Jetblue pilots begin organization drive...

[lowecur]

Or maybe they have pilots leaving left and right to go to the other airlines so they raised the pay on the 190 to try and make the 190 look a little more attractive? I guess it backfired.

Yeah, that's probably true. They should stick to hiring regional guys instead of the more experienced legacy furloughees. I would think the contract has a high bailout penalty written in, but maybe not.

So I guess what they should have done is offset the slowdown in deliveries to save the company money by increasing the pay for the whole pilot group. Is that it in a nutshell?....I think so. The best thing Jetblue could do is take the company private. That way decisions are not made to increase stockholder value. Oh, I forgot....what would happen to all those stock options?

imp:​

 

[Cobra]

Using the JetBlue pilot message board is like using the San Francisco chronicle for a fair shake on the War in Iraq.:erm:

It's likely you don't have a clue what the "fair shake" in Iraq is.

 

[Longhorn]

Lowecure,

Usually I agree with you but I got to tell you on this one you are wrong. Its not about the 320 guys. Its about mgnt telling us they would adjust the rates and do the right thing after the plane had been on property. They did adjust it...basicly 5 bucks on the CA side. As for the E190 fo's, yes, they did get a good bump and the pay came much closer to what it should be but for the rest of the rates, it was a slap in the face. As for the 320 guys, the least they could have done was give them a cola increase...but no, nothing. The health cost here are skyrocketing as well and they refuse to do anything about it because we cant have a seperate health care plan. During the road shows, many questions came about about "do you have the info on this or that?" and the answer was um....um...we dont have that. Its about putting our faith in the PCG only to find out that they did not represent us at all. they undercut the recommendations and had no communication with us about it. When asking one of them in person you got the cold shoulder...from our own. So, I think these reasons are just the tip of the iceberg. Like I said, had nothing to do with the 320 guys not getting anything, that was just part of it. The wonderful communication that we have has slowly erroded and it has become very obvious...to the point that even D Barger pointed it out yesterday. He satated that they need to do a better job communicating with us. I am tried to have faith as long as possible and still think they have it in them to make the proper changes that need to be made, but yesterday was a HUGE step in the wrong direction. They basicly invited ALPA on the property yesterday.

And lastly, I was a regional guy. I flew the 320 for 2 years and now the 190. I can tell you that it does not matter if you are regional, major, cargo, mil....everyone is pissed, especially the 190 guys.

 

[spinproof]

More posturing cuz the 320 guys didn't get a raise and the 190 guys did. It's all about the jealous sibling rivalry created where mgt is trying to bring the 190 guys up to speed from an initial weak contract. Obviously the 190 is doing better than mgt expected.

Just another chapter in the dysfunctional relationship between pilots and mgt. One thing I've seen on these message boards is that pilots will always find some excuse to slam mgt. If it isn't the usual complaint of overpaid mgt taking stock options and unearned bonus', it's just the typical power struggle of who's going to show who.

One thing the two Dave's will learn over the coming years is you can't please everyone, and you will never keep unions out of the airline business. They are trying to get Jetblue into the double digit profit margins again so they can get some much needed cash in the bank. They should get the extra cash they need in 2007 if everything pans out, but the 320 pilots aren't going to wait. Patience has never been a virtue of any pilot group, and now with more and more legacy new hires, that same stick it to mgt attitude has taken over.

It's not the end of the world, as even a great mgt team like SWA couldn't keep the unions at bay. It's just the innate nature of the beast.

imp:​

I know you posted this to get a "flame" thread going so I'll bite! Which I hasten to add you don't have a clue as to what is required to become either a pilot or management. Let me help you out.

Its' a pilots job to move people or things above the earths surface at speed 3 to 10 times that which you drive your personal transportation vehicle. All the while monitoring several instruments, the weather, traffic and radio communications that would loose you in two seconds! He has spent countless hours doing so at a price that would rival your local grocery boys earnings, but still he presses on! He does this over and over again without any accidents, incidents or personal failures. He has no second chances!

