Why is the ATP written such a Joke?

[Goose Egg]

Or are we professionals because we took the self initiative, motivation, discipline, skill and dedication to the public, our customers, our employers and yes our country to be the best United States Pilots that our Nation and World deserve?

I choose the latter.

I agreed with everything in your post until "yes our country..." I work really hard to be a professional, but I wouldn't consider it a patriotic duty. Moral duty, yes, but patriotic? Nope. You can save that ALPA propoganda crap for the Regionals forum. I came here to get away from it.

-Goose

 

[7574EVER]

I agreed with everything in your post until "yes our country..." I work really hard to be a professional, but I wouldn't consider it a patriotic duty. Moral duty, yes, but patriotic? Nope. You can save that ALPA propoganda crap for the Regionals forum. I came here to get away from it.

-Goose

I think what he meant was that our professionalism and safety record represent the safety record of the US's air transportation system. You couldn't pay me enough to get onto a burnt out old 727 of "no name airlines" in an African third world country.

Some rampers salute after pushback...and in return I'll give a quick salute back; however, I won't be been heard on the CVR reciting the Pledge of Allegiance at the same time.

 

[Goose Egg]

I think what he meant was that our professionalism and safety record represent the safety record of the US's air transportation system.

Ok, I can see see what you mean by that. My concern is that if the "safety record" is a point of national pride, which Rez seems to think it is, it becomes a separate entity than actually keeping the public safe. Superiority of the safety record becomes paramount to actual safety. That ain't right. My thought is that it's impossible to be safety conscious and self-congratulatory at the same time.

Anyway, forgive me for being so stubborn and hard-headed. I have tendency to do that from time to time.

Some rampers salute after pushback...and in return I'll give a quick salute back; however, I won't be been heard on the CVR reciting the Pledge of Allegiance at the same time.

Wow, if I saluted to a ramper, it would elicit either a grin or a blank stare, but definitely not a salute in return. But then again, I fly a turboprop, so things probably work a little differently.

-Goose

 

[7574EVER]

Wow, if I saluted to a ramper, it would elicit either a grin or a blank stare, but definitely not a salute in return. But then again, I fly a turboprop, so things probably work a little differently.

-Goose

haha well I've never been the first to salute. If they do...I'll return it. Who know. Maybe what I think is a salute is just them flashing a gang sign. You never know at some airports....

 

[flyer172r]

Are we professionals because the gov't ensures we are by creating a "difficult" written test? (Europe and the "rest of the World")

Or are we professionals because we took the self initiative, motivation, discipline, skill and dedication to the public, our customers, our employers and yes our country to be the best United States Pilots that our Nation and World deserve?

I choose the latter.

I agree with what you're getting at, but then what do we do about the pilots who choose neither?

 

[Goose Egg]

Maybe what I think is a salute is just them flashing a gang sign. You never know at some airports....

Lol!! Good call.

-Goose....er G.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

I agree with what you're getting at, but then what do we do about the pilots who choose neither?

People usually conform the the environment and culture they work and live.

Individual commitment to a group effort - that is what makes a team work, a company work, a society work, a civilization work.
-Lombardi


Public business, my son, must always be done by somebody. It will be done by somebody or another. If wise men decline it, others will not; if honest men refuse it, others will not.”
-Adams

"Posterity, you will never know how much it cost the present generation to preserve your freedom. I hope you will make good use of it. If you do not, I shall repent in heaven that ever I took half the pains to preserve it." -Adams

​

 

[timeless]

I don't want to sound like I'm disagreeing with your main point (because I'm totally not), but I have in my posession the FE (Fundamentals of Engineering, not Flight Engineer) Exam study guide. It's actually very similar to the ATP written test in terms of format (not content.) I can't speak for the CPA, Bar Exam, or medical boards. I understand the CPA comes in several parts. My dad has taken (and passed) it. I don't think that he has any desire to take it again.



That is awesome! I love that, and I may have to use it in my signature line. Unfortunately, I think the answer to the question is "no," and we've seen this proven over and over again.

It was actually the PE (professional engineer) and FE (fundamentals of engineering) Exams that made me realize that the ATP is a joke. Most of my family are engineers and they thought it was funny when I scheduled the ATP for friday and started studying on wednesday. I haven't taken the FE or the PE, but the study materials looked much more difficult than the ATP. The FE and PE questions and answers are also not published which seems to be a good idea when administering a test.

Good luck on the FE.

 

[avbug]

You're still in error to call the test a joke. However, in comparison to other locations, such as Europe, obtaining any pilot certificate in the US is a very simple endeavor.

Are you complaining that you got through your ATP so easily?

 

[NuGuy]

You're still in error to call the test a joke. However, in comparison to other locations, such as Europe, obtaining any pilot certificate in the US is a very simple endeavor.

Are you complaining that you got through your ATP so easily?

Heyas Avbug,

If I were king, I would swap around the part 135 mins for cargo with that of the CFI certificate.

250 hours to fly boxes, where the only person in jepoardy is the pilot.

1200 to teach another person, and hold his life in your hands, doesn't seem unreasonable.

Of course, I'll get flammed because I was a beneficiary of the system as it exists now, but change has to start somewhere.

I would endorse a more complex ATP academic requirement.

Nu