Astar Management Plan's Backfire

[jettypeguy]

Astar Managements Plan Backfires

From what my Astar buddy told me, no pilots knew anything about a supposed job action, or even that a pilot had been fired. Sounds like Management took a rumor and ran with it, it backfired, and now they look stupid! BTW Luby's comments are the best!!


Did Restraining order stop ASTAR pilots from walk-out?
By GARY HUFFENBERGER
Wilmington News Journal 11/18/2006

A court-issued temporary restraining order (TRO) last week against the
ASTAR Air Cargo pilots’ union was vacated the next day, but controversy
persists whether a work stoppage was ever a real possibility. “I think we got the desired result we needed here. It staved off an imminent threat. There was a real threat to our operation. We thought it was a credible threat that could potentially impact the safety of our operation and the reliability of our product for DHL,” ASTAR General Counsel Steve Rossum said Thursday after the TRO was vacated.

The same federal judge who on Wednesday night issued the TRO against the pilots’ union, Judge Walter H. Rice out of Dayton, vacated the order on Thursday. In addition to the judge dropping the TRO, he granted the union, the Airline Pilots Association (ALPA) International, a right to request that court costs and attorney fees be assessed against the company.

On Friday, ALPA International Assistant Director of Representation Arthur Luby disputed Rossum’s statement that an imminent threat had been “staved off.” “Steve Rossum is a competent airline professional but every aspect of that drivel thrown in front of the court by the company on Wednesday night was fictional, including the commas, the apostrophes and the periods. There was never at any time any threat of a job action,” said Luby. “There was never any truth to the idea that we were prepared or that anyone was going to be inspired to engage in a work slowdown in response to that sort of thing. We have a grievance process, and we utilize it,” Luby said following the judge’s ruling to vacate the injunction. “I think they acted on a rumor, and I think that was very regrettable. Not sound labor relations,” added Luby.

However, Rossum maintained the company’s request for a TRO against the union was well-conceived. Rossum said that “after careful deliberation” by the company, a TRO was thought to be “a necessary step” to ensure against a work stoppage. “Actually, I feel good about what happened here,” said Rossum on Thursday. Commenting that ASTAR has a “fine cadre of professional pilots,” Rossum continued, “We know most of our employees, including our pilots, don’t support these type of activities.”

He however added that if there are “some people out there” who are potentially disrupting or threatening to disrupt the airline’s operations, “or impacting safety or reliability,” the company will consider recourse to a judicial forum. “We’re not going to be reluctant if there are future threats or future bad behavior to go in and avail ourselves of the federal courts again to prevent illegal activity,” said Rossum.

 

[TWA]

After speaking with people on both sides of the isle, and watching things unfold over the past few years, nothing at ILN surprises me anymore.

 

[two(2)%]

Do Federal Judges really hand these TRO's out based on hearsay evidence? ABX has some attorney line pilots, maybe they could weigh-in here. Or maybe I need to watch more law and order.

 

[DC-9er]

Bet they don't get another TRO from that judge anytime soon.

 

[Whistlin' Dan]

It wasn't a fair match. Rossum is a money guy, not a labor guy. Luby is labor, through and through.

In the effort to secure a fair contract between ASTAR and it's pilots, "spin" will play as important a role as due process. Now that they've had their nose bloodied, look for ASTAR to bring in some "big-dog" talent to advise quietly from the sidelines. It would be dangerous to assume that their future actions will be as amateurish and ill-conceived as the ones taken up to this point.

 

[AV8OR]

.....look for ASTAR to bring in some "big-dog" talent to advise quietly from the sidelines.

For $30k a month, that's what McKeen was supposed to be. (For those not in the loop, he used to be a hired gun for labor, now he's on the AStar payroll.)

