Why does MESA suck?

[Ender]

Hey guys im new to the forum and i was just curious why everyone hates MESA.

 

[Superpilot92]

Are you serious? Read about it, it wont take long to figure out.

 

[mcjohn]

I'd like to know as well. Read what? I don't want to cause any heat or anything but I've been so wrapped up in other issues that I've not had the chance to figure that one out and would just like someone's simple explanation. Is it because they pay so little and that hurts everyone?

 

[Ender]

Are you serious? Read about it, it wont take long to figure out.

Im new to the industry and have a lot of questions, i certainly will research the issue.

 

[wmuflyguy]

eh I had a Gamily Guy quote for this....but it would have probaly got me banned

 

[mcjohn]

Come on, let's here it.

Let me say, I know people that work for Mesa that worked really hard to get there (Conventional training then CFIing for years) so anyone that posts on this please try direct toward the company, not the pilots. I feel really sorry for some of those guys seeing how people dis so much. Something very positive should be said for someone that busted their a$$ CFIing in poverty and then goes to to fly regionals in poverty.
My hair is turning grayer by the minute as I look to the future 'cause I'm probably going to be one of those guys too.

 

[Midnight Flyer]

Hey guys im new to the forum and i was just curious why everyone hates MESA.

Regional pilots are taking routes that used to belong to majors and flying them using RJ's. Lots of regionals are doing this, it's just not Mesa. In this case, Mesa is flying the BIG RJ 90 seater out of PHX for example. They're flying big aircraft routes for puddlejumper pay. Basically they're selling out other pilots. Alot of the youngsters coming in from the ranks of a flight instructor just don't understand that they are driving down the wages by taking these jobs. Maybe they don't care, because they're excited about getting to fly a jet. I bet they will care later when they start to realize that they're flying a jet halfway across the country and only getting paid $30,000 per year to do it.
If the beancounters at all the airlines had it their way, everybody would get paid regional rates. The fact that these regional guys are doing it proves to the airlines that a pilot is willing to fly these routes for low low low pay.

 

[mcjohn]

Thanks for the explanation and the detailed example. It's people like me who will be leaping into the job market soon and really need to know the details. I sympathize with all involved and wonder, what should be done about this. It seems to me that placing blame on pilots is not right. What else are the pilots supposed to do. Quit? I can see having a little resentment towards them but can they really be blamed? I'd guess they're not too happy either and are trying to be optimistic about what the future will bring them. Elaborate a little more please. How about management. How about tickets being so cheap. How about me! I feel guilty for buying a round trip ticket from North Carolina to California for $189.00

 

[Superpilot92]

the work conditions and pay are horrible at mesa compared to other regional. Some of the other regionals have fought hard to try and make the regional lifestyle better only to get under cut by MESA. The problem is while mesa grows its killing the companys that moved forward to make things better. Look at Comair they worked hard to become industry leading only to be told they are to expensive now because other carriers are cheaper. Here at Xjet we are being threatened by Continental that they will pull 69 aircraft to try and get a lower bidder. 69 airplanes means around 690 pilots could be out of a job because Mesa might be cheaper. Why are they cheaper? Because people take the jobs at mesa which has the industrys worst pay and work rules. 5th year FO pay at mesa is what i make with 2nd year pay thats just stupid. Hopefully most people go there without knowing better. The industry is in a nose dive and until things change pay will continue to go down.

 

[UnstableAviator]

Blaming the incoming CFI-turned-regional pilot doesn't make much sense. There will always be people willing to fly for nothing, its up to us that currently have the regional jobs to make the difference. No CFI I know ever negotiated a regional airline contract or major airline scope clause.


In response to the original poster's question, Mesa is disliked for their work rules, pay, and general "undercutting" of other regional airlines.

 

[Superpilot92]

Blaming the incoming CFI-turned-regional pilot doesn't make much sense. There will always be people willing to fly for nothing, its up to us that currently have the regional jobs to make the difference. No CFI I know ever negotiated a regional airline contract or major airline scope clause.


In response to the original poster's question, Mesa is disliked for their work rules, pay, and general "undercutting" of other regional airlines.

Like i said alot of people go in unknowing but we need to start educating cfis. I CFIed and worked my way up and i promise my Resume never went to MESA. People need to do their research. I didnt get in this job to make regional wages forever and have shiaty work rules. I blame people who dont try and change things. Whens the next contract for Mesa supposed to come up? Hopefully they fight to change things.

 

[mcjohn]

Superpilot92 I gotta say your avatar's almost as cool mine. HA!
Anyway, what can be done about this? I really can't see this as the pilots fault. I'd take a Mesa job over washing dishes any day. People want to fly for a living and they get what job they can get. If a pilot sends resumes to 10 airlines and Mesa is the first to call, or the only one to ever call then what do you expect the pilot to do? Especially having busted a$$ instructing for 3 solid years in poverty and ready to move on. I've considered instructing at MAPD and not to fly for the airline afterwards, but to move on to night cargo, maybe 135 stuff or something. Would that be bad? I don't want to feel like I'm hurting the industry I've always dreamed of working in.
This whole thing is really interesting. People send applications everywhere knowing that some are not the best choice but instead something to fall back on. And then that's the call they get. Why is Mesa calling so many. And like the other guy said - it's not just Mesa. It's a whole bunch of these regionals undercutting other airlines right? I think an economics or sociology professor should design a course around this paradigm. It makes my head hurt!?

 

[Av8rPHX]

Whens the next contract for Mesa supposed to come up? Hopefully they fight to change things.

next contract is in 2007

 

[smellthejeta]

It seems to me that placing blame on pilots is not right. What else are the pilots supposed to do. Quit?

In a word, yes. I gave up on a flying career because my brethern before me have decided, through collective bargaining, that flying a jet is more important than making a decent living wage. I made almost $48k as a LINE GUY this year. Better than a 3rd year Mesaba SAAB CA. It would probably take six or seven years as a pilot to make the same money I'm making now (if I quit today), and an additional three years at a higher pay rate (than I'm making today) to make up for the money I "lost" working as a pilot at wages that were lower than I was making as a line guy.

I'm pursuing some other careers that will pay me enough to have my own aircraft. When you get right down to it, it *is* about the money. Ask several airlines pilots who have been around the block a few times if the "love" of flying is enough to pay the child support and alimony.

 

[EX_CV580FR8Dawg]

McJohn.... wheres your avatar from...it looks like an old western pacific ad or something?