Timebuilder
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What's up at Allegheny?
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canadflyau
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canadflyau
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Your friend did exactly the right thing... whats up with junior manning when you have guys on furlough/downgrade... crew scheduling knows better, but they just try to see if they can snag someone like you said... Should be grieved b/c this isn't an accidental occurance, its happening on a daily basis.
airbrush
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- Dec 6, 2001
- Posts
- 146
Contrary to some popular opinion, Crew Sched is not the "Evil Empire". If they tried to junior man someone, they were trying to do their job, just like the rest of us.
I know it stinks to get called on your day off, but if you think you are making a statement by refusing, you are making it to the wrong people. Crew Sched has no control over the manning that the company hands them. I was working a couple of weekends ago when they had to cover 25 crew sick calls with roughly half that number of reserves available, and several of those nowhere near in the right places. I'm sure the answer to some of you is "just cancel the flights....that'll teach 'em!" Very easy for you to say when you aren't the one trying to hold an airline schedule together, carry as many pax as possible (while listening to the stations bitch about how many pax cannot be reaccomodated), try not to screw up the a/c routing requirements for certain a/c with expiring MELs or engine changes scheduled that can't be extended, and try not to strand several aircraft out of position so that a dozen flights get bagged the next morning trying to pull the whole mess togther again. That is MY job, and IF some of the rash of sick calls by your fellow crewmembers are anything less than legitimate, then you have THEM to thank when Crew Sched has to start beating the bushes to fill the seats.
This is not directed at anyone in particular, just at those who see anyone not wearing a uniform as the enemy and take pleasure in making our lives just as miserable as yours are.
I know it stinks to get called on your day off, but if you think you are making a statement by refusing, you are making it to the wrong people. Crew Sched has no control over the manning that the company hands them. I was working a couple of weekends ago when they had to cover 25 crew sick calls with roughly half that number of reserves available, and several of those nowhere near in the right places. I'm sure the answer to some of you is "just cancel the flights....that'll teach 'em!" Very easy for you to say when you aren't the one trying to hold an airline schedule together, carry as many pax as possible (while listening to the stations bitch about how many pax cannot be reaccomodated), try not to screw up the a/c routing requirements for certain a/c with expiring MELs or engine changes scheduled that can't be extended, and try not to strand several aircraft out of position so that a dozen flights get bagged the next morning trying to pull the whole mess togther again. That is MY job, and IF some of the rash of sick calls by your fellow crewmembers are anything less than legitimate, then you have THEM to thank when Crew Sched has to start beating the bushes to fill the seats.
This is not directed at anyone in particular, just at those who see anyone not wearing a uniform as the enemy and take pleasure in making our lives just as miserable as yours are.
No, No I'm very sorry Jer if I came off the wrong way. 99% of us crewmembers hold nothing against crew sked / dispatch when this happens. I know my friend knows the skeduler that called him personally and would never do something to spite you guys nor would I or anyone else I can think of.
We all know where the cause of this problem is and are ALL suffering a great deal as a result. The events of the last couple of years (mesa, chit, tsa taking flying, mainline pilots limiting US specifically and the United thing and on and on) seem like happy times compared to the last couple of months.
As you are all to aware we have 60+ guys on the street - not because of $$ or flight reasons but to spite us, to punish us like first graders. Some of these guys are my close friends one of which I tought how to fly. And where has this gotten us/group? Correct ABSOLUTILY NOWHERE. Not one new rj not one mailine guy called back, just the jobs and careers of 60+ Allegheny pilots ripped out from under them.
Friends and family are the most important thing a person can have. You never go back on your friends. I cannot and will not fly anything extra while we are in this position. I will not be calling in sick (unless I am) I'm not like that. What I will do is show up on time and fly my line, no more no less.
Further I will NEVER sign on to something as morally wrong as J4J. Management has us in the ultimate catch 22. Sign on to J4J and loose your jobs or don't and be exterminated. I FOR ONE INTEND TO GO DOWN SWINGING, LITTERALLY (for those out there who know me you know I'm full crazy like that) So many people have so much to loose pilots with 15, 20, 25 or 30 + years here. 30 plus years here, christ thats longer than I've been alive. Just think of one ABE capt. that retires in 2 months. He could loose everything, gone. 30 + years of accident/incident/problem free years to this company. Thats 25, 000 plus hours and hundreds of thousands of pax, not one with so much as a scratch. Think about it.
