Who were the original pilots that agreed to this???

[CFIT]

In other words, how were pilots convinced to perform required tasks and not get paid for them?

ALPA....

 

[LarryinTN]

My $38 per hour translates into about $19 per hour. How?

Would you feel better if you were paid $19/hr for all of your time on duty?

 

[paulsalem]

Would you feel better if you were paid $19/hr for all of your time on duty?

I would.

I'd feel fine having a 3 hour sit, or waiting on an inbound airplane, or on Mx.

It would give us an incentive to get the flights in and out on time. (Well except for IN on the last leg). It would give me an incentive to go past 15 hours of duty.

Overall I think it would end up making us all more money.

 

[wahoo250]

And you would find that the schedules would be more productive...

 

[your_dreamguy]

Thanks for everyone's replies. How did ALPA and the senior pilots allow this to happen? What convinced them that pilots should be paid this way? When was the tipping point? 1950's, 60's 70's, 80's, 90's ???? Do you think we'll ever get paid for ground time in the future?

 

[NCFlyer]

About 10 years ago, in preparation for upcoming negotiations, I suggested that we look at a compensation arrangement that paid by the duty hour and not flight hour. I had a list of several advantages over the current system. I admitted that there would be huge hurtles to overcome in order to make the transition to a duty hour pay system.

Their response was "no one gets paid that way" and they looked at me like I was standing there with 3 heads!

I tried to convince them that just because no one else was paid that way didn't mean that it couldn't be to our advantage to do so.

Needless to say, my proposal went no where.

 

[CesnaCaptn]

Frontier used to be salary and then negotiated to be paid hourly. That leads me to believe that hourly pay is better.

If you want to be paid for your time on duty, the company could come to you and say, "instead of making $38 per hour, you now make $38,000 per year salary." If they did that, you would have no leg to stand on when you fly over block, they lay you over for 48 hours, or they give you one 1 hour leg a day.

I agree that hourly with rigs is the way to go.

 

[filejw]

The other day, I was talking to a friend and the topic of my pay came up. I told him, I make $38 per hour and he said wow!! You see, my friend works as an engineer in the real world. So, he thinks my $38 per hour translates into $76000 per yr as it would if I worked as an engineer, architect, etc. That got me thinking as to my real pay. My $38 per hour translates into about $19 per hour. How?

There are plenty of things that I am required to do but DO NOT get paid for.

I am required to:

Read company information letters,
check company email,
update my company material such as Jepp charts,
perform a pre-flight walk-around,
program an FMS,
get ATIS,
get a clearance,
program weight and balance,
read checklists,
take long scheduling sits, on the order of 3 to 4 hours.
etc.
without getting paid.

Now, I accepted this when I first got hired. However, that has never stopped me from thinking as to how our situation got this way. In other words, how were pilots convinced to perform required tasks and not get paid for them? Who were the original pilots that accepted that just brake release to brake set was considered work? How is it that this work has not been negotiated as pay by our unions? If my airline does not want to pay me $38 per hour to read a checklist, how about at least $10 per hour,"ground time?" I cannot think of too many other professions or industries where the employees are not paid for tasks that they are REQUIRED to perform. Can you? Also, in the future, can we (airline pilots) negotiate this required work as pay into our future contracts?
Your two cents?

As per normal on this site nobody answered the guys question although somebody did mention "Flying the Line".. I'm really sure it was back in the 1930's but with out the book handy can't tell you if it was ALPA or management.

 

[LarryinTN]

Overall I think it would end up making us all more money.

Why would you think that when you calculated the $19/hr figure based on what it would take to earn the exact same pay under the alternate system?