You are welcome Westies

[TWA Dude]

When does the damages trial start?

First, we need to hear from the 9th Circuit that the appeal is denied. Then, Judge Wake will rule on the motion for USAPA to pay all attorneys fees. Then, we can set a trial date for damages. So realistically, it's many months away if not a year. That's the normal speed of the courts.

 

[Metrojet]

First, we need to hear from the 9th Circuit that the appeal is denied. Then, Judge Wake will rule on the motion for USAPA to pay all attorneys fees. Then, we can set a trial date for damages. So realistically, it's many months away if not a year. That's the normal speed of the courts.

Hi Dude -

Although I disagree with your predictions - at least your comments are sensible - and it only took three pages of thread!

Metrojet
(this thread actually had me laughing at 1:30 AM! - )

 

[Hpilot]

AWA had 18 mio. left. They had no credit. You are dumber then dirt GL and it shows with your knowledge of the facts as in what shape AWA was in.

Trying to justify a guy who had been at AWA for 8 weeks and then placing him ahead of former East Capt with 17 years just won't work for the real USAIR pilots.

GL paid for his training and has different views on seniority. Your greed shows.

M

Get over it loser. AWA was pfofitable the 5 quarters prior to the merger. It was AWA's credit that allowed the merger to happen. Look up the paperwork, AWA is listed as the AQUIRING airline dumb@ss. If you have a job, YOU'RE WELCOME.

 

[BeCareful!]

Well, this thread has followed a predictable pattern, as one guy already pointed out. (Complete with the General making false claims about AWA's ability to buy US Air with credit. Anyone want to provide proof of that one?!?

Anyway, would anyone like to discuss the original point McDu had? (without the inappropriate overtones that someone owes the other a "thank you." Bad form, McDu)
That is, of course: why has the West taken over so much east flying (24%) vs. east doing only 4% of the old west flying. Why has management shrunk the west so much if it was making so much money before? Why is the east portion of this company so much more viable (as if by magic) after the merger?

(Maybe it's because we now do the mandatory, memorized, zig-zag back-and-forth flows rather than just setting up the airplane and reading the checklist.)

 

[becket]

Well, this thread has followed a predictable pattern, as one guy already pointed out. (Complete with the General making false claims about AWA's ability to buy US Air with credit. Anyone want to provide proof of that one?!?

Anyway, would anyone like to discuss the original point McDu had? (without the inappropriate overtones that someone owes the other a "thank you." Bad form, McDu)
That is, of course: why has the West taken over so much east flying (24%) vs. east doing only 4% of the old west flying. Why has management shrunk the west so much if it was making so much money before? Why is the east portion of this company so much more viable (as if by magic) after the merger?

(Maybe it's because we now do the mandatory, memorized, zig-zag back-and-forth flows rather than just setting up the airplane and reading the checklist.)

Where is this 24% coming from?

 

[MCDU]

Straight from DP's mouth! You can watch online. Last crew news session in sweltering and dusty PHX.

After a lot of complaining by Westies about all the blacktops in PHX. The company looked up the stats. Westies whining about East flying West routes. Turns out Westies are doing a huge amount of former East routes. Again Westies were wrong about East metal replacing West.The former West routes were losing money and they replaced East flying. Westies stealing East flying at the expense of East positions. The greed is unbelievable. The West is like Republic. Trying to justify them taking Midex flying.

M

 

[ableone]

Straight from DP's mouth! You can watch online. Last crew news session in might PHX.

After a lot of complaining by Westies about all the blacktops in PHX. The company looked up the stats. Westies whining about East flying West routes. Turns out Westies are doing a huge amount of former East routes. Again Westies were wrong about East metal replacing West.The former West routes were losing money and they replaced East flying. Westies stealing East flying at the expense of East positions. The greed is unbelievable. The West is like Republic. Trying to justify them taking Midex flying.

M

Again, why do you care?

 

[MCDU]

Again, why do you care?

Because it irks me seeing such greedy little PFT pukes like you trying to justify how someone with 8 weeks on the property should bid ahead of former CAPT with 17 years.

M

 

[ableone]

Ahh, PFT pukes.

You mean like those total losers who paid for a job at Gulfstream?

BTW, a former captain with 17 years? The hyperbole seems to keep growing and growing. Those east furloughees were captains, really?

