier Airline Pilots Association
Thursday January 4, 4:21 pm ET Four-Year Contract Approved by Union Board of Directors; to Be Voted on by Membership in Mid-February
DENVER, Jan. 4 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- Frontier Airlines (Nasdaq: FRNT - News) and the Frontier Airline Pilots Association (FAPA) today announced a tentative agreement on a new collective bargaining agreement. If approved by FAPA membership, the new four-year agreement would amend the previous five-year contract signed in May 2000.
This tentative agreement is a tremendous step forward for both our pilots and the Company as we collectively prepare ourselves for the strategic growth that lies ahead," said Jeff Potter, President and CEO of Frontier Airlines Holdings, Inc. "Equally as important, this agreement also represents the ever-present cooperation that exists between Frontier and our pilots. They are a tremendous asset to this Company and we are grateful that we continue to be aligned in the future success and longevity of the airline."
"Frontier pilots are an integral part of the growth and success of Frontier Airlines," said Captain Jeffrey Thomas, President of FAPA. "This agreement provides significant improvement to our pilots' retirement benefits, preserves our scheduling and work rules, and improves the job protections our pilots have earned through their contributions to Frontier. The new agreement will continue to provide Frontier with industry leading pilot productivity as well as one of the most competitive crew operating costs in the industry. We appreciate the time and effort that FAPA representatives as well as Frontier management put into this process and I am confident that we have reached an agreement that meets the needs of the Company and our pilots." The tentative agreement will be presented to the pilot group for ratification in mid-January with approval from the pilot group expected in mid-February. If approved, it is expected that the agreement would become effective around March 1, 2007.

Any details?

 

[Green]

"The new agreement will continue to provide Frontier with industry leading pilot productivity as well as one of the most competitive crew operating costs in the industry."

That about sums it up....

why are Frontier pilots involved in concessionary bargaining? The industry is well into recovery and each pilot group coming into negotiations is expecting a significant raise. Is this a case of low balling the market in exchange for job security?

 

[StaySeated]

That took all of ten minutes.

 

[PCL_128]

"Frontier pilots are an integral part of the growth and success of Frontier Airlines," said Captain Jeffrey Thomas, President of FAPA. "This agreement provides significant improvement to our pilots' retirement benefits, preserves our scheduling and work rules, and improves the job protections our pilots have earned through their contributions to Frontier.

Notice he doesn't mention anything about pay here. That's not a good sign.

 

[pipe]

Not bashing at all here but providing significant improvement to that retirement program could mean a gold watch. The retirement was that bad.

PLEASE GUYS, DO NOT TAKE A PAY CUT. I have spoken personally with Thomas on several occasions. He actually believes that the F9 pilots have ironclad scope protection. I've lost mine before, but I could't convince him that it was possible. I think he would give up the farm for a promise from Potter that the Lynx thing won't hurt anyone.

Taking a pay cut to "protect" jobs will be just as futile as UA pilots taking cuts to save the pension.

I don't have a dog in the fight, but I do have many friends there and know the situation and the players well.

NO PAY CUTS. You take one every year without COLA increases anyway.

PIPE

 

[jetalc]

Do you guys know something we don't? Where was there mention of a pay cut? Even we haven't seen the TA, and you guys are rushing to slam it. Please wait and see. Nobody's going to "give the farm away"...sheesh...

 

[Green]

Well anything other than a payraise is, in fact, a pay cut when you consider inflation and cost of living, etc. Now if there had been a payraise I'm sure your CEO would have announced it. His gushing enthusiasm for the TA would raise my eyebrows if I was a F9 pilots.

 

[F9 Driver]

AP
Frontier Reaches Agreement With Pilots
Thursday January 4, 6:42 pm ET
Frontier Airlines Reaches 4-Year Contract Deal With Union Representing Pilots
DENVER (AP) -- Frontier Airlines Holdings Inc. and the union representing its pilots said Thursday they have reached tentative agreement on a new four-year contract.
The pact makes significant improvements to retirement benefits and job protections, which were the key issues for the pilots, said Jeffrey Thomas, president of the Frontier Airlines Pilots Association, which represents about 650 pilots.

