Will SWA keep the 717s?

[Ty Webb]

I thought the information that AAI was putting out when I got hired was that the 717 had a lower CASM on segments under 500 miles. AAI got those 717 for CHEAP. Plus 25 more that could probably be picked up for the economies of scale should be quite a match for a much more expensive 700-800 on short segments. I am sure SWA has the accountants crunching the numbers as we speak to finalize the 10 year plan.

The difference in cruise, if I remember correctly, is about 400-500 lbs per hour, per engine! That's $500./hr savings just in fuel.

The 737-700 carries 137 in current config.
The 717 carries 117

So, if your loads are lighter (ie your Mo-lines, your Wi-cheetahs, your Newport News) you can save $500/hr operating the 717.

 

[Lear70]

I thought the information that AAI was putting out when I got hired was that the 717 had a lower CASM on segments under 500 miles. AAI got those 717 for CHEAP. Plus 25 more that could probably be picked up for the economies of scale should be quite a match for a much more expensive 700-800 on short segments. I am sure SWA has the accountants crunching the numbers as we speak to finalize the 10 year plan.

Beisham published these numbers last year sometime (I don't know where he digs this stuff up), but the closest I could find was 2009 numbers.

Our 737's on a 1,000 nm average stage length were running 5.3 cents per ASM as compared to 6.4 cents per ASM for Southwest's 737's.

The 717's, when adjusted to that same metric (1,000nm) have a CASM of 7.8 cents per ASM. HOWEVER, the total CASM for 2009 reported by AirTran for BOTH aircraft combined was 9.1 cents per ASM. How to account for the disparity? Our 717's don't run 1,000 mile stage lengths. They run 500 mile stage lengths on average (which is why you heard what you heard).

That means our 717's, on our runs that we use them on, cost somewhere between 3.9 and 4.5 cents per ASM (it's hard to find a direct comparison, the Wyman report I'm referencing didn't compare just those two airplanes specifically, it was an industry-wide survey). The 717 does short runs VERY efficiently. More efficiently by far than JB's E190, and more efficiently than ANY RJ operator on a CASM basis, but compared to the 737, it's much more expensive if used on comparable routes.

It's definitely a short-haul niche segment aircraft, and I think you'll see them redeployed to do what they do best when combined into the rest of the SWA network. Just makes good financial sense.

 

[dicko]

I thought the information that AAI was putting out when I got hired was that the 717 had a lower CASM on segments under 500 miles. AAI got those 717 for CHEAP. Plus 25 more that could probably be picked up for the economies of scale should be quite a match for a much more expensive 700-800 on short segments. I am sure SWA has the accountants crunching the numbers as we speak to finalize the 10 year plan.

Agreed.

It is the true 'Regional Jet'. It's very efficient in lower yield markets over medium distances.

It's quiet and comfortable. It will be even more comfortable configured with SWA seat pitch. Given a choice I would always choose a seat on the 717 over a CRJ.

You can't do a single engine CAT 3B Autoland on an RJ.

 

[Monkey Face]

Southwest will keep the 717. I was told they are in negotiations with Boeing regarding purchasing the two sims. I believe the the sims will be placed in sim position two and three as they need hydraulics. That will leave only one -300 sim. Position nine and ten will be NG sims.

 

[canyonblue]

....it takes 90 min to fly there in a bonanza

Unless you're Buddy Holly.

 

[SWA/FO]

Unless you're Buddy Holly.

oh, man.....funny $hit.

 

[PapaWoody]

Unless you're Buddy Holly.

Then it takes the rest of your life!?! (Even I'm groaning at that one :laugh

 

[-9Capt]

Most people would say that the 717 deal by Joe Leonard saved this airline from extinction years ago and began the transformation into a profitable, major airline. If it was cost-efficient enough to contribute to that, I'd say it's likely worth keeping until a valid short-haul, small-community, high-yield replacement is found, but that's just my opinion. I'm sure there's many others.

Lear, the 717 order was made before JL was at AirTran.

 

[Lear70]

My bad... before my time, I thought JL was responsible for the 717's. Either way, I can't count the number of times a senior CA has said the 717's "saved this company" and turned it into the established, profitable, major airline it has been in recent years. With our loads in the summer months I have no doubt this will be yet another profitable year.

 

[SWA/FO]

I have no doubt this will be yet another profitable year.

Now that there is no debt. I'm sure it will be.:cartman: