When does med kick in for USAIR

[livintheredream]

Just trying to way my options. Does medical coverage kick in day one at USAIR or later like 6months like CAL.

 

[FR8mastr]

Day 1 for returning furloughees

 

[weasel_lips]

Benifits are day 1 for newhires.

I understand first year pay is now $38,000 instead of $36,000. (uncomfirmed)

You can bid off the E190 after 12mo. so don't sweat that.

Retirements out the wazoo are coming up.

 

[livintheredream]

Thanks

 

[Fast43]

Retirements out the wazoo are coming up.

And they can't come soon enough either, soon AWA will be the majority. Something AAA doesn't even want to think about.

Maybe soon when age 65 kicks in, and upgrades stop you guys might rethink the whole not participating in the JNC process thing.............if you want a raise!!!

Best I can tell, all those Resolutions flying out of your MEC office have failed to put even one dollar in anyones bank account.......cept Dougs

Now that is some High Quality Representation !!!!

 

[Crzipilot]

You see...even with 65, guys are going to upgrade, and move off reserve to a line holder...and well......from what I hear, that's a sufficient enough raise for those guys to not sell their seniority. I keep hearing the west guys talk about, live under loa93, etc etc...and the east guys are answering with......we will.....

 

[cactusboy53]

Livin';
Welcome back. There will be slots in PHX / LAS too. Winter is great time to be in AZ / NV!! It's a whole new airline, and this can be a great place to work. Money will get better soon, and growth to follow.

 

[WickedPissa]

Does the company pay for your hotel through training? Where do they interview?

 

[weasel_lips]

Yes, hotel is paid for all of your training. + full salary + per diem + positive space travel to and from

I just read this on the payrates for first year: (correction to the above - again unconfirmed)

First year pay will be $41,000 on the 190 but $38,000 on group 2, an anomaly of the negotiating process

 

[weasel_lips]

And they can't come soon enough either, soon AWA will be the majority. Something AAA doesn't even want to think about.

Maybe soon when age 65 kicks in, and upgrades stop you guys might rethink the whole not participating in the JNC process thing.............if you want a raise!!!

Best I can tell, all those Resolutions flying out of your MEC office have failed to put even one dollar in anyones bank account.......cept Dougs

Now that is some High Quality Representation !!!!

Could we please try to have an informative thread to help those who might want to work here. They are only trying to find out the details of the company and to have their questions answered.

There are already countless threads full of both sides throwing insults at each other.

I think we can find a common ground in helping prospective applicants.

 

[PHXFLYR]

You see...even with 65, guys are going to upgrade, and move off reserve to a line holder...and well......from what I hear, that's a sufficient enough raise for those guys to not sell their seniority. I keep hearing the west guys talk about, live under loa93, etc etc...and the east guys are answering with......we will.....

LOA 93 is $129 top end rate Capt, $81 top end rate F/O for group 2 aircraft. And you consider that "a sufficent enough raise" ??? Ohhhh -Kayyy !!!


PHXFLYR

 

[dirkdigler]

Heard in the grape vine - US Air awarded China route.

Not confirmed but I heard somewhere that US Air has been awarded China route. If true, it will be HUGE for US Air. Domestic flying is way too saturated. You've gotta go where the money is!!!

 

[WickedPissa]

Yes, hotel is paid for all of your training. + full salary + per diem + positive space travel to and from

I just read this on the payrates for first year: (correction to the above - again unconfirmed)

First year pay will be $41,000 on the 190 but $38,000 on group 2, an anomaly of the negotiating process

Thanks.

 

[Ex737Driver]

Not confirmed but I heard somewhere that US Air has been awarded China route. If true, it will be HUGE for US Air. Domestic flying is way too saturated. You've gotta go where the money is!!!

Will US codeshare or wet lease? They have no aircraft that will make China. The XWB won't be available until 2013ish.

 

[PHXFLYR]

We have access to five A340's.

PHXFLYR

 

[Ex737Driver]

We have access to five A340's.

PHXFLYR

Elaborate..........

 

[Crzipilot]

LOA 93 is $129 top end rate Capt, $81 top end rate F/O for group 2 aircraft. And you consider that "a sufficent enough raise" ??? Ohhhh -Kayyy !!!


PHXFLYR

Well considering that with the arbitration award, most of those F/O's will never see 129.00, and only TOS f/o at 81. I would say some is better than nothing. Even if you are optimistic, and say that with the combined seniority list comes the new contract with raises, since when as AW ever been industry leading with their pay scales???? So what would you estimate as TOS f/o rates with a new contract??? Higher or lower than 129/hr. Or look at Grp I, and even the 330, as some of those f/o's will be able to hold capt. positions on those aircraft, but most likely WON"T be able to with the St. Nick award.