In a telephone interview, Thomas said the negotiations were not traditional in the sense of a hefty pay hike. "It was generally kind of a lateral move on pay" with minor cost-of-living adjustments, he said.

"It addresses a lot of the issues," Thomas said. "We're realistic about the nature of what the industry has been through in the past few years and we want to maintain the competitive structure cost-wise for the company."

The agreement, approved by the union's board of directors, will be put to the pilots for a ratification vote with a decision expected by mid-February. If approved, it would replace a contract that expired in May 2005.

"This tentative agreement is a tremendous step forward for both our pilots and the company as we collectively prepare ourselves for the strategic growth that lies ahead," Jeff Potter, Frontier's president and chief executive officer, said in a statement.

Frontier's stock closed up 4 cents at $7.28 a share Thursday on the Nasdaq Stock Market. In the past year, it has traded between $5.66 a share and $9.30 a share.

Denver-based Frontier operates a hub at Denver International Airport, serving 55 destinations.

 

[lowecur]

"The new agreement will continue to provide Frontier with industry leading pilot productivity as well as one of the most competitive crew operating costs in the industry."

That about sums it up....

why are Frontier pilots involved in concessionary bargaining? The industry is well into recovery and each pilot group coming into negotiations is expecting a significant raise. Is this a case of low balling the market in exchange for job security?

Duh, is it possible the pilot's are putting the airlines health ahead of their own immediate financial needs? Anyone here think those Dec snowstorms will put a dent in the meager cash reserves? I do, and so do the pilots'.

F9 needs all the help it can get to maintain viability in the next few years. JP has done an excellent job, but it's no secret why SWA is in Denver. They tried to cut the knees out from under US but the merger took care of that plan. SWA has changed their predatory model from siphoning off travelers from the former disfunctional legacy carriers, to one of trying to put the weaker carriers under.

imp:​

 

[OpenClimb]

We should define a few terms here before contract salesmanship gets into full swing...

1. A 2-year pay freeze, a B-scale for new captain upgrades and a one-time 1.5% cost of living increase is a paycut. If we're not keeping up with inflation, it's a paycut.

2. I'm not aware of a single concessionary contract that saved an airline. I have, however, seen a few lately that have funded great bonus checks for senior management.

3. I can't think of #3 right now. It was on the tip of my tongue a minute ago...

It'll be easy to lose sight of the forest while examining all the trees in this one, gentlemen. Be sure to read the contract with a critical eye and imagine how one provision can be used in combination with another provision to make the sum of the parts far worse than any single provision.

Don't count on a benevolent management team to refrain from taking advantage of every work rule concession. We have to view the WORDS in the contract, not warm fuzzy fealings about trusting whatever management team might wind up in power over the next 6 years.

The Company frequently tells us all that we've got a great relationship and we're a family. Unfortunately, their actions speak louder than the friendly words. Don't be fooled. We're business associates--not friends, not enemies--business associates. We agree to work under the terms of a contract. Management agrees to compensate us pursuant to the contract (with the exception of tomorrow's paycheck, of course). As business people selling our services to Frontier... (Holdings, Airlines, whatever), we have to assume that the terms of the contract will be followed to the letter and with the intent of extracting the greatest amount of work for the least amount of compensation allowable under the contract.

 

[pipe]

Do you guys know something we don't? Where was there mention of a pay cut? Even we haven't seen the TA, and you guys are rushing to slam it. Please wait and see. Nobody's going to "give the farm away"...sheesh...

I'm guessing Potter didn't negotiate early because he was dying to increase the pilot payroll.

I never said there was a pay cut, however, the topic of pay is conspicuously missing from the Potter / Thomas laundry lists. I'm just saying that if it doesn't at least keep up with cost of living, I wouldn't take it. Thomas really doesn't get it that Potter could run that joint through a bankruptcy court faster than a Burger King drive-thru if he wants to ditch that scope stuff. I wouldn't let Thomas give much away for "job protection", because I think he would.

