WOFT Selection Boards

[weekendwarrior]

So is BCS still around? When I was there in 2003, BCS was supposedly going away very soon, and it was all going to be FSXX1.

Ah yes, heard that OBC (WOBC when I was there) is now 8 weeks. It was only 6 just last February when I went through. SERE C? They said in 2003 that it was supposed to be there by the end of the year.....

 

[Ollie]

After trying to talk with everybody under the sun about what they flew, how they liked it, and other details, somebody finally told me to choose a mission, not an airframe. I thought about it for a while and it really made sense to me. At some point in instruments, all the students attended a brief where a pilot from each airframe give a talk about his aircraft and answered any questions. Each one showed pictures, movies, and told stories that they felt would help us make educated decisions on what we wanted to do with our careers. I chose the 47 mission. Everybody will tell you that their airframe is best for one reason or another - it's up to you to decide what's important to you.

 

[Ollie]

So is BCS still around? When I was there in 2003, BCS was supposedly going away very soon, and it was all going to be FSXX1.

Ah yes, heard that OBC (WOBC when I was there) is now 8 weeks. It was only 6 just last February when I went through. SERE C? They said in 2003 that it was supposed to be there by the end of the year.....

Yeah, BCS is still around. The majority of BCS students are NG/RES with active duty getting into the FSXXI slots.

As for the SERE C, you know how the rumor mill works. All I know is that they did a font page spot in the Army Flier about how CW2 Williams, one of the Apache pilots that was downed and subsequently captured a while back, is here putting the SERE C course together. Other than that, who knows...

 

[Traderd]

Thanks for the update Ollie. Doesn't seem like a whole lot has changed in 20years if they still utilize the UH-1 sim!

AC selection still seems reserved for the top performers. I always hated it for the guys prior to my class that ended up in the scout track because they performed the best.

One more question, are the WO's doing OBC with the RLO's now?

Thanks again and enjoy your career. I will admit to being biased to the Hawk. One of the primary reasons I left AD was based on the fact I was going to have to go 64's and I had just had enough of Attack and wanted something different. Cobra guys saw the writing on the wall since at the time they couldn't get enough guys through the Apache course and we already had quite a bit of gun time anyway.

Best of luck.

 

[weekendwarrior]

After trying to talk with everybody under the sun about what they flew, how they liked it, and other details, somebody finally told me to choose a mission, not an airframe. I thought about it for a while and it really made sense to me. At some point in instruments, all the students attended a brief where a pilot from each airframe give a talk about his aircraft and answered any questions. Each one showed pictures, movies, and told stories that they felt would help us make educated decisions on what we wanted to do with our careers. I chose the 47 mission. Everybody will tell you that their airframe is best for one reason or another - it's up to you to decide what's important to you.

Very well said. The mission. A friend of mine had passion for the Apache, but said, "I just don't like the mission". So he's flying -60s. He was number 1 in the class, so he could have had anything he wanted. For me, I'm National Guard, so I didn't have a choice, but if I were to do it all over again, I'd fly the Apache, just because I LOVE the aircraft. Plus, I came from an Artillery background, so guns and me get along real well.

All the guys I talked to really like the 47. Believe it or not, some people don't like their airframe. But you do find a way some way to like it. There are alot of things I don't like about the Apache, but I enjoy more than I dislike.

Whatever you choose, you'll like it I'm sure. Flight school is fun, you'll be frustrated at times but when you look back on it, you'll say you enjoyed yourself.

 

[Hobit]

Wannabe,

First of all, I hope you have checked out www.aptap.org

Just like everyone else has said, choose the mission. I chose Gun's for a very specific reason and didn't look back.
I LOVED being the guy who layed down the hate and discontent when some sh!tbag threatened my bud's.

Do NOT fall into the trap that most do and criticize the other airframes once you pick your path. Ask them about their mission and learn their mission too, you'll be working together if you are going to carry on the tradition of Army Aviation. A good precursor to this is the 'Common Area' in WOC school. (you'll understand)

You'll see the penile-envy syndrome big time in the real army(outside of TRADOC). But, when you go somewhere for real and you find yourself flying real-live missions with hawks, hooks, or scooters..you'll grow to realize the tough job they do and respect them because each airframe has great folks and they bring an awesome piece of the puzzle to the game. I know, I know, it sounds corny but it will click out in bum fork egypt some day when you see it all come together. That is the thing that makes the poor QOL worth it.

I chose Guns because I talked to a former attack dude who explained how all of the armament systems worked and the different types of warheads, weapons, and engagement techniques. WOW!!! that stuff is COOL!!!!!
I love the other missions and airframes but, I didn't want to hover down into a hot LZ and not be able to hurt the schmucks that were shootin at me. I also wanted to make things go BOOM! You don't get alot of ammo in the peace time army but, when you send missiles down range in the middle of the night and see the explosions, it's cool. Doing running and diving fire with rockets was my fave. The 30 mm was an extreme hoot also. When practicing firing it on or off axis with live rounds (exploding) I came to feel that I could honestly protect my CPG very well in most situations.

I flew the 'A' model Apache and absolutely enjoyed every flight (sans checkrides) but I have very good friends who flew the others and they had the same experience in their respective airframes.

Bottom line...

Work really hard in flight school because you will be on a two way live fire range some day- just the way things are. Don't be a hero. Do your job, nothing more, nothing less. Not trying to be 'over the top', it's the truth in this day and age.

With respect to what aircraft you fly, look around, pick one but realize this, and I promise you'll hear it again....
"Whatever AQC you end up in,make the most of it. Each airframe has it's benefits and problems."
The sorriest guys I saw were the ones that always whined about what airframe they wound up with. They are not part of the team and that is a fate worse than death.

Also,

It's not so much about the physical aircraft you fly... It's more about the guys and girls you fly with and for. Remember that more than anything. It will make sense in three or four years. Trust me. It's the PEOPLE, not the machines that keep me up till the wee hours of the morning.

Good Luck Brother.... work hard. The people on the ground will expect it!
AND THEY DESERVE IT!!!


Hobbit

P.S. Read 'On Killing' by Dave Grossman

 

[wannabearmy]

Great Advice everybody, I'd be honored to be able to serve next to any one of you. And maybe someday buy ya'll a round! What kind of a wait can I expect to get the final decision from Rucker after my state board this week? Thanks again - everybody.

 

[Ollie]

If I recall correctly, USAARL handles waivers. Their site. Have your recruiter contact the POC there and see if you can get a time frame for how long it will take for your waiver to go through.

 

[Nipsedaiser]

Good luck to ya Wanna.....wish I had some sage advice and/or info for ya-went thru my board in 1986 so I doubt I'd be the best resource. Just wanted to tell you to be prepared for the unexpected once you get thru the program. Army aviation can be fun but it definitely wasn't what I was expecting. Having said that, I did stay in a long time and recently hung up my spurs after 20 years combined active/reserve/guard service. If I can answer any questions from the UH-60 side of the house, let me know.

 

[wannabearmy]

Had my state board yesterday - It went awesome! I can't tell everybody here how much I appreciate their info and advice. From here I could know in as soon as 2 1/2 weeks if I get the final nod from Rucker. Nipsedaiser, I'd love to know your opinion on the UH-60s. What kinds of missions did you perform in your units? Thanks again everybody. By the way, if anybody has any tax questions, feel free to ask me. Free advice from a tax guy. It'd be nice to help some of you out.

 

[Nipsedaiser]

Congratulations on jumping the state hurdle. What state? I was texas guard the last few years....
UH-60 units of course have a variety of missions, so don't take what I might tell you to be what you might be doing if you get blackhawks. I was in an ACR (armored cav regiment) as my first unit and flew UH-1's there before I did the -60 school. I do NOT recommend a cav regiment as a desired assignment. Try to go to a straight aviation unit if you can. I flew the EH-60A in the cav, a mission that thankfully no longer exists. It was a boring job. I also got to fly some utility-type missions so that made some variety in my routine. I think the most fun I ever had flying UH-60's was in the national guard. We did a lot of things with them that i never saw on active duty-a lot of disaster relief-type things like rescuing people from floods and fighting brushfires with an underslung water bucket. Most of the flying I did on active duty involved the EH mission which wasn't much fun. Couldn't really tell you about airmobile-division ops (101st) or special ops because I never seved there. Feel free to ask any specific question you think I might be able to help with. If you want to fly an aircraft that affords you an opportunity to do a lot of different things, I'd recommend the black hawk. Like I've seen posted in this thread-decide on your mission of choice, do everything you can do get the airframe you want, and don't look back. Best of luck to ya. Let us crusty old farts know how it turns out for you. Can I get a hooo-waaaah? Later.

 

[Traderd]

Congratulations on jumping the state hurdle. What state? I was texas guard the last few years..

Were you with the unit that lost a Hawk at Ft. Erwin? We were getting ready to deploy when it happened. I did six rotations at that place in guns and always considered myself pretty lucky I didn't roll one over flying goggles.