If we go down swinging then I'll know I did everthing I could (and thats not much, what more can we do?) to fight against something so morally wrong so demeaning as J4J. We'll wear the scars like a badge. When this is over whatever the outcome we'll pick ourselves up wipe off the dirt and move on.
Mr. Beebe you are no leader, to devise something that hardly benifits one group and destroys another (3 in this case)when all the groups involved work for the same cause (U Group) makes you an A$$hole my book. You are like the officer who gets shot by his own troops.
Don't get me wrong I'm all for giving back to the company but I wont sell out my friends or sole for an RJ especially if most of us will never see it.
Jerr we're all here together, stay strong and hope for the best. Union and nonunion alike we can't afford to loose this fight.
Take Care
P.S. we know you guys in the south east corner of the mx hangar aren't the "Evil Empire", you just work for Dr. Evil.
We all know where the cause of this problem is and are ALL suffering a great deal as a result. The events of the last couple of years (mesa, chit, tsa taking flying, mainline pilots limiting US specifically and the United thing and on and on) seem like happy times compared to the last couple of months.
As you are all to aware we have 60+ guys on the street - not because of $$ or flight reasons but to spite us, to punish us like first graders. Some of these guys are my close friends one of which I tought how to fly. And where has this gotten us/group? Correct ABSOLUTILY NOWHERE. Not one new rj not one mailine guy called back, just the jobs and careers of 60+ Allegheny pilots ripped out from under them.
Friends and family are the most important thing a person can have. You never go back on your friends. I cannot and will not fly anything extra while we are in this position. I will not be calling in sick (unless I am) I'm not like that. What I will do is show up on time and fly my line, no more no less.
Further I will NEVER sign on to something as morally wrong as J4J. Management has us in the ultimate catch 22. Sign on to J4J and loose your jobs or don't and be exterminated. I FOR ONE INTEND TO GO DOWN SWINGING, LITTERALLY (for those out there who know me you know I'm full crazy like that) So many people have so much to loose pilots with 15, 20, 25 or 30 + years here. 30 plus years here, christ thats longer than I've been alive. Just think of one ABE capt. that retires in 2 months. He could loose everything, gone. 30 + years of accident/incident/problem free years to this company. Thats 25, 000 plus hours and hundreds of thousands of pax, not one with so much as a scratch. Think about it.
If we go down swinging then I'll know I did everthing I could (and thats not much, what more can we do?) to fight against something so morally wrong so demeaning as J4J. We'll wear the scars like a badge. When this is over whatever the outcome we'll pick ourselves up wipe off the dirt and move on.
Mr. Beebe you are no leader, to devise something that hardly benifits one group and destroys another (3 in this case)when all the groups involved work for the same cause (U Group) makes you an A$$hole my book. You are like the officer who gets shot by his own troops.
Don't get me wrong I'm all for giving back to the company but I wont sell out my friends or sole for an RJ especially if most of us will never see it.
Jerr we're all here together, stay strong and hope for the best. Union and nonunion alike we can't afford to loose this fight.
Take Care
P.S. we know you guys in the south east corner of the mx hangar aren't the "Evil Empire", you just work for Dr. Evil.
Last edited:
airbrush
Well-known member
- Joined
- Dec 6, 2001
- Posts
- 146
LearLove,
I appreciate the thoughts. Although my job description sometimes forces me to do things I don't like, my work ethic and professional pride requires that I do nothing less than my best to accomplish the task at hand. I do get frustrated by the endless crew problems, but at the same time I can't blame you guys for not rolling over on J4J. That is the most arrogant, condescending piece of extortion I have ever seen.