 

[Crzipilot]

As to the A340 availability, it was reported elsewhere that the 5 500's that AC has, have gone back onto the market, I guess the deal with TAM fell through. I believe Parker said if we got the China route, they would get the aircraft and fly them to some other destinations (Tokyo if rights available, Telaviv, Moscow, etc..) prior or concurently to launching China service. What's interesting is last month the US ground school instructors already had a bid for A340 instructor positions, effective Jan 08. So the East side is already ramping up the training...

 

[PHXFLYR]

Well considering that with the arbitration award, most of those F/O's will never see 129.00, and only TOS f/o at 81. I would say some is better than nothing. Even if you are optimistic, and say that with the combined seniority list comes the new contract with raises, since when as AW ever been industry leading with their pay scales???? So what would you estimate as TOS f/o rates with a new contract??? Higher or lower than 129/hr. Or look at Grp I, and even the 330, as some of those f/o's will be able to hold capt. positions on those aircraft, but most likely WON"T be able to with the St. Nick award.

Hey,you'll never hear me say that AWA payrates are "industry leading". I just find it interesting how your statement regarding the current LOA 93 rates for Group 2 aircraft constituets a "sufficent enough raise" (your words,not mine ) from your perspective,especially when they pay less than current AWA book rates. Rumor I'm hearing for top end F/O rate was $112/hr, not to sure what aircraft ,though. But,hey if a top end rate of $81/hr works for you,don't let me stand in your way...... Regarding 330 Capt slots, I think a very small percentage out of the entire East senority list will be able to hold Captain on the airplane any time soon,given the small number of aircraft in the fleet. Will you be able to hold it soon?? If not,how long are you willing to wait and what price are you willing to pay? How many years at your current hourly rate are you willing to wait? But ,hey if that's what you chose to hold out for, while knocking back $81/hr, then have at it. Me? If I were in your postion,I'd rather try for a pay raise for my current fleet and position plus all the other fleets and positions at my airline, rather than try to "protect" something that I may or may not bid at a later date. But that's just me. I'm sure you'll do whats best for you. And so it goes.....


PHXFLYR

 

[Crzipilot]

Your points are accurate, from your POV. If I'm at TOS, and close to checking out, but unable to check out with the implementation of the award. Would I want to stay at a possible 122/hr, or the 129/hr??? Seems to me the extra 7k would work. If I was on the bottom of the list. I could ride the 1400 retirements in the next 5 years, up the list to a block holding f/o and possible reserve capt. With the Award, I would have close to 1000 f/o's dumped on top of me, which they would ride the retirements up the list, and I'd still prob. be on reserve. So the question is, would I make more money as a reserve f/o under a new contract, or as a line holding f/o under LOA 93. I think if you run the numbers, it's basically a wash, and under LOA 93 I have a better chance of getting the left seat before retirement.


I do have to say, the feeling I get is, the West guys definately want a new contract. With the tie in of the East side, they have definately jumped up in size, stature, and corporate earnings. Rightfully so, you want a piece of that pie, and think that dangling that pay raise carrot in front of the east guys they will drool over it (likely possiblity). though I think a lot of them are comparing working under LOA 93 and advancing, or new contract and going backwards or stagnating. But that's right, those retirements aren't going to amount to any advances for the east guys working under loa93

 

[PHXFLYR]

Gross over-generalizations on your part and here they are:


First, while you may indeed ride the 1400 retirement wave within the next 5 years it may not neccesarily lead you to the reserve Captain seat that you think it might. You know better than anyone some of the fates that can befall a pilot during the course of ones career. So to say that retirement wave might take you to a Reserve Captain seat (and I hope for your sake it does),I would qualify that with a "maybe".You also say that if the Nicolau list comes to fruition (and we both know that it will,whether we want it to or not) the 1000 F/O's that would come in on top of you would push you back on reserve. I say "bolderdash and here's why. Just look at the numbers. 1400 east retirements;1000 of us evil "westies" come in on top of you. Thats still a net gain of what? 400 retirements from the east not to mention the 110 retirements we have out west . Plus the recently announced service to China . I heard 5 airplanes and 70 crews per plane. Thats alot of manpower thats gonna be required and a hell of a lot of movement. So to say that the implementation of the new senority list will push you back down on reserve, I find that hard to believe. Anyway thats all for now. Gotta get out in the yard and get some things done around the house before Momma comes home and rips me a new one for slummin' on the computer!


