Why did Skywest?

[Andy Neill]

I don't know what Mesa has defined their fiscal year as, but 1st Q earnings wouldn't be posted until sometime in May if it starts January 1st. Maybe they have a weird setup where 1st Q. earnings begin in December?

Trojan

MESA's first quarter of FY 2008 was 1 Oct 07 to 31 Dec 07.

 

[johnpeace]

Geniuses like Brad Holt...with the backing of Skywest Inc.?

I dunno, from where I sit, those look like some of the only people in the industry able to run a profitable airline.

I am pretty sure you're not even allowed to mention "ASA" and "strategic" in the same sentence with the geniuses that are running that company.

 

[CFI2766]

Rumor on the street is that Skywest has been asked to start exchanging CRJ's for Q400's or the larger ATR's. Its not in the contract but this is a plea from Delta to bring costs inline and still keep Skywest viable over the long term as a feeder. This message is rumored to be going out to other regionals as well.

What larger ATRs? The ATRs we have now are the largest that they make. There are newer versions out, with actual AVIONICS, but nothing larger that I know of.

The Q burns almost as much gas as the RJ, I think. The ATR does well, with a relatively small fuel burn, but is difficult to acquire. Consensus at the little GO in ATL is that there are no new ATRs to buy on short notice.

 

[Coool Hand Luke]

Geniuses like Brad Holt...with the backing of Skywest Inc.?

I dunno, from where I sit, those look like some of the only people in the industry able to run a profitable airline.

Two things:

First, don't confuse "geniuses" with "opportunists", which is exactly what ASA management is considering the whipsaw job they did on their pilots.

and second, I don't think rankings like this are indicative of good management either:

Atlantic Southeast Airlines (EV) [FONT=Arial,Arial]was included in the AQR for the first time in 2003. On-time performance was 66.0% (lowest of all carriers rated) in 2006, compared to 70.9% in 2005. Atlantic Southeast’s denied boarding performance was worse for 2006 (4.47 per 10,000 passengers in 2006 compared to 1.57 in 2005). Their mishandled baggage rate of 17.37 per 1,000 passengers is nearly three times the industry average rate of 6.50 bags per 1,000 passengers, and is similar to their 17.41 rate in 2005. Atlantic Southeast’s customer complaint rate of 0.74 complaints per 100,000 passengers was also worse than their 2005 rate of 0.58. Atlantic Southeast continues in 2006 (as in 2005 and 2004) to have the worst AQR score of any airline rated.
[/FONT]
I didn't look to see how 2007 turned out but I doubt that it was any better, probably worse.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Or that they keep upgrading captains with an effective date of 7/1... don't the first couple leave in June?

Don't you think that the junior line holders on the ATR will bolt before then to avoid going on reserve? Several of us are bidding off while we still can.

Contractually, they can't freeze or bypass captains on the ATR. They're going to have to upgrade people to fill those seats until the reductions begin in mid Fall.

 

[John Pennekamp]

What larger ATRs? The ATRs we have now are the largest that they make. There are newer versions out, with actual AVIONICS, but nothing larger that I know of.

The Q burns almost as much gas as the RJ, I think. The ATR does well, with a relatively small fuel burn, but is difficult to acquire. Consensus at the little GO in ATL is that there are no new ATRs to buy on short notice.

You're pissin' in the wind my friend.

From the viewpoint of a bean counter in Red Brick Building on Virginia Avenue, the Q400 is the ticket. Compared to the ATR, the low acquisition cost makes up for the higher fuel burn, even though it's a much less advanced and more maintenance intensive airplane. And airframes are readily available, which can't be said for new ATRs.

 

[120% Torque]

What larger ATRs? The ATRs we have now are the largest that they make. There are newer versions out, with actual AVIONICS, but nothing larger that I know of.

The Q burns almost as much gas as the RJ, I think. The ATR does well, with a relatively small fuel burn, but is difficult to acquire. Consensus at the little GO in ATL is that there are no new ATRs to buy on short notice.

