Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
  • Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
  • Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
  • Share the passion for aviation
  • Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun

What's going on at LUV?

Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
  • Invite your friends
  • Share the passion of aviation
  • Friendliest aviation community on the web
2. FO's that are having a hard time dealing/accepting reality.
which reality is that? the "we're senior and we're captains already so we're going to defenestrate the lances and stick a bunch of seniority into open time that doesn't presently exist" that kind of reality?

I'd say that whoever wrote and presented a TA that passed the CA side 60/40 and failed on the FO side 60/40 has got some 'splaining to do.
 
Southwest has lost money 3 out of the last 4 quarters...

According to the GAAP and Accounting Standards, yes. According to SWA and how it has been reporting for 38 years, no. The only quarter we lost money in was the first quarter of 09. Regardless, it is tough to make better yields when we are constantly running sales.
 
which reality is that? the "we're senior and we're captains already so we're going to defenestrate the lances and stick a bunch of seniority into open time that doesn't presently exist" that kind of reality?

I'd say that whoever wrote and presented a TA that passed the CA side 60/40 and failed on the FO side 60/40 has got some 'splaining to do.


Captain versus First Officer/Senior versus Junior--Management wins everytime.
 
According to the GAAP and Accounting Standards, yes. According to SWA and how it has been reporting for 38 years, no. The only quarter we lost money in was the first quarter of 09. Regardless, it is tough to make better yields when we are constantly running sales.
In the end the consumer determines what price a seat will sell for, without sales you don't fill the seats. My wife was a frequent user of SWA, used them all the time. When the TA failed in the spring, the one way DTW-ABQ doubled for advance purchases. I mean six months in advance, went from $99 to $199. She could find cheaper fares at AAL, NWA, Frontier, and CAL. Within two weeks the fares were down to $159, then two weeks later down to $129, now they are down to $99 again. It looks like SWA tried to raise fares and saw significant drop in booking to fill those otherwise empty seats on those Tue, Wed and Sat flights.
 
Captain versus First Officer/Senior versus Junior--Management wins everytime.
I agree completely. The seniority centricness of the failed TA wasn't put there by management. Management doesn't care who gets first shot at open time or whether or not there is a right of return for displaced pilots (TA still didn't have this basic concept, almost every other airline has some type of right of return if you get displaced out of a base/seat, SWA has nothing) Our union thought, incorrectly, that they could 'sweeten the pot' for the senior captains.

If they write the next TA to have more or less the same seniority benes and negatives as our current CBA then I expect the lopsided vote will go away too.
 
pilotyip-- are you saying that they doubled the cost of that particular flight in response to our TA?
 
In the end the consumer determines what price a seat will sell for, without sales you don't fill the seats.

I agree with you, it's basic economics. Our management is filling seats with one sale after another. They would rather see someone in a seat than letting it fly empty. It is working. I am sure they look forward to a stonger market and better yields. When that happens, who knows.
 
The problem is with the continual 137 loads. you can't sell the businessman the BS fare as a walkup if the plane is already full. We've traditionally run much lower LFs and still made money. really high LFs also stress the system. you can't 'catch up' if a plane goes down. rampers, agents, FAs, everyone works much harder. if we're making money, okay, we do what we have to do. if we are selling tickets below cost, that is not a long term business strategy that has high odds of success.
 
Nope only timing

pilotyip-- are you saying that they doubled the cost of that particular flight in response to our TA?
There may be connection, but I am only guessing, the big fare jump came at the same time. Wasn't it about the same time there was talk of charging for extra bags and changing tickets. Was the company looking for more revenue? I only know about that particular city pair, because my wife shops it for deals all the time. But I also know SWA lost 3 RT's DTW-ABQ during the last three months because of being above the competition during that time frame.
 
Last edited:
There is alot of excess capacity in the market now causing low fares to be the norm to fill airplanes up. Until, some of that capacity is removed or some airlines leave the market place, well run companies including Southwest will struggle to make money in the current revenue environment. In this environment, cost of production is everything.

20 years ago, Southwest airlines was the lowest cost producer. Today Southwest is still a low cost producer and efficient airline, but they have to compete with airlines like Jetblue and Airtran who can produce the same product (if not better) for less cost. Now that the fuel hedges benefits are gone, Southwest isn't the lowest cost producer anymore.
 
How about the fact Kelly bought 2Billion worth of stock back at 14.23, and now it is hovering around 7. How would you like to look in the mirror in the morning after that f--k up.
 
I think there are too many with "bean-counter" envy. Gary Kelly is the boss until the BOD says otherwise or he quits/ retires. Larry Kellner left for a better job (I'm sure in his estimation). If Gary would leave, who would step up, and would they be any less a bean-counter? As a matter of fact, please enlighten me as to who isn't a bean-counter these days?

SmartMoney showed Gary as an Underpaid CEO this year. I'm sure the stock could be worth a lot, but at $6 a share it will be a while til WS shows us the love again. Gary took a pay cut and the other leaders took a pay freeze. So while it's easy to sit on FI and divulge as much SWA/ SWAPA internal information and bag on Gary, why not take a minute and tell us who the boogyman really is. I love it when I hear guys complain about the Company not telling us anything. Gee, I wonder why?
 

Latest resources

Back
Top Bottom