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"Where have all the Pilots Gone?"

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Hi!

Stats:
U.S. 2001 2006 % Change
Student Starts 61,839 61,448 -1
CFIs 82,875 91,343 +10
Commercial 120,502 117,610 -2
ATP 144,702 141,935 -2
The above growth, or lack of it, worked, because Commercial Airline growth in the US was minimal-Domestic Capacity was up only 1.9%

This is when things get really bad:
U.S. 2006 2020 % Change
Student Pilots 84866 100,181 +18
Commercial 117,610 130,590 +11
ATP 141,935 145,655 +3
Total Pilots 597,109 651,752 +9

Comm PAX 768mill 1.2bill +56%
RPMs (trillions) .79 1.4 +77%
Comm Aircraft 7,626 11,203 +47%
So, we (the pilots) are going to support an increase in Commercial Aircraft of 47%, and increase in Commercial PAX of 56%, and an increase in RPMs of 77%, with ONLY an increase in the number of ATPs of 3%, and an increase in Commercial Pilots of just 11%? How is this going to work???

And, it just gets worse:
Globally 2006 2020 % Change
Comm Acft #s 17,000 30,000 76%
Commercial PAX growth per year is forecast to be 5.3% PER YEAR, while freight growth is forecast to be 5.9% PER YEAR. All this while the US has 3% more ATPs over the WHOLE 14 YEAR PERIOD.

Remember, that we, the US, is currently the ONLY country that produces any number of excess pilots. EVERYWHERE ELSE is experiencing more airline seats opening than the numbers of commercial pilots they can produce.

Here's some more interesting info:
U.S.
[FONT=Helvetica, sans-serif]Student pilots are important to general aviation and the aviation industry as a whole. In 2006, according to statistics compiled by the FAA’s Mike Monroney Aeronautical Center, the number of student pilots decreased by 2.7 percent. This is the second consecutive year of decline in this important pilot category.[/FONT]
The FAA is planning on 6300 VLJs flying by 2020, while the current number is basically 0.

China, India, and Worldwide Growth:
Through 2020:
China's GDP will quadruple.
1/2 of the World's GDP growth will be
1-China: yearly GDP growth of 6%
2- US: yearly GDP growth of 2.9%
3-India: yearly GDP growth of 5.9%
China will be the same economic size as the US by 2020.

What does this mean for aviation, and the pilot shortage?
Between 1980 and 1998, China's Domestic PAX airlines grew at an average rate of 16.5% per year

North America's domestic freight market has 770 aircraft. China currently has LESS THAN 7!
Remember, by 2020, China will be the same economic size as the US!

Asia's freighter fleet will increase by 340%, to 419 aircraft, by 2020.

The top 5 countries buying new aircraft through 2020 will be:
1-US
2-China
3-Great Britain
4-Germany
5-India

And, to top it all off:
China is currently producing 1,000 pilots per year.
India was producing 150 per year, but that was before 2 of its 5 flight training schools had to close because all of their instructors were hired by the Indian airlines. Sound familiar?

The pilot shortage Tsunami is just beginning.

When American gets around to hiring, they will be the last ones, with UPS/FedEx/SWA already hiring again, and all the other majors already hiring. They will get a much lower return of furloughees than they expect, and the number and quality of applicants will probably shock them.

What does this mean for you and I?

HOLD OUT FOR MORE PAY!!!

Good luck to you!

cliff
ABQ
 
To top that off, look at all the corporate jet charter operations there are. Our lowest time FO has 350 hours TT and he's an FO in the CJ, King Air, and the 550 Citation (part 91 w/in the 48). Most of our FO's don't have too much more time than that. Some of our Hawker 700/800 FO's have just under 1,000 TT. Those guys still arn't easy for us to get. They're all going to SkyWest, ExpressJet, ect. We do pay our FO's a decent charter salary and if they're contract it's 250 per day. Not bad for 350 to 1000 hours TT.

We're growing at our company. Everybody in SoCal is on aircraft buying spree. If we're having a hard time finding FO's, how about finding Captains! Can't upgrade FO's b/c not enought TT, can't find Captains willing to move to SoCal!! Don't get me wrong, we're a great company, great place to work, great people, good pay. We even pay a flight hour bonus! 10 bucks extra per flight hour. I Captain the SII and the Bravo and average between 50 and 70 hours per month. Our King Air guys are flying more. That's an extra 6-8k average per year. And we're still having trouble finding qualified Captains.

I can just imagine what it's going to be like a few years down the road! My .02
 
I've seen it too. We just started two FOs for the king air/hawker part of our fleet with less than 1000tt. This has, until now been unheard of-we needed almost double that when I came in 5yrs ago.

