Whats Tranny's Fragmentation Language?

[SWA/CA]

Rumor has it, that SWA might not want to keep the 717 with parts and the fact its not being built anymore, it could cost lots of money in the long run. I know Southwest doesn’t like to spend money.

What does the Air Tran contract say on fragmentation? What happens to the Crews of these airplanes if the rumors turn out to be true. Would the Crew stay with the planes? Would this effect the M/B law?

Ty/Lear?

 

[fr8doggie]

I have it on good authority (SWA Flight Management) that LUV is going to purchase an additional 25 717's. Hawaii flights start summer of 2012. 767's to Europe in next 5-6 years.

Count on it!

 

[Ty Webb]

They're not giving up the 717 leases.

SWA is now on the hook for $150 mil a year for those leases, and the aircraft are making money.

You don't give up $50-$100 mil in profit, plus a $150 mil annual loss on the leases . . . in other words, create a combined loss of $200+ million a year. . . . . . for no reason.

Bob Dylan and 400Ahole may not have gone to college, but Gary K did. :laugh:

 

[SWA/FO]

Who owns the airplanes? GE or Boeing? Anybody?

 

[Ty Webb]

Who owns the airplanes? GE or Boeing? Anybody?

Again, this stuff was covered last year. Do a search. Royal Bank of Scotland . . . Wells Fargo . . . . a half doazen other entitities. You don't just call Boeing and say, "Come pick 'em up". They don't belong to Boeing, they belong to the leasing companies.

 

[SWA/CA]

Why don't you refresh my memory?

What if leasing company says: "Sure we will take our 717s back, but you have to pay a penalty!" Southwest says...."OK, how about this NO penalty and give us 60 or so -800 and you got a deal" Leasing Company: "um, ok"

 

[redflyer65]

I agree with Ty on the first part....very, very rarely would a company just park the planes and tell the leasing company to come get them (huge penalty). But he leaves out the other option...

Any company at anytime could sell aircraft with the leases intact. Zero penalty incurred. I would say from the GO, pretty much two options available...

1- Keep them until the leases expire or
2- Sell them with the leases intact and buy more -800's.

 

[400ADude]

They're not giving up the 717 leases.

SWA is now on the hook for $150 mil a year for those leases, and the aircraft are making money.

You don't give up $50-$100 mil in profit, plus a $150 mil annual loss on the leases . . . in other words, create a combined loss of $200+ million a year. . . . . . for no reason.

Bob Dylan and 400Ahole may not have gone to college, but Gary K did. :laugh:

:bawling::bawling::bawling::bawling::bawling:

 

[Ty Webb]

Why don't you refresh my memory?

What if leasing company says: "Sure we will take our 717s back, but you have to pay a penalty!" Southwest says...."OK, how about this NO penalty and give us 60 or so -800 and you got a deal" Leasing Company: "um, ok"

Good luck with that in this market. There are 25 717's sitting in Mexico right now because no one is stepping up to lease them.

A more likely scenario is that SWA will take the 25 Mexican 717's at bargain basement rates.

 

[400ADude]

Good luck with that in this market. There are 25 717's sitting in Mexico right now because no one is stepping up to lease them.

A more likely scenario is that SWA will take the 25 Mexican 717's at bargain basement rates.

The Mexicans don't even want them. Wow.

 

[humveedriver]

I can't help but think that when this deal was announced Boeing or some leasing company wasn't on the phone 2 seconds later trying to get those 25 airframes up and running. We just got to get the SWA pilots trained up on them, since SL8 has any new aircraft going to thier side of the house..

 

[ASADFW7]

800 domestic 2012 Etops January 2013. That is all I have heard.

 

[Ty Webb]

The Mexicans don't even want them. Wow.

Yeah, that's right. Why don't you offer to go down and pick 'em up? Easy money.

I have a feeling you won't be missed.

 

[SWA/FO]

You're the one with all the time on your hands... "with your part-time job and awesome 27 hour layovers"... You have plenty of time.

 

[ASADFW7]

This thread is not a representation of negotiating in good faith at the table in Dallas. Whatever the reasoning behind this, let the crews do their thing in Dallas first.

 

[SWA/FO]

This thread is not a representation of negotiating in good faith at the table in Dallas. Whatever the reasoning behind this, let the crews do their thing in Dallas first.

I think they are in ATL. They are, I don't expect them to call me.

 

[SKC]

I have it on good authority (SWA Flight Management) that LUV is going to purchase an additional 25 717's. Hawaii flights start summer of 2012. 767's to Europe in next 5-6 years.

Count on it!

No chance at Hawaii next summer. The -800s don't arrive until March and too many things have to occur after it arrives that it would be a big deal if certification is done by the fall. Plus, they're not going to release a schedule (means they would have to plan to make that call by this Christmas) to HI for the summer unless they're 100% sure ETOPS certification will be complete by then and I just don't see that as likely.

Not to mention that our new flt planning system won't be rolled out until next summer and the current one isn't capable of ETOPS planning.

 

[fr8doggie]

OK- bump it back a year then. HI in 2013. Europe in 2018. 717's all over the place.

SWA guys- Douglas built a great airplane. Last MD-11 was built 11 years ago and we are still buying them. Don't sell the airplane short!

 

[-9Capt]

I've around 5K hrs in the 717. It's a great, highly automated airplane with very uncomfortable seats. Oh, it's also frequently busted down somewhere.

 

[scoreboardII]

I've around 5K hrs in the 717. It's a great, highly automated airplane with very uncomfortable seats. Oh, it's also frequently busted down somewhere.

Can a 6'2" dude get in and out without leaving forensic evidence in the form of hair and skin stuck to the overhead panel?

What you mean busted down?