 

[Joe Pilot]

It looks like management underestimated the resolve of the Astar pilot group. Wilmington News Journal online has some good stuff in the electronic section.
I think that the majority of the pilots at Astar now see that Dasburg is not interested in doing anything other than line his and his investors pockets. You would think that since this is probably Dasburgs last big hurah he would want to grow that small airline into something people would remember, a legacy of himself. I am sure he might have wanted too but he couldn't pull it off.
After reading about the guy, I personally believe that he is a failure at running a successful business but is a master at the golden parachute game. All his endevours up to know have been failures. NWA strike, cost stockholders millions, Burgerking, he did nothing and even said so, Marriot he was a lame ass and now Astar. He is the kind of CEO that gets paid to leave because he can't produce results.

 

[356emain]

It looks like managment got their wish for a trouble free holiday. With no more meetings planned until January the company will be free to do whatever they have planned.

 

[two(2)%]

It looks like managment got their wish for a trouble free holiday. With no more meetings planned until January the company will be free to do whatever they have planned.

Is that a negotiation meeting in Jan? Hypothetically, what would the Astar ALPA response be if in January, Company requests release from mediation?
Would this departure from plan A indicate that Union and Co. are simply disparate? Could this be taken as a sign of something else? Astar seems to have all contingencies at their disposal. Frustrating.

 

[AV8OR]

Hypothetically, what would the Astar ALPA response be if in January, Company requests release from mediation?

1. The company requested the mediator in the first place, so I'd be surprised for that to happen.

2. If they want to go to binding arbitration, they will most likey pound sand.

3. If they want to be released for cooling off, that sounds about right, since I think they're really just stalling.

4. If they want to be released for something else, then that's convenient cause we're ready for self help today, and they can bring it on.

Just my .02

 

[Whistlin' Dan]

It looks like managment got their wish for a trouble free holiday. With no more meetings planned until January the company will be free to do whatever they have planned.

Oh, I don't know about that. The company may be "free to do whatever they had planned," but the pilots will be free to do whatever they had planned as well. Namely, spend more time with their families over the holidays, not bid on open time, not answer telephones, etc. Remember, those actions are illegal only if the union orchestrates them. It's not a crime to NOT volunteer for extra work. Nor is it a crime to have a beer or other adult beverage on your time off, so long as you don't violate the "12-hour" or "fitness for duty" rule.

It is a crime, however, to fly when you're sick or fatigued, as I'm sure your union will be reminding you over the next several weeks. DO visit a Dr. the next morning should any of you feel it necessary to take some sick time. The $10 co-pay could save your job.

I still have several friends working for Astar. I hope you (and they) all get one he11 of a contract, because this is probably the last "good" one either you or ABX will get. Dasburg and Hete know it too, which is why they're going to try to suck everything they can out of their respective companies. Hang tough and don't give in. You and the ABX pilot group are really nothing more than galley slaves, rowing opposite sides of the same ship. The company is already holding auditions for your replacements.

 

[erichartmann]

Dan, if the pilot group suddenly stops bidding and working overtime or being availiable for that late night phone call a judge will likely view that as a concerted job action, particularly if the group had a history of doing the work. It won't matter what the MEC publically delcares. There is precedent for this.

 

[AV8OR]

That is correct. There will be NO illegal job action by the AStar pilot group. Period.

 

[skycruizer]

.....look for ASTAR to bring in some "big-dog" talent to advise quietly from the sidelines.

For $30k a month, that's what McKeen was supposed to be. (For those not in the loop, he used to be a hired gun for labor, now he's on the AStar payroll.)

When was he pro labor...college? This guy is pure anti labor.

 

[skycruizer]

It wasn't a fair match. Rossum is a money guy, not a labor guy. Luby is labor, through and through.

In the effort to secure a fair contract between ASTAR and it's pilots, "spin" will play as important a role as due process. Now that they've had their nose bloodied, look for ASTAR to bring in some "big-dog" talent to advise quietly from the sidelines. It would be dangerous to assume that their future actions will be as amateurish and ill-conceived as the ones taken up to this point.

Come on Dan...you know that the "Daz" is the big dog. Woof-Woof!