The best example I can think of also is me. I have two mid-size jet types and 3200hrs, whoopee. Even a couple of years ago would I have been able to get an interview at NWA? No.

Things-are-a-changin, I'm just not sure what to do about it.
 
RAH has lowered their mins despite what the article says. I have two friends hired there with 500-600 TT and 50-100 ME to fly the ERJ-170. One is already on line flying.
 
And just think in 1977 a Navy pilot with an ATP, L-188 type, 2700 TT, 2400 MEL, and 2200 Turbine, at age 33 I could not get an interview anywhere except a non-sked at YIP.
 
is it really that good.....I have been a FO for a long time.....I would of been an FO for 5-6 years at ASA before I would of upgraded

I now Pinnacle was running around 2 years

I am getting close at Flex it appears to be around 2-2.5 years

Maybe there is a lot of turnover at the bottom

I find it hard to believe a Pinnacle captain to make 80-90/ must work all the time and been there 10 plus years.....why do CEO types give facts that are not exactly true
 
is it really that good.....I have been a FO for a long time.....I would of been an FO for 5-6 years at ASA before I would of upgraded

I now Pinnacle was running around 2 years

I am getting close at Flex it appears to be around 2-2.5 years

Maybe there is a lot of turnover at the bottom

I find it hard to believe a Pinnacle captain to make 80-90/ must work all the time and been there 10 plus years.....why do CEO types give facts that are not exactly true

Why do CEO types not tell the whole truth publically - it's not to their advantage sometimes. Somebody further up in this thread pointed out that the mainline's that the regionals serve certainly don't want to hear they can't find pilots. At some companies, like RAH, they are in the middle of contract negotiations. There's nothing like publically announcing that you are having a hard time finding pilots without giving up your ability to negotiate a contract that doesn't give away some of that ever important "not so honest CEO type" bonus money. It's all like a game of poker. As soon as I can read a thread like this without hearing pilots giving away their hand by saying there is no shortage, I might start believeing pilots as a whole stand a chance of making a little more money. Until then, "there's no shortage" = There's no hope.
 
And just think in 1977 a Navy pilot with an ATP, L-188 type, 2700 TT, 2400 MEL, and 2200 Turbine, at age 33 I could not get an interview anywhere except a non-sked at YIP.

You still down there? USA jet? Hows things going?
 
Still there

You still down there? USA jet? Hows things going?
Still here living the good life. It has been a fantastic adventure I would change little
 
To top that off, look at all the corporate jet charter operations there are. Our lowest time FO has 350 hours TT and he's an FO in the CJ, King Air, and the 550 Citation (part 91 w/in the 48). Most of our FO's don't have too much more time than that. Some of our Hawker 700/800 FO's have just under 1,000 TT. Those guys still arn't easy for us to get. They're all going to SkyWest, ExpressJet, ect. We do pay our FO's a decent charter salary and if they're contract it's 250 per day. Not bad for 350 to 1000 hours TT.

We're growing at our company. Everybody in SoCal is on aircraft buying spree. If we're having a hard time finding FO's, how about finding Captains! Can't upgrade FO's b/c not enought TT, can't find Captains willing to move to SoCal!! Don't get me wrong, we're a great company, great place to work, great people, good pay. We even pay a flight hour bonus! 10 bucks extra per flight hour. I Captain the SII and the Bravo and average between 50 and 70 hours per month. Our King Air guys are flying more. That's an extra 6-8k average per year. And we're still having trouble finding qualified Captains.

I can just imagine what it's going to be like a few years down the road! My .02

Just out of curiosity, what exactly would said Captains that you're having difficulty finding, make flying those aircraft you mention in Southern California? How many days would said Captain be required to be on a pager?
 
Hi!

PCL new hires who meet the captain quals have been bidding and awarded their capt bid during indoc. Mesaba is hiring street captains, as well as several other regionals.

cliff
GRB
 
For me, I recently left the airlines because it really comes down to QOL, and fair work rules. Being away from my family, no weekends off, forced to fly darn near for free on my days off.

I said to myself," I can find better work doing something better and more meaningful in my life." Call it what you like, but my family is happy, I'm happy and the overall QOL is much healthier. It's also been fun rediscovering how much fun it is to fly a small plane for change for leisure purposes.

When I add in going home at 5, weekends off and way better benefits. I reflect at the airline bs and I ask myself, " what was I fighting for?" I now am a former airline pilot and I'm never coming back.

LIFE is too short and my priorities are my family first and flying for a badly run regional doesn't make my top 40. So this is one pilot's reason why there is a pilot shortage.

Radiohofo
 

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