Delta RFP awarded....

[Tarzan]

Uh, excuse me, but exactly how many RJ's did Delta fly? Delta was offered the RJ's and declined because they didn't want to negotiate a payrate for them.

Skywest, on the other hand, has negotiated a pay rate on the very same aircraft Comair flies and will be flying aircraft directly transferred from Comair's fleet.

Apples and Oranges, acarpe.

Time out. The way I understand that went was Delta pilots said, "Let them fly the props, we fly the jets." Management wouldn't play ball for pay rates and guess where it went? The never ending race to the bottom began.

So as it appears from my vantage point (I don't see the big picture, I don't see the big picture, I don't see....) it looks more like managment rammed it through while the pilot groups had to cave. I don't see it as the pilot's just gave up, more to the tune of forced would be more appropriate.

Take some time and look at how tis thing has really gone down. You may be sirprised. Do your own research, do buy off on what I say or ALPA die hards say. But mark these words, Skywest will have their day when they are forced into pay concessions and substandard work conditions.

 

[V-1]

But mark these words, Skywest will have their day when they are forced into pay concessions and substandard work conditions.

Some would argue that by flying 90-seat airframes for 50-seat pay, Skywest pilots have already happily agreed to pay concessions and substandard work conditions.

 

[FDJ2]

You've got it arse backwards again BVT. The Delta pilots offered to negotiate a pay rate for the RJs but DAL said that even if the Delta pilots it flew it for $0, it still wouldn't be cost effective.

Just recently, diring the DAL 1113c hearing, when DALPA argued that DAL pilots ought to fly anything over 70 seats and that DAL pilots were willing to negotiate industry competive rates, DAL countered that regardless of the rates the DAL pilots were willing to negotiate, CMR pilots cost half as much as DAL pilots to fly those same jets.

 

[737 Pylt]

Uh, excuse me, but exactly how many RJ's did Delta fly? Delta was offered the RJ's and declined because they didn't want to negotiate a payrate for them.

Skywest, on the other hand, has negotiated a pay rate on the very same aircraft Comair flies and will be flying aircraft directly transferred from Comair's fleet.

Apples and Oranges, acarpe.

As usual you're wrong.....But that's to be expected!
The DL MEC tried to negotiate rates for 70+ seaters but was told by managment that no matter what rate was negotiated it was cheaper to have cmr fly it!
From the sounds of it, you and your cmr brethren should be quite pissed off at skywest for taking your airplanes!

737

 

[Minimaniac]

Should we move back to regulation? YES.

Why? Our industry is so tightly reglated in terms of expenditures in all aspects that it is absurd not to regulate income/revenue. If our company is forced to follow one procedure, use one type of safety equipment, pay one fixed landing fee, fly a route not of our choosing, then they ought to ensure our income is adequate to cover all these expenditures. With very very lttile room for innovation on our end, we are not given many options for finanacial success aside from accquiring market share (which, thanks to internet comparison sites, can only come from reduced fares)

 

[thebest]

My point is that ALPA can help a pilot group get their fair share when a company is raking in the profits, and when the company is in bankruptcy, there's not much anyone can do. SAPA can't even get us a raise to keep up with inflation when the company is making money hand over fist.

So back to your questions: How is ALPA helping Comair now? They are forcing the company to prove in court that they need to take paycuts. Until that time, they are being paid what they negotiated and agreed to.

How did ALPA help UAL in 2001? You mean after 9/11/2001? After the worst attacks this country has ever seen? After 2 of their airliners were hijacked and destroyed? After a huge downturn in travel? Are you suggesting SAPA should have been consulted by the UAL pilots and their pay would have been preserved? What's your point?

FedEx don't need help. How insightful. But can you concede that without ALPA, FedEx management wouldn't pay the pilots what they do? Can you concede that management would argue "supply and demand." With so few good jobs out there the past 5 years, FedEx could have paid far less and still been swamped with applications. Can you concede that ALPA might have had a hand in keeping their pay at or near the top of the industry?

Probably not, because you are blinded by your ideology. I just don't get it.

Ya, you just don't get it. alpa can help a company get their fair share when the company is raking in profits.... http://www.prnewswire.com/cgi-bin/stories.pl?ACCT=104&STORY=/www/story/12-05-2006/0004486034&EDATE= $50 mill projected.....Try again! They are losing airplanes, WHAT IS ALPO DOING TO HELP?
The idea of a union is to keep things good for the workers and not pushed around when things are good or bad. Well, things got bad and alpa crumbled like the useless pieces of sht they are! No help here boyz, ya are on your own.
Comair and alpo in court. Delta said they are still giving the flying away even if comair takes cuts, GREAT JOB AGAIN ALPO!
The frieght side of this is GRAVY! Good place for alpa to be hangin around because that is where the cash is. Then tell the weak minded that alpa really helps!
Did I say anything about sapa and ual talking....stop listening to the voices.

 

[jayme]

Comair is in BANKRUPTCY COURT! The COURT has taken away their rights. That can be appealed. There is a legal process. And as far as I know, Comair ALPA has no influence over Delta management. ALPA can't make Delta management's decisions. Do you know something I don't?

When I said "I just don't get it." I meant your intense ideology.

FedEx is gravy, huh? What induces FedEx management to pay top wages? Benevolence?

As far as my point about UAL: YOU asked how ALPA helped UAL. I explained the situation (Massive terrorist attack, world-wide economic downturn... remember?). ALPA had no leverage since UAL filed Ch 11. You want to know how ALPA remedied the situation?! What the fck do you think ALPA, or SAPA, or anybody else could do for those pilots? So to make my point, I suggested SAPA could do no better.

I feel like I'm being condescending having to explain my points to you like this. It's not because I WANT to explain things to you like you're a child. It's because I feel like I HAVE to.

 

[jayme]

One more thing: what makes FedEx pilots want to keep ALPA on property? If it's so easy for FedEx pilots to get paid well, why are they throwing away 1.9 % of their wages?

I'm guessing they are more familiar with the reasons than you. I am also guessing they feel their dues are a good investment.

 

[SkyNation]

jayme,

an honest question. did you know SkyWest was not an ALPA carrier when you interviewed and accepted the job? do you believe EVERY airline MUST have a union, or ALPA specifically?

 

[joe_pilot]

As much as I don't care for the cmr group, I think that sucks!
I wonder how the skyw pilots feel about this?

737

I for one don't like it.