Se Ya

PHXFLYR

 

[PHXFLYR]

Your points are accurate, from your POV. If I'm at TOS, and close to checking out, but unable to check out with the implementation of the award. Would I want to stay at a possible 122/hr, or the 129/hr??? Seems to me the extra 7k would work. If I was on the bottom of the list. I could ride the 1400 retirements in the next 5 years, up the list to a block holding f/o and possible reserve capt. With the Award, I would have close to 1000 f/o's dumped on top of me, which they would ride the retirements up the list, and I'd still prob. be on reserve. So the question is, would I make more money as a reserve f/o under a new contract, or as a line holding f/o under LOA 93. I think if you run the numbers, it's basically a wash, and under LOA 93 I have a better chance of getting the left seat before retirement.


I do have to say, the feeling I get is, the West guys definately want a new contract. With the tie in of the East side, they have definately jumped up in size, stature, and corporate earnings. Rightfully so, you want a piece of that pie, and think that dangling that pay raise carrot in front of the east guys they will drool over it (likely possiblity). though I think a lot of them are comparing working under LOA 93 and advancing, or new contract and going backwards or stagnating. But that's right, those retirements aren't going to amount to any advances for the east guys working under loa93

We don't want a pay raise for the "west guys". We want it for "all the guys" both east and west.(and the pretty girls,too!!) . How about getting your JNC back to the bargening table so we can both kick Doogie's a$$ together?? Regarding the comparision of advancing and pressing on under LOA 93 you guys do realize that advancing is like a big game of musical chairs. Once the music stop, thats it, no more upgrades. Will you be able to upgrade before that happens? Or will you be one of many left holding the bag,working at TOS Group 2 F/O rates during the next economic downturn.Unless your lucky enough to get an upgrade award during this particular ,those who are thinking about dragging this period of seperate ops out to capture your attrition are getting ready to sell you recallees down the river yet again should that happen. They are going to get just so many upgrades accomplished before the next economic downturn occurs or all the vacencies are filled. Then what?? Better to try to achieve an increase in hourly rate across the "seats and fleets" as I mentioned in a previous post,than to try to protect something that will only benefit a few long term. Seems to benefit the most pilots regardless of where you are on the senority list or the aircraft flown. But then again ,what do I know? . Regarding the stagnation that you seem to mention in most of your posts, I think whatever stagnation that you think might occur will be mitigated with the start of the overseas expansion Parker is interested in doing and the retirements amongst the 2 pilot groups. The only thing that might derail that would be another merger. (Oh ..No...not another!! ) Anyway this is truly it . Gotta get out in the yard or else I'm a dead man for sure. But now that I think about it,that will get you another senority number!!

See ya

PHXFLYR

 

[Crzipilot]

Can always use the number, so keep posting on here please..HAHAHA....

anyways, your angle on industry downturn and such, well I think we'd be more so hurt by the St. Nick award then keeping seperate. If your right about the 70 crews/340....that's about 350 New hires, plus the vacancies on the east as it sits. PLUS the vacancies of the retirements, equals farther up the list. As opposed to having the award implemented and becoming instant protection for all 800 of those West f/o's, especially when the staffing levels (at least around a year ago) were such that the west was staffed close to 2 crews/AC more than the East side. The east side has been run ragged, and with your stagnation, might have been a result of some East Mgmt, coming in looking at the numbers and finding a way to run you guys leaner than what you were. I would imagine that's close to the case, especially with the delay/wx prone NE that the majority of our flights are run, and we operate with less crews/ac. Of course those numbers may have changed some as I haven't looked lately.

Again I don't find much fear in your downturn scenerio, again just looking at the staffing levels, and the retirement numbers. No I probably won't be close to a 330 capt position, but I bet I'll be close to a 76I position at 100+/hr. With the award in place, prob. still a 320/737 reserve. Haven't seen much in the sense of growth out west, Hawaii, but other than that, seems your west market is kinda tapped out. Meanwhile, the east coast is still expanding so it seems. Int'l, and as the 190's come online, they are taking the place of alot of the 50 seater routes (pay sucks, but capt rate is liveable for the time being) PDT and PSA both are putting a/c on the ground, and those routes are being taken up by something, mostly 175's/190's. Both claim it's staffing levels (which it is) but it also plays into parkers plane to reduce the number of 50 seaters flying around. (remember REP 175's were replace a bunch of their 50 seaters)