Bigger ATR's as in ATR72 vs ATR42. If these do start replacing RJ's look for the regional routes to get smaller (400 miles or less is the sweet spot for these planes) and at these distances are actually much more efficient than RJ's and other narrow body planes.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Rumors are that Mesa is for sale. We will announce probably more losses tomm in the 1st quarter. You could buy Mesa for about 95 million and probably cheaper after the announcement tomm. Word is company is speeding up negotiations to get Labor contracts fixed.

Mesa is not for sale, it is for liquidation. After handing the escrow for the Hawaiian case $80 million, they have no cash. Mesa's entire market cap is about $80 million in assets. The Aloha case is expected to push $160 million. This will force the bankruptcy and liquidation of Mesa.

And yes, according to ASA/SkyWest management, SkyWest Inc is circling Mesa hubs like a flock of vultures.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Two things:

First, don't confuse "geniuses" with "opportunists", which is exactly what ASA management is considering the whipsaw job they did on their pilots.

and second, I don't think rankings like this are indicative of good management either:

Atlantic Southeast Airlines (EV) [FONT=Arial,Arial]was included in the AQR for the first time in 2003. On-time performance was 66.0% (lowest of all carriers rated) in 2006, compared to 70.9% in 2005. Atlantic Southeast’s denied boarding performance was worse for 2006 (4.47 per 10,000 passengers in 2006 compared to 1.57 in 2005). Their mishandled baggage rate of 17.37 per 1,000 passengers is nearly three times the industry average rate of 6.50 bags per 1,000 passengers, and is similar to their 17.41 rate in 2005. Atlantic Southeast’s customer complaint rate of 0.74 complaints per 100,000 passengers was also worse than their 2005 rate of 0.58. Atlantic Southeast continues in 2006 (as in 2005 and 2004) to have the worst AQR score of any airline rated.
[/FONT]
I didn't look to see how 2007 turned out but I doubt that it was any better, probably worse.

Whipsaw job? YGBFKM. What an idiot.

In case you didn't notice, we now have one of the best contracts (including pay rates) in the industry.

And as for ASA's poor performance, you are quoting old news (2006? WTF?!!!). In the most recent quarter, we are near the top in performance. So get a life, and stop bashing ASA.

 

[sqwkvfr]

The Q burns almost as much gas as the RJ, I think.

Frontier claims that the Q uses 33% less fuel than a comparable RJ.

 

[spg2bmd]

Q, or not, "circling like vultures", or not, we arent seeing to much in the way of pilot group expansion in the immediate future. Hopefully this will create some growth and seniority list movement for the ASA group.

 

[John Pennekamp]

Frontier claims that the Q uses 33% less fuel than a comparable RJ.

That's true. And the ATR-72-500 uses 50% less fuel than a Q400.

 

[cale42]

Q Burns 2000 PPH at econ cruise.. roughly 340KTAS.. I could be wrong but I don't think any 70+ seat RJ even touches that..

 

[TOOL CRIB]

Q Burns 2000 PPH at econ cruise.. roughly 340KTAS.. I could be wrong but I don't think any 70+ seat RJ even touches that..

A think a CRJ700 can get real close to that above FL350

 

[John Pennekamp]

Q Burns 2000 PPH at econ cruise.. roughly 340KTAS.. I could be wrong but I don't think any 70+ seat RJ even touches that..

From what I've heard, the Q400 burns more like 2200-2500pph with typical cruise speeds (340TAS).

ATR-72-500 burns about 1600pph and cruises at 275TAS.

 

[John Pennekamp]

A think a CRJ700 can get real close to that above FL350

2000pph? In a CRJ700? At what speed?

 

[cale42]

From what I've heard, the Q400 burns more like 2200-2500pph with typical cruise speeds (340TAS).

ATR-72-500 burns about 1600pph and cruises at 275TAS.

I've spent the better part of the last 3 weeks playing with fuel burns in the Q to see what it can and can't do. Like most planes the burn is significantly higher at barber pole. At 250.. which is where we always fly the Q barber poles at 248. It can do this easily.. that trues out to around 365 and will burn 24-2500 PPH. I can pull it back and set it based on fuel flow to exactly 2000PPH, at that point my indicated drops to around 220-225 with an equivalent true of 335-340.

