Your Opinions on a Navajo P

[dhc8fo]

Alright you wild and crazy Navajo experienced pilots....what do you think about this plane for fairly short charters (say 3 hours or less)? I am considering a 1977 with low time engines (12 SMOH to be exact). Has the 40 degree flap mod and vortex gens.

I have never flown one but I am going on the advice of my mechanic, who I trust and have "been with" for many years. Of course, he is looking at it purely from a maintenance side.

Want to get a pressurized cabin class plane that can handle six. Budget isn't all that high ($300K or less). Very familliar with Cessna 340 since I have one now, but the useful load is crap. Any comments or suggestions?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Junkflyer]

I'm not sure about the NavajoP, Chieftans are good solid fairly fast airplanes. It seems insurance can be hard to get for 135 if the pilot doesn't have a lot of Chieftan time. Also check on the recent Lycoming engine AD's, not sure if they concern these motors or not.

 

[FlyingFisherman]

You won't have to worry about paying hangar rent for a P-Navajo (Mojave if you want to be fancy) because it's always going to be in the shop.

 

[paulsalem]

Are the Mojave and the Navajo P the only two piston pressurized PA-31s?

 

[erj-145mech]

The most expensive annual inspection is one that I performed on a P Navajo. The right engine (the engines are geared) was making metal, both wing flaps had working rivets, the holes were worn out to the point that we didn't have enough edge distance to repair them, the rear spar on the left wing had a crack in it at the inboard aileron hinge attach, two fuel bladders were leaking, etc. The bill came to $140K in 1982 dollars.

The airplanes are maintenance hogs. If the airplane is not now on a 135 certificate, it could cost more than its worth to get on a certificate. You also may not be able to recoup the maintenace costs and stay comptitive with charter rates in your area.

I'm not sure how much range that you can expect with six on board either.

 

[jknight8907]

When we got our Navajo, we stayed well away from the P's for maintenance reasons. We ended up with a 1975 -310 which has been an awesome plane.

 

[charlesmelot]

P Hog

The pressurized Navajo was knicknamed the P Hog for good reason. The performance package is pretty good for the price. The airframe and engines are "orphans" no longer supported by their manufacturers. The engines have a 1,200 hour TBO and would have to cost $60,000 each to overhaul if you could find a shop to do it. Charlie Melot Zephyr Aircraft Engines

 

[FlyingFisherman]

Cheyennes are PA-31T and they're not garbage. It's the sh!t motors they put on the P-Navajos that make them the sh!tty airplanes they are.

On the other hand...all Navajos use honest to goodness tampax tampons as air filters (I can't remember where we put the damn thing...one of the two) in the deice system air lines or the vaccuum air lines.

Sucker came in a sealed bag with a piper part number and everything...labled in wrapping from Tampax.

 

[dhc8fo]

Sucker came in a sealed bag with a piper part number and everything...labled in wrapping from Tampax.

That is freaking hilarious....but now you guys are scaring me. As far as the engines go, is there some sort of conversion or change I can do? With the plane I am looking at now I have to replace one engine right away anyway. Then, aside from the engines, are they OK maintenance-wise?

If no, now can you guys recommend some kind of twin that can carry six-eight people at a decent speed and cost? Hard part is keeping the purchase under 300K and then being able to afford the upkeep...

 

[erj-145mech]

Those filters are in the manifold pressure lines behind the panel, under the glareshield, in the center.

My aunt used to work for Piper in Lock Haven, and she said that the company had a pilferage problem with that one particluar part. She had the responsibility of cutting the strings off and repackaging the product. Without the strings, the users were becoming "dirty cotton pickers".

The TIGO-541 series engine takes a whole new look at engine design, Lycoming was trying to extract too much from the base 540 family. Its an all day chore to just get access to and clean the fuel nozzles. We're not even going into the rigging proceedure.

Paulsalem asked if these were the only piston powered pressurized PA-31's. Yes, although the Mojave is a second generation and much improved over the original design, they weren't marketed to the best ability by Pipers heirarchy.