It would be nice to have a combined contract seniority list, and a little raise and better work rules to go with it. But it seems that those that have stayed active have aclimated to the reduced pay/work rules and those that are returning, Well as the bypass ratio shows, many have found better jobs elsewhere. Those that are returning are doing so for a number of reasons, the Biggest is, it's still better at US than where we've ended up. Hell a number of us even prob. applied to AWA when we were unemployed after 9/11, and never got a call......Guess the 320 time or 737 time wasn't qualified enough. Or as some have heard (we aren't hiring major furloughees, as you'll be recalled in a few months...HAHAH) Either way, wherever we ended up, is below what we are looking towards at US East, so if we don't get a raise soon, it's still a raise in the bigger picture. Sooner we get off reserve, even better pay and QOL. So the question and analysis is, which provides that faster, A combined list, or seperate??? You say combined (in the form of a new contract), I saw possible as seperate. Looking at the pay scales, 7th yr pay across the board. West is 7.00 more than East on 320/737, but East is 5.00 more on the 757 not counting the Int'l overide which I think is 1.80. In addition, the 190 capt pays 3.00 more than a West F/O..... This leads back to the supposebly pay raise. You state 121 top f/o, but unknown aircraft. Knowing how cheap West mgmt is, I would imagine that's for a 330. Though lets say 757. that would mean TOS 320 at about 102. As a reserve, that would come out to about 7600/month at TOS. If your a block holder, at 7th year pay, could prob. come close to that AND have a better QOL than reserve......hmmm...which would you choose?

 

[PHXFLYR]

The one that would bring home the most cash. Trust me ,$7600 dollars with deductions for federaltax, state tax, 401k deposit, medical coverage and whatever else you can think of easily wipes out 50 percent of that figure. But you go ahead and keep on keepin on.You sound like you got all the angles covered. I'm getting tired trying to talk sense with you guys. Good luck.


PHXFLYR

 

[Crzipilot]

Never sais 7600 was a great amount, But at your 8 year pay rate, Well that's about what you get at 90hrs/month. personally don't want to work that much, will do if I have to. But I think the last figure Scooter passed across the table was about a 3% raise off your payscale not much of a light there.

So with the combined list being implemented your guaranteing that the east 16yr f/o's are going to stay at that level, and by your own words, not much to go on. So in your words, the one that brings in the most cash, is whatever way those guys can get to the left seat. They aren't going to see it with the Nic award in place??? Or in your thinking, they will??? Would like to know how you figure that one.

You've got your left seat, so you dont' have to get by on that meager 7600/month, those 16 yr guys are doing (albiet, a little higher than that as they are TOS...)

So in essence you answered your own question, as to why the heart ache over the award. Which choice brings in the most cash.....always the bottom line....

 

[Boeing747Driver]

Benifits are day 1 for newhires.

I understand first year pay is now $38,000 instead of $36,000. (uncomfirmed)

You can bid off the E190 after 12mo. so don't sweat that.

Retirements out the wazoo are coming up.

That is not accurate info if they are placed on the West Contract.

No Per diem if based and trained in PHX
No Hotel if based and trained in PHX
90 days for medical
Full Pay in training.

 

[PHXFLYR]

Never sais 7600 was a great amount, But at your 8 year pay rate, Well that's about what you get at 90hrs/month. personally don't want to work that much, will do if I have to. But I think the last figure Scooter passed across the table was about a 3% raise off your payscale not much of a light there.

So with the combined list being implemented your guaranteing that the east 16yr f/o's are going to stay at that level, and by your own words, not much to go on. So in your words, the one that brings in the most cash, is whatever way those guys can get to the left seat. They aren't going to see it with the Nic award in place??? Or in your thinking, they will??? Would like to know how you figure that one.

You've got your left seat, so you dont' have to get by on that meager 7600/month, those 16 yr guys are doing (albiet, a little higher than that as they are TOS...)

So in essence you answered your own question, as to why the heart ache over the award. Which choice brings in the most cash.....always the bottom line....

That is correct. But the way you're going about it will end up hurting your bottom line.Somehow you fail to see that and I'm getting tired of trying to point it out
to you. So like I said in my last post,take care and good luck. You seem to have it all figured out,are content with LOA 93 rates,really don't need a raise
because whatever raise you forfeit will be offset by your climb up the senority ladder and will be recouped when you get that coveted left seat at- "Drum roll,please-" $129/hr Good luck,amigo. Something tells me you guys are gonna need it!

PHXFLYR

 

[Crzipilot]

Talking sense into us??? lets see...is 129/hr better than 83/hr?? Or the possible 100/hr with a combined contract?? Yup.....hence the bottom line.

although of course, I think the west guys have lots more to gain with the combined seniority list, than the east guys do. Seperate, East gains more, losses fewer. Combined, West gains more...losses fewer

 

[weasel_lips]

That is not accurate info if they are placed on the West Contract.

No Per diem if based and trained in PHX
No Hotel if based and trained in PHX
90 days for medical
Full Pay in training.

Thanks for that information. My post only reflected the east.

 

[PHXFLYR]

Talking sense into us??? lets see...is 129/hr better than 83/hr?? Or the possible 100/hr with a combined contract?? Yup.....hence the bottom line.

although of course, I think the west guys have lots more to gain with the combined seniority list, than the east guys do. Seperate, East gains more, losses fewer. Combined, West gains more...losses fewer

Like I said. good luck. With twisted logic like that ,you're gonna need it!


PHXFLYR