So it all depends on what you want to do and how big of a rush your in.. but 2000PPH is a very attainable cruise number in the Q

cale

 

[John Pennekamp]

I've spent the better part of the last 3 weeks playing with fuel burns in the Q to see what it can and can't do. Like most planes the burn is significantly higher at barber pole. At 250.. which is where we always fly the Q barber poles at 248. It can do this easily.. that trues out to around 365 and will burn 24-2500 PPH. I can pull it back and set it based on fuel flow to exactly 2000PPH, at that point my indicated drops to around 220-225 with an equivalent true of 335-340.

So it all depends on what you want to do and how big of a rush your in.. but 2000PPH is a very attainable cruise number in the Q

cale

Attainable, but not typical. Which was my point. As you stated, typical burns are in the neighborhood of 2400-2500pph. A CRJ-200 is around 3000 and a CRJ-700 is around 3500.

Again, an ATR-72 is 1600-1800. 1/4 less speed, 1/4 less fuel. But it is French! Hehehe, hohoho!

 

[cale42]

I haven't flown RJ's but I would argue rarely do you fly a plane at barber pole all the time. 2500 PPH on the Q is at the pole. I wouldn't term that typical.. 10-20 knots under redline seems more typical to me thus my typical 2000PPH burn.. a Q under a good fuel savings plan could come awfully close to half the fuel costs of a same seat number CR7/9 EMB170/5..

 

[John Pennekamp]

I haven't flown RJ's but I would argue rarely do you fly a plane at barber pole all the time. 2500 PPH on the Q is at the pole. I wouldn't term that typical.. 10-20 knots under redline seems more typical to me thus my typical 2000PPH burn.. a Q under a good fuel savings plan could come awfully close to half the fuel costs of a same seat number CR7/9 EMB170/5..

You said:
Like most planes the burn is significantly higher at barber pole. At 250.. which is where we always fly the Q barber poles at 248.

This was where I was basing my comment. Sorry if I misunderstood.

 

[flyboyzz1]

The E jets are the worst fuel of them all

 

[Microclimates]

my flight instructor told me that if you lean the mixture real good the stretchbarbiejet can get about 3000pph at .77 above 350. but then you have to watch the cilinder temps...

 

[AV8700]

A think a CRJ700 can get real close to that above FL350

per side, yes

 

[BoilerUP]

From what I've heard, the Q400 burns more like 2200-2500pph with typical cruise speeds (340TAS).

ATR-72-500 burns about 1600pph and cruises at 275TAS.

Burn 600-800lb/hr more for 65kts TAS....but what would the fuel burn be in a Q400 if it flew the slower true airspeeds of an ATR-72-500?

 

[spg2bmd]

So, looked on PBS bid equipment feature for pairings next month. There is a new one, used to be CR2, CR7, CR9, now there is also CRX. CRJ 1000 perhaps? A leftover from a failed effort at more flying perhaps. Funny, though, our recent "contract had no rates for this ac. We had rates for emb 170/175, and now this pops up. Any ideas?

 

[Erlanger]

So, looked on PBS bid equipment feature for pairings next month. There is a new one, used to be CR2, CR7, CR9, now there is also CRX. CRJ 1000 perhaps? A leftover from a failed effort at more flying perhaps. Funny, though, our recent "contract had no rates for this ac. We had rates for emb 170/175, and now this pops up. Any ideas?

CRX is simply a CR7 and CR9 mix trip; nothing else.

 

[spg2bmd]

Makes sense. Hadnt seen that before. Are there/ have there been quite a few mixed trips in SLC?

 

[Erlanger]

Makes sense. Hadnt seen that before. Are there/ have there been quite a few mixed trips in SLC?

Those CRX trips only exist in SLC and you wouldn't see that "CRX" designation in PBS till you were qualified to fly both aircraft(CR7 & CR9).

From what I can see, there are approximately 360 CRX trips out of almost 2000 total trips.

 

[spg2bmd]

Have the 5 day trips been reduced in number? I understand that was a bit of an issue, inefficiency maybe.

 

[cale42]

You said:
Like most planes the burn is significantly higher at barber pole. At 250.. which is where we always fly the Q barber poles at 248.

This was where I was basing my comment. Sorry if I misunderstood.

Sorry.. I see how that wasn't clear.. that was an altitude reference.. FL 250.

cale