PIPE

 

[F9 Driver]

Frontier pilots have tentative contract
By Kelly Yamanouchi
Denver Post Staff Writer
DenverPost.com
Article Last Updated:01/04/2007 02:31:22 PM MST
Frontier Airlines' pilots union has reached a tentative agreement on a new labor contract with the company after more than a year and a half of negotiations.

The four-year agreement freezes pay for a year for most of Frontier's approximately 650 pilots, according to Frontier Airline Pilots Association president Jeff Thomas. It includes future cost-of-living pay increases and future pay scale reductions, making it essentially "cost neutral," Thomas said.

"We adjusted the overall rates but nobody will be taking any pay reductions as a result of it," Thomas said. The independent pilots union had been in negotiations with Frontier since April 2005.

"I think it's a very realistic contract for where the industry is right now," Thomas said. "It certainly doesn't look at all like one of the contracts that came out of the bankruptcy filings."

The agreement comes after Frontier warned in early December that it would not break even in the December quarter as earlier expected, saying then it would instead would lose 12 to 17 cents a share due to soft passenger traffic in November and high fuel costs in December. But that was before the December snowstorms hit Denver, costing Frontier millions.

"This tentative agreement is a tremendous step forward for both our pilots and the company as we collectively prepare ourselves for the strategic growth that lies ahead," said Frontier chief executive Jeff Potter in a written statement.

The pilots union agreement adds a defined contribution retirement plan in addition to the existing 401(k) plan and includes some changes in work rules and productivity improvements that benefit the company. Frontier has "industry leading pilot productivity" and one of the most competitive crew operating costs in the industry, according to Thomas.

The agreement also allows Frontier to use non-Frontier Airlines Pilots Association pilots for its Q400 turboprop operation. That had been a major point of contention between the pilots union and the company. But Thomas said the contract limits Frontier's regional jet operation and future Q400 turboprop operation relative to the size of its main Airbus operation, which is flown by unionized pilots.

"The intent is that this flying should promote growth" of the mainline operation, Thomas said.

The pilots' union board of directors voted to approve the agreement last week, and plans to put it before the pilots for an electronic vote in mid-January. Results are expected in mid-February, and the agreement would become effective around March 1.

Staff writer Kelly Yamanouchi can be reached at 303-954-1488 or at [email protected] .

 

[pipe]

Duh, is it possible the pilot's are putting the airlines health ahead of their own immediate financial needs? Anyone here think those Dec snowstorms will put a dent in the meager cash reserves? I do, and so do the pilots'.

F9 needs all the help it can get to maintain viability in the next few years. JP has done an excellent job, but it's no secret why SWA is in Denver. They tried to cut the knees out from under US but the merger took care of that plan. SWA has changed their predatory model from siphoning off travelers from the former disfunctional legacy carriers, to one of trying to put the weaker carriers under.

imp:​

A 100% pay cut cannot drive WN from Denver. They are large enough that they can afford to lose their a$$es in Denver for a long, long time if all they are trying to do is run F9 out of business. You just gotta make sure the world understands how much better the F9 product really is. That is the only way to win that battle.

You sir, are an airline manager's dream. Rather than make the CEO figure out how to fix the problem, you are stepping forward from the lineup, raising your hand, and saying "Yo Potter, over here, I'm the problem". And your check, by the way, is not the problem.

PIPE

 

[The Prussian]

Duh, is it possible the pilot's are putting the airlines health ahead of their own immediate financial needs? Anyone here think those Dec snowstorms will put a dent in the meager cash reserves? I do, and so do the pilots'.

F9 needs all the help it can get to maintain viability in the next few years. JP has done an excellent job, but it's no secret why SWA is in Denver. They tried to cut the knees out from under US but the merger took care of that plan. SWA has changed their predatory model from siphoning off travelers from the former disfunctional legacy carriers, to one of trying to put the weaker carriers under.