Just keep making it up if it makes you feel better but those pilots are exactly where they should be on the seniority list, behind active pilots.

 

[MCDU]

DOH 1988 or 1989 all held or could have held CAPT in 2000. That snapshot was a total farce. Their career did not revolve around a 2005 snapshot.

Where were the active E 170 Capts. placed? Same Union. Can not be in the Union if you were not active.

The West has furloughed pilots now. Should they be stapled behind all active pilots as you seem to advocate?

M

 

[ableone]

DOH 1988 or 1989 all held or could have held CAPT in 2000. That snapshot was a total farce. Their career did not revolve around a 2005 snapshot.

Ahh, the could have been argument. This explains why every east pilot with a union position is referred to as Capt so and so when they are in fact FOs.

Where were the active E 170 Capts. placed? Same Union. Can not be in the Union if you were not active.

You mean those pilots who were not on the active list? They were furloughees.

Even the list that the east MEC submitted to the arbitrator showed them as furloughed pilots.

Only in hindsight does the east claim that furloughed at MDA equals not furloughed. Right.

Looks like

The West has furloughed pilots now. Should they be stapled behind all active pilots as you seem to advocate?

M

The west furloughees have been furloughed out of seniority order. The east pilot group will eventually be forced to pay a large assessment to make these pilots whole.

You see east pilots stole west jobs.

 

[Bringupthebird]

24% based on what? Hours? Miles? Frequency? And how "old" is the "old" east flying that the west has somehow taken over?

But if it irks the lil' rascal MCDU and it keeps the "us vs them" tribal mentality going, then I guess it's serving some purpose. USAPA knows that a unified pilot group will reject their do-nothing strategy and they will be left poor and Taurus-less. Thus them pump their pimps with this type of info and fan the flames of discord. Cleary has made a career out of sharpening Parker's whipsaw.

Now once that broken record gets discarded, the two sides will see that the Nicolau list is not the boogeyman that USAPA made it out to be and that they can do more together than at each others throats.

Dang, then where are we going to find a union that can actually produce results and serve ALL US pilots without an agenda?

Psst. The time is coming soon when the pilots will have to make just such a choice.

 

[becket]

I expect to see that 24% grow. USAPA is the poster child for "unintended consequences". F*** the cry baby Eastholes. They had their chance to bargain in good faith years ago. It blew up in their faces and they still haven't learned a thing.

24%, (if it's even true) is a good start.

 

[ableone]

BTW why is a PFT Gulfstream guy so hot and bothered about PFT.

For the record I have yet to fly with a west FO who debased themselves by participating in a PFT debacle.

Unfortunately your hands are not so clean.

 

[ableone]

Not all east pilots feel this way.

My last F.O. had an east Capt come up to him and apologize for the behavior of his pilot group. This individual felt that the east was running away from their agreements and was embarrassed by USAPA's antics. He further indicated that he, along with about 400 other east pilots, have resigned from USAPA.

This guy actually initiated the conversation. He was probably not MCDU's father.

 

[MCDU]

Looks like the rats have come out. Way to go. Lets keep BP down and post away.
Good job you greedy Westies. Oh, if only we had that Nic award.

M

 

[ableone]

Looks like the rats have come out. Way to go. Lets keep BP down and post away.
Good job you greedy Westies. Oh, if only we had that Nic award.

M

You are the advocate of the thief's rights M.

The greed is yours, or rather whomever's position you so zealously advocate as you are not a professional pilot, just another wanna be.

 

[Metrojet]

Not all east pilots feel this way.

My last F.O. had an east Capt come up to him and apologize for the behavior of his pilot group. This individual felt that the east was running away from their agreements and was embarrassed by USAPA's antics. He further indicated that he, along with about 400 other east pilots, have resigned from USAPA.

This guy actually initiated the conversation. He was probably not MCDU's father.

Was it Captain C. (i know all) M.?

 

[reepicheep]

We wanted to kill the merger, but we had no power because of the bankrpucy . We *east" were ready to emerge from bankruptcy and move forward with building a stronger airline...

This is partly true; usair was moving forward, or rather moving west 'cause that's where all your airplanes were headed - MOJAVE.

Which, I believe, still has more east metal on the ground at any one time than any other airport.