 

[AV8OR]

When was he pro labor...college? This guy is pure anti labor.

Sorry for the misunderstanding. I said he was hired for labor not pro labor. What I meant was that he was hired for labor relations by the company.

Sorry for the confusion. I guess my lawyer skin shoes are on a little too tight.

 

[skycruizer]

Sorry for the misunderstanding. I said he was hired for labor not pro labor. What I meant was that he was hired for labor relations by the company.

Sorry for the confusion. I guess my lawyer skin shoes are on a little too tight.

Aaaaah, ok I see it now. My mistake, I'll read slower. Thanks for the clarification.

 

[skycruizer]

It wasn't a fair match. Rossum is a money guy, not a labor guy. Luby is labor, through and through.

That's true but Rossum picked his battle didn't he? If he hasn't learned this type of lesson by now I doubt he ever will. Let me ask this. Blessing testified that Boja called him (director to director). Would there be any difference if the contact was actually corporate officer to officer?

 

[flyinboxes]

It looks like managment got their wish for a trouble free holiday. With no more meetings planned until January the company will be free to do whatever they have planned.

These idiots can't spell "planned".

 

[flyinboxes]

When was he pro labor...college? This guy is pure anti labor.

I think he meant to say this guy was trained by pro-labor. The pro-labor leader of the airline pilot world. Turn Coat (nice name)J Randolph Babbit. He knows ALPA from the inside.

 

[Flex81]

You and the ABX pilot group are really nothing more than galley slaves, rowing opposite sides of the same ship. The company is already holding auditions for your replacements.

Is this the general view that all ABX and ASTAR pilots have? Is this true that DHL is looking for replacements? If so, then how far will you push for this new contract? Go ahead and choke the goose that lays the golden eggs, but I hope you are careful and don't kill it in the process.

 

[AV8OR]

Quote:
You and the ABX pilot group are really nothing more than galley slaves, rowing opposite sides of the same ship. The company is already holding auditions for your replacements.
Is this the general view that all ABX and ASTAR pilots have? Is this true that DHL is looking for replacements? If so, then how far will you push for this new contract? Go ahead and choke the goose that lays the golden eggs, but I hope you are careful and don't kill it in the process.


First, Whistlin' doesn't work at ABX or AStar, although I think he used to work for AStar.

Second, while there is trememndous unity at AStar, to say there is a "general view" of the pilots at ABX and AStar just doesn't work. We have a union. We all have the same basic desire, a fair contract. Some want more, some would take less, some just want 5 years till they retire, some want 25 or more. What's true so far though is, we are far from being the galley slaves. Can't speak for the folks at ABX, but if it comes down to "killing the goose" or settling for a goose that lay eggs that look like they were hatched out of a Kitty Hawk, most of us on th AStar side are willing to sharpen the blade. Pilots that do informational picketing while delivering record on time performance for a third the pay of your competitor, that's a by-God, golden egg layin, goose. They're the ones that need to be careful.

Third, as for replacements, doubtful, but we'll see. Not sure what Dan meant by that. Maybe he has some knowledge of scab recruitment. Don't know, don't care. The majority of us are pretty resolute.

 

[Flex81]

Thanks AV8OR

 

[Whistlin' Dan]

Is this the general view that all ABX and ASTAR pilots have? Is this true that DHL is looking for replacements? If so, then how far will you push for this new contract? Go ahead and choke the goose that lays the golden eggs, but I hope you are careful and don't kill it in the process.

I didn't mean to impune that the pilots of either group were unprofessional. To the contrary, the pilots of both groups (at least as far as I can tell) are among the most professional in the business. I believe they perform at a level that would surprise many Legacy pilots, as well as their peers at UPS and FedEx, where, apparently, one has to be a bonafide war hero or space astronaut to get hired.