Hard to believe we made it to the "crusty" phase isn't it? I can remember being a WOJG and thinking you had to be almost dead to make W4. I think the older warrants

 

[Jafar]

Very well said. The mission. A friend of mine had passion for the Apache, but said, "I just don't like the mission". So he's flying -60s. He was number 1 in the class, so he could have had anything he wanted. For me, I'm National Guard, so I didn't have a choice, but if I were to do it all over again, I'd fly the Apache, just because I LOVE the aircraft. Plus, I came from an Artillery background, so guns and me get along real well.

All the guys I talked to really like the 47. Believe it or not, some people don't like their airframe. But you do find a way some way to like it. There are alot of things I don't like about the Apache, but I enjoy more than I dislike.

Whatever you choose, you'll like it I'm sure. Flight school is fun, you'll be frustrated at times but when you look back on it, you'll say you enjoyed yourself.

As I've matured over the years my goals are oriented around mission as well. When I was a kid it was, "I want to fly that because it's awesome!" Now that I've got 8 years in the service I know what I'm all about and that has driven my aviation goals. I was an infantryman and later a tank crewmember. So now, in my pursuit of a pilot slot, (AF Reserve/ANG and now possibly WOFT or NG) just so long as it shoots I'm all about it. That's the trouble though. The majority of flying machines in the military don't shoot.

 

[Nipsedaiser]

Were you with the unit that lost a Hawk at Ft. Erwin? We were getting ready to deploy when it happened. I did six rotations at that place in guns and always considered myself pretty lucky I didn't roll one over flying goggles.

Hard to believe we made it to the "crusty" phase isn't it? I can remember being a WOJG and thinking you had to be almost dead to make W4. I think the older warrants

Yeah, that was our folks in that....we were **CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED****CENSORED** lucky we didn't lose any people in that. I know all the guys (5 from our unit) who were in that accident and fortunately all of them are fine. I wasn't there when that happened. I try to avoid going to NTC if I can. Hard to imagine, huh? I wasn't very good at avoiding it. When I was an a certain ACR which will remain nameless I did 5 rotations. Never had to go with the guard. Hope Wannabe doesn't mind us hijacking his thread for a few posts Take care. Don't let the crust get too thick.

 

[Nipsedaiser]

Sorry-
DARN lucky

 

[psysicx]

Why are Guard/reserve units deploying more then AD.And why are Apaches not as popular as UH-60 and 47?

 

[AA717driver]

Mini-hijack

After reading this thread I just wanted to put this out:

To those who have served and those who are serving and those who will, my family and I would like to thank you for your (and your family's) sacrifice and your service.

If you are deployed or will be deploying, please tell those over in Afghanistan and Iraq that we are thinking of them and praying for their safety every day.

Take care.

TC and family.

P.S.--If you know of any units that could use a care package, let me know. We sent a big box of Easter candy a couple of years ago to a friend's MC/AC-130 unit. We'd like to do it again. PM me with the address.

 

[weekendwarrior]

Why are Guard/reserve units deploying more then AD.And why are Apaches not as popular as UH-60 and 47?

It just appears that way, because we are relieving AD units already there. I know of many AD guys that have been there 2 or 3 times in the last couple years. The guard units are on a constant rotation now to allow the AD guys some RR. I know our unit will be there, it's only a matter of time.

The guard isn't the way to get your college paid for and never see action. If you sign up, you will go!

Hang in there brethren...see you in the sandbox sooner or later.

 

[SloDoDriver]

Capabilities aside, the Hook is about as ugly as they come. Don't know if I want to fly an aircraft that can have a midair with itself. Also had first hand knowledge of what a manpad missile can do to a Hook...not pretty!


SB

Up until the recent CH-53 crash the greatest fatalities occurred when 2 UH-60's collided over Tikrit...Doesn't make the 53 or the 60 a bad bird.
I have first hand knowledge of the Hook that was shotdown near Fallujah.
I knew CW4 Bruce Smith, the IP aboard, and had flown near the site days before. I was with 12th Avn Bde when it happened and was very upset at the loss of good friends and soldiers.
This is an unclassified site so I won't go into details, but you appear to be uninformed about the reasons for the shootdown and the resulting crash.
Everything in the Army inventory can be hit with the newest generations of manpads.
See how many 58's or 60's have the capability to fly in Afghanistan!
A Hook IP

 

[weekendwarrior]

Yeah, this thread is officially hijacked. The 47 comment about having a midair with itself is pretty crazy. I think the fact that the 47 is the oldest aircraft in the Army inventory and still flying says something about it's longevity, safety, and utility value.

Everyone likes to sling mud in good fun at the other airframes, but I tell you, I would feel proud to fly that bird as well.

I've been to the Electronic Warfare Officer school, and can agree, that most people's ideas what goes on with shoot downs are very mislead. What happens on the news and what actually occurs are two different things usually.