 

[St. Nic]

This thing is close to being over. All of us out east are captains, thats where we were in 2000 and thats where we deserve to be now, regardless of what a senile arbitrator says. You westies can't get it that we hold the keys out east- there isnt anything you can do except enjoy the ride! God I love seeing you all so angry and mad about what has happened. You deserve all of this! You made it! We out east are finishing it and enjoy watching yoru greed get the best of you.
East pilots have always been true major airline pilots, what can your clan say about your bottom feeder wagers and rag-tag flying circus from Phoenix???

 

[mesaserf]

This thing is close to being over. All of us out east are captains, thats where we were in 2000 and thats where we deserve to be now, regardless of what a senile arbitrator says. You westies can't get it that we hold the keys out east- there isnt anything you can do except enjoy the ride! God I love seeing you all so angry and mad about what has happened. You deserve all of this! You made it! We out east are finishing it and enjoy watching yoru greed get the best of you.
East pilots have always been true major airline pilots, what can your clan say about your bottom feeder wagers and rag-tag flying circus from Phoenix???

No wonder you guys are called the "ME" generation.

 

[scoreboardII]

You guys need to get a room....

 

[becket]

T
East pilots have always been true major airline pilots, what can your clan say about your bottom feeder wagers and rag-tag flying circus from Phoenix???

Yep. You've always been the pride of the Industry there "crash gordon". I'm not sure all those decades in a DC-9 going from Pit to Elmira, Rochester, Syracuse, etc. qualifies you as a "major" anything but a major "S???":laugh:

 

[flybywire]

Yep. You've always been the pride of the Industry there "crash gordon". I'm not sure all those decades in a DC-9 going from Pit to Elmira, Rochester, Syracuse, etc. qualifies you as a "major" anything but a major "S???":laugh:

Wow for someone with 12000 hours your not too smart. Not surprising. Decades ago as you put it Rochester flights were always full do to Kodak being there as well as other companies until they left. As for elmira lets throw in Ithaca because we did go pit elm ith and back....again full there's this university up there called cornell. As for making fun of accidents well most good pilots try to learn from others misfortunes or mistakes. And you probably really don't fly because you would know that it's the amount of revenue you make not your flight schedule that makes you a major.

 

[becket]

Wow for someone with 12000 hours your not too smart. Not surprising. Decades ago as you put it Rochester flights were always full do to Kodak being there as well as other companies until they left. As for elmira lets throw in Ithaca because we did go pit elm ith and back....again full there's this university up there called cornell. As for making fun of accidents well most good pilots try to learn from others misfortunes or mistakes. And you probably really don't fly because you would know that it's the amount of revenue you make not your flight schedule that makes you a major.

Oh I forgot how profitable your "major" was. So much so you only went BK 3 times and had to be rescued by a bunch of rookies from the desert. I understand the major/revenue thing...what you need to understand is that in order to not be just another failed airline, you actually need to KEEP some of that revenue. Keep living in the past if it makes you happy. Easties love living in the past. It's a common trait for some reason.

 

[FLYLOW22]

Westicles? Really?!?! HA!

I heard the term Westicle for the first time this week. I spit my coffee.

They don't always come in two's though... :nuts::nuts:

 

[reepicheep]

It's hard to imagine now unless you were there but in the 80's USAir's focus on the ITH's, ELM's, BGM's was not seen as small-town provincialism rather the airline was lauded for staying under the radar and capitalizing on a profitable niche. The trouble was like most niches things changed and management was very slow to adapt and in many cases refused to adapt. Colodny bet the farm on F100's and the PIT hub, in retrospect exactly the wrong moves heading into the 90's. The industry is merciless. A couple wrong moves, some bad luck, some airlines never recover.

 

[captfred]

It's hard to imagine now unless you were there but in the 80's USAir's focus on the ITH's, ELM's, BGM's was not seen as small-town provincialism rather the airline was lauded for staying under the radar and capitalizing on a profitable niche. The trouble was like most niches things changed and management was very slow to adapt and in many cases refused to adapt. Colodny bet the farm on F100's and the PIT hub, in retrospect exactly the wrong moves heading into the 90's. The industry is merciless. A couple wrong moves, some bad luck, some airlines never recover.

Don't forget the Piedmont F-28's. I could those smoke trails all over Florida from 10 miles away. Not such a bright move.

 

[Bringupthebird]

I agree the end is near for USAPA. Look for representation election cards coming to a crew room near you.

 

[PHXFLYR]

Good...now we can try teamsters on for size

PHXFLYR