You and management, on the other hand, may screw up at leisure. Changing your mind how things must run at a whim with little more than a willing BOD to coddle! Having the gift of forgiveness and hindsight as a refuge in times of your petty distress.Mearly uttering "my bad" when things go wrong.

Now the day may come when you're at 8,000 inbound and you're being tossed a bit and your destination is CATII (or shudder) III.......think the person at the helm needs to be compensated more than mid-level management punk you seem to compare!!!
...well do ya?????

Funny how you expect someone to be "on the wall" but never willing to accept they deserve to be compensated justly.

 

[elag777]

It's likely you don't have a clue what the "fair shake" in Iraq is.

Not worth explaining as you appear to have missed the point. You know neither who I am or who I know, so your accusation is without merit. I did not expect anthing more from this board however. Pick up the SFC and see just how supportive they are of our fine Military.

 

[lowecur]

They basicly invited ALPA on the property yesterday. So get it over with already. If it wasn't this terrible injustice now, it would be the fact that the pilot lounge has gotten too shabby in the next year or the vending machines have gone up a quarter.

And lastly, I was a regional guy. I flew the 320 for 2 years and now the 190. I can tell you that it does not matter if you are regional, major, cargo, mil....everyone is pissed, especially the 190 guys.

Do you think mgt made a mistake by growing too fast? I think they are just beginning to see the effects of having too much on their plate in an industry that as been changing colors by the minute. Will the pilot group give them time to digest what's happening? No way, the ball has dropped at Times Square and Dick Clark is already talking to private equity.

imp:​

 

[J32driver]

They should stick to hiring regional guys instead of the more experienced legacy furloughees.

I told you this a couple years ago, I'm going to say it again. You have no concept of management/labor relations. Speaking about something you don't understand only reveals how little you really know.

When the Furloughees were hired, JetBlue said you are going to like it here so much you will never go back. I guess they were wrong.

If you think a regional guy is trapped at JetBlue and stands a more likely chance of staying, I guess you failed to notice alot of other places are hiring.

 

[radarlove]

Dick Clark is already talking to private equity.

Interesting if true. Source?

 

[Lear70]

Lowecur, you usually have pretty decent financial understandings of this industry, but lack industry experience to put events into perspective.

Blue had no choice but to expand quickly, otherwise they would have been stuck in the same boat that Midwest is in: great product, no national name brand recognition.

Now they have better brand recognition than airTran which has been around a lot longer, they have a great product, fuel prices have stabilized and will either stay the same or go down slightly (in case you haven't been watching oil lately which you probably have and already know). With increasing yields they are poised to make a good profit this year and an excellent profit next year.

So no, I don't blame the 'Blue pilots for wanting to enter the new year on decent financial ground.

It's WRONG that the 320 guys haven't received a COLA raise in years (longevity only).

It's WRONG that the E190 pay scale on the CA side tops out around the same range as a 717 F/O at AAI and airTran's pay scale is 6 years old. Almost identical seating,,,?

About the only people who benefit here are the 190 F/O's, and I do believe that it was done ONLY to try to stem the bleeding that's about to take place. Those F/O's mostly came from other regionals where they were CA's and Check Airmen, have LOTS of experience, and will be PERFECT candidates when DAL and NWA start hiring this year (If you'd go to NWA, but that's another subject), not to mention CAL, SWA, FDX, and UPS already hiring.

These smaller LCC's just don't get it about compensating their pilot groups fairly or they'll leave to someone who will. Do you have ANY idea how much money that is? Multiplied by HOW many pilots will leave? Mostly junior guys so it doesn't help reduce upper-level compensation.

Incidentally, I agree that ALPA or IBT would probably be the best way to go for you guys. No SCOPE issues and a large war chest. I wouldn't want ALPA here, but that's simply because we are already established in-house with financial reserves to back it.

You guys are in for a long road. Good luck to ya'!

 

[Andy]

Good luck JBLU pilots, no matter which course of action you choose.