The notion that the company is looking for replacements doesn't come from their current labor difficulties, it's just the way DHL does business. If they perceive that Astar/ABX aren't going to do the work significantly cheaper than their competitors, they'll "grow" an airline/airlines who can. To be fair, UPS would be doing the same thing if they could. FedEx too, if they were starting over today. In the current business climate, "employees" of any kind are a liability. Unionized employees are an especially dangerous liability. Having experienced, highly-motivated employees means nothing to them if it means that those employees expect to be highly compensated as well, and there's nowhere that that's more true than at DHL. While a 98% (or whatever it is) on-time rate is admirable, it's low cost that spins the beanies at DHL Worldwide.

You guys want some of your international flying back? You want to see some new wide-bodies on the ramp? Take Gemini's hourly rates and cut them by 10% As it is, there's no incentive to grow Astar, which is why they bought Polar. (Look for that one to spin off in a few years, too)

Another question to ask yourself is this...if "on-time performance" were all that important to DHL, why has their fleet never been Cat II certified?

It used to be said that DHL Airways (now Astar) was an airline with just one customer. If that's true (and I happen to think it is) you sure as he11 don't want it to be DHL.

 

[hvydriver]

>Another question to ask yourself is this...if "on-time performance" were all that important to DHL, why has their fleet never been Cat II certified?<

FWIW, CAT II authorization is proceeding for Astar. That's going to cost a few Reichmarks from the Fatherland.

 

[Whistlin' Dan]

...as for replacements, doubtful, but we'll see. Not sure what Dan meant by that. Maybe he has some knowledge of scab recruitment. Don't know, don't care. The majority of us are pretty resolute.

I have no reason to believe that they're actively recruiting potantial scabs. I doubt they could find/qualify enough guys to fill the seats anyhow. What I was referring to is the notion that DHL is probably going to try to spread their domestic operations over more than 2 carriers, as soon as the current "exclusive" contracts with Astar/ABX expire.

Now, if Astar and ABX were to merge, that would be a different matter. You'd be big enough to exert some real influence on DHL Int'l, and you could cull the herd of a few managers as well.

 

[flyinboxes]

Is this the general view that all ABX and ASTAR pilots have? Is this true that DHL is looking for replacements? If so, then how far will you push for this new contract? Go ahead and choke the goose that lays the golden eggs, but I hope you are careful and don't kill it in the process.

We will "push" this new contract as far as it will go. We have done our job, we work for a VERY profitable airline and there is no reason we shouldn't be compensated accordingly. If DHL shifts business to pilots who will do my job for less then so be it. They can have it. I did my crappy airline time and I won't do it again. That being said "we will kill it if necessary, and then we will eat it."

 

[AV8OR]

If DHL shifts business to pilots who will do my job for less then so be it. They can have it. I did my crappy airline time and I won't do it again. That being said "we will kill it if necessary, and then we will eat it."

See? Told ya.

We're not gonna turn this into Gemini or Gemini - 10% just to regain flying. If that's what DHL wants, they'll have to get it from somebody other than AStar, which will at that point be a smoking hole of an airline.

We're reasonable....not whores.

 

[goastar]

If DHL shifts business to pilots who will do my job for less then so be it. They can have it. I did my crappy airline time and I won't do it again. That being said "we will kill it if necessary, and then we will eat it."

See? Told ya.

We're not gonna turn this into Gemini or Gemini - 10% just to regain flying. If that's what DHL wants, they'll have to get it from somebody other than AStar, which will at that point be a smoking hole of an airline.

We're reasonable....not whores.

CAN I GET AN AMEN!!

 

[UM#1]

If DHL shifts business to pilots who will do my job for less then so be it. They can have it. I did my crappy airline time and I won't do it again. That being said "we will kill it if necessary, and then we will eat it."

See? Told ya.

We're not gonna turn this into Gemini or Gemini - 10% just to regain flying. If that's what DHL wants, they'll have to get it from somebody other than AStar, which will at that point be a smoking hole of an airline.

We're reasonable....not whores.

AMEN!!!