IMHO...Southwest doesn't run airlines out of business. Airlines run themselves out of business.

 

[Heavy Set]

A 100% pay cut cannot drive WN from Denver. They are large enough that they can afford to lose their a$$es in Denver for a long, long time if all they are trying to do is run F9 out of business. You just gotta make sure the world understands how much better the F9 product really is. That is the only way to win that battle.

You sir, are an airline manager's dream. Rather than make the CEO figure out how to fix the problem, you are stepping forward from the lineup, raising your hand, and saying "Yo Potter, over here, I'm the problem". And your check, by the way, is not the problem.

PIPE

Pipe,

Lowecur is not a pilot. Really. He sells insurance and also owns Embraer stock.

 

[lowecur]

A 100% pay cut cannot drive WN from Denver. No, but it can keep the airline flying without having to seek BK or a merger partner in the near term. They are large enough that they can afford to lose their a$$es in Denver for a long, long time if all they are trying to do is run F9 out of business. Didn't they just get their 5th gate and don't you think they would take more if they were available? You just gotta make sure the world understands how much better the F9 product really is. That is the only way to win that battle. With meager cash reserves just how long can that formula hold up?

You sir, are an airline manager's dream. I'm a realist palley, and the UAL, DL, NWA, US Air, and AMR pilot MEC's were in la la land the 5 years prior to 2003. It became a, can you top this one. I'll say it again, the mgt of those airlines created much of the adversarial confrontations, but the MECs have to take just as much responsibility for those unsustainable contracts. Rather than make the CEO figure out how to fix the problem, you are stepping forward from the lineup, raising your hand, and saying "Yo Potter, over here, I'm the problem". And your check, by the way, is not the problem.

PIPE​

Your response is the typical "take one for the Gipper, er I mean the other pilots." The pilot's should have demanded COLA wage increases, and if they didn't get it they should start job actions, thus possibly putting a dagger in the heart of any already weak company. Next up would be BK (the new version...which could force them to liquidate), or a buyout from Jetblue with the help of Wall St or private equity. These would all be substantial steps down from where they are today.​

imp:​

 

[newnan]

A 100% pay cut cannot drive WN from Denver. No, but it can keep the airline flying without having to seek BK or a merger partner in the near term.


.... Work for free, yea you are mgmt's dream.

 

[Shrek]

Lowecur........you need to peruse the RLA my friend.

........The pilot's should have demanded COLA wage increases, and if they didn't get it they should start job actions......

 

[swa737-700]

Duh, is it possible the pilot's are putting the airlines health ahead of their own immediate financial needs? Anyone here think those Dec snowstorms will put a dent in the meager cash reserves? I do, and so do the pilots'.

F9 needs all the help it can get to maintain viability in the next few years. JP has done an excellent job, but it's no secret why SWA is in Denver. They tried to cut the knees out from under US but the merger took care of that plan. SWA has changed their predatory model from siphoning off travelers from the former disfunctional legacy carriers, to one of trying to put the weaker carriers under.

imp:​

Amazing,
Now whatever you get or do not get in your new contract is SWA's fault and not the fault of your own management or pilot group? Those 33 SWA flights out of DIA must really be kicking your butts. YGBSM!!!

 

[pipe]

Lowecur-

1. Staying out of bankruptcy in the near term has never fixed a systemic problem in airline history - it just puts you in bankruptcy in the long-term instead.

2. If Potter needs to hide cash and assets for a quick trip through BK he now has a ready-made pigeonhole for it - Lynx.

3. WN is not limited by the number of gates. They have, and will, build a whole new friggin' terminal themselves if they want gates.

4. Large percentage changes in F9 pilot compensation can only swing the balance sheet one million dollars (maximum) in a quarter. If F9 had been coming up one million short of profit quarter after quarter I'd buy it. That, however, is not the case.

5. I am a neutral, third-party observer. Volunteer to work for free for all I care. I think I'm in a position to look at it pretty objectively though.

PIPE