I have always considered myself to be much more aligned philosophically with the crews than with Rosedale, and I often get extremely annoyed at how things are done around here. I get tired of having to constantly twist my brain into a knot to figure out the latest crisis-of-the-minute when better planning on the part of the 9-to-5 crowd could have prevented it (again!). Not enough crews, not enough parts, never a solution to the hot cabins in the summer, etc, etc. It's hard enough trying to herd 48 a/c through out the northeast with weather and ATC without having to deal with the poor planning of others to boot.
Anyway, we've all got to hang in there until we see what is coming for us (although recent trends dictate an updating of the resume might be in order!). Fly safe!
I appreciate the thoughts. Although my job description sometimes forces me to do things I don't like, my work ethic and professional pride requires that I do nothing less than my best to accomplish the task at hand. I do get frustrated by the endless crew problems, but at the same time I can't blame you guys for not rolling over on J4J. That is the most arrogant, condescending piece of extortion I have ever seen.
I have always considered myself to be much more aligned philosophically with the crews than with Rosedale, and I often get extremely annoyed at how things are done around here. I get tired of having to constantly twist my brain into a knot to figure out the latest crisis-of-the-minute when better planning on the part of the 9-to-5 crowd could have prevented it (again!). Not enough crews, not enough parts, never a solution to the hot cabins in the summer, etc, etc. It's hard enough trying to herd 48 a/c through out the northeast with weather and ATC without having to deal with the poor planning of others to boot.
Anyway, we've all got to hang in there until we see what is coming for us (although recent trends dictate an updating of the resume might be in order!). Fly safe!
Pretty close
Although we may get paid more than Mesa, Chit and others it has not been proven we cost more. Group or our MGMT will not let us see the books. I wonder why. I ask you this, if we are loosing $$ as they say then why would Dave be willing to put mainline guys here and pay them all Capts salary? CORRECT because even if he paid us all 55+ an hour we would still make $$ like we've always been. We don't need the books to tell us that. Why do you think they keep us around? If we thw WO lost $$ they would have sold us long ago.
Although we may get paid more than Mesa, Chit and others it has not been proven we cost more. Group or our MGMT will not let us see the books. I wonder why. I ask you this, if we are loosing $$ as they say then why would Dave be willing to put mainline guys here and pay them all Capts salary? CORRECT because even if he paid us all 55+ an hour we would still make $$ like we've always been. We don't need the books to tell us that. Why do you think they keep us around? If we thw WO lost $$ they would have sold us long ago.
Learlove:
Thanks for your support. I'm glad to see you guys are holding firm on the junior manning issue. It makes me feel better now struggling to get health insurance for my kids to know you guys are behind the (made to be an example) ALG furloughees. I was beyond shocked and upset to see US Air now try and sign an agreement with Midway to become yet another US Air Express carrier and fly OUR RJ routes. It is now evident we have no place in the future or business plan of OUR company no matter how hard we try and negotiate with them. take care.
Thanks for your support. I'm glad to see you guys are holding firm on the junior manning issue. It makes me feel better now struggling to get health insurance for my kids to know you guys are behind the (made to be an example) ALG furloughees. I was beyond shocked and upset to see US Air now try and sign an agreement with Midway to become yet another US Air Express carrier and fly OUR RJ routes. It is now evident we have no place in the future or business plan of OUR company no matter how hard we try and negotiate with them. take care.
canadflyau
Well-known member
- Joined
- May 2, 2002
- Posts
- 437
Don't throw in the towel yet! Just wait how this plays out. Our MEC has done the right thing (listening to the July 19 code-a-phone)
With 15 airlines on U's dance card with the addition of Midway (those folks are crazy if they sign on.) 4 of whom are WO subsidiaries... and now the Government will get a say in all this... oh yes there are tons of chess peices on the board, and I don't think we are one of the pawns.
But feel free to write those congressmen/women, b/c they can impact our business plan and don't want to be responsible for backing a loan that would lead to our extinction. That would be a political mess!
With 15 airlines on U's dance card with the addition of Midway (those folks are crazy if they sign on.) 4 of whom are WO subsidiaries... and now the Government will get a say in all this... oh yes there are tons of chess peices on the board, and I don't think we are one of the pawns.
But feel free to write those congressmen/women, b/c they can impact our business plan and don't want to be responsible for backing a loan that would lead to our extinction. That would be a political mess!
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