West pilots appeal to the Supreme Court

[abefly]

you cant fix stupid

 

[xrated]

So until the "AOL" group accepts that - we stay separate and the East pilots get some major attrition in 2 years and 2 months - and you get to keep your position in PHX.

Humor me this Metro. According to your numbers, how many East pilots qualify to retire (age 65) for the 1st 2 years after Jan 1, 2013? Look into it, because I'm guessing its not nearly as many as most think. My point being, there isn't going to be the "major attrition" at UsAirways in 2 & 2 like you think. Pehaps in 5-6 years from now, but not 2-3 years. Keep in mind that when retirements do hit, many of those will be F/O's. I do give you that, the East has a very senior F/O staff. Hardly the attrition I'd be excited about!

Until the East pilot group accepts that, we stay separate ops, and the East continues to live under LOA 93......as F/O's!

 

[Guppiedriver]

They have been billed $1,800,000 in attorney fees. Not sure what they still owe, but I believe it is still over 7 figures.

Metrojet

Right and wrong.

If this takes much longer the West will have wasted all this time and money as a large percentage of East pilots will have retired anyway. Put up a fence, watch them grow old and you'll be in the same spot you would have with the nic anyway. (and not have spent all that money)

Please explain to me how the west pilots can put up a fence.

Until contractual gains are more than the pay raise associated with an upgrade there is no motivation for the east to sign a contract. That remains the same. There are know winners here. The sad part is both sides are dug in so deep they each think there can be.

That works for the f/o's, but what's in it for the captains.

Dug in so deep? I would agree that the east has painted themselves in a corner and they have decided it's going to be all or nothing. Are you suggesting that the west should just give up and accept whatever the east has in store for us?

 

[TWA Dude]

I am glad you had a good nights sleep!

Actually, while I had no trouble falling asleep my toddler has a bad cold so his coughing awakened me many times. Life goes on.

As to my barb at you - I was just stating that you (don't take this personally) or any AOL member have not even attempted to compromise on "our SLI".

AOL is not a representational organization and thus they have no authority to compromise. They can choose to drop the litigation if they wish but with the law on our side that's not the logical thing to do.

In any case, the time for compromise was in front of George Nicolau. At this point it's called conceding. Admit it: you don't want compromise you want concessions. Well, we don't believe concessions are advisable at this time.

It is either Nic or sue.

Correct. I'm glad you understand that.

If it was really a fair methodology - then 10% of all pilots would have been happy and 90% would be unhappy - thats not what actually happened - 100% of the West felt they won the lottery while 90% of the East lost

Really? So this is how the world works: fairness is determined by polling? Oh yeah, like counselor $eham told us, it's the "tyranny of the majority". Need I remind you a federal jury and judge found that your version of fairness violated USAPA's Duty to Fairly Represent the West? And spare me the USAPA talking point about the appeal. The verdict was overturned due to ripeness alone and not merit. If you don't believe me just read the company's request for declaratory judgment.

Your math is a little fuzzy too. One party feels the award was fair and the other party doesn't. That's 50/50 by my math. In any case, it's not a popularity contest. The merger was a windfall for the East and Nicolau felt the West was due some compensation.

We (West and East) have to meet in the middle of the street.

Tell it to the judge.

Believe me when I throw this out - there aren't as many East pilots that want to bid PHX as there are senior West FO's who would bid Captain out East in a heartbeat, or West Captains that want to bid wide-body in PHL. Thats the truth - whether you want to admit it or not.

Even if true, irrelevant.

So until the "AOL" group accepts that - we stay separate and the East pilots get some major attrition in 2 years and 2 months - and you get to keep your position in PHX.

We know. More windfall for the East. Gloating about your windfall at our expense says a lot about you -- and none of it's good.

 

[Cowboy75]

Heads up East and West pilots.

USAPA is sending out over 140 Section 29 (pay up or get terminated) letters. I understand that many are for unpaid assessments for the pension investigation.

 

[Jim]

Heads up East and West pilots.

USAPA is sending out over 140 Section 29 (pay up or get terminated) letters. I understand that many are for unpaid assessments for the pension investigation.

Why would a west pilot be assessed to investigate the east's pensions? Another greedy USAPA move.

 

[MCDU]

Why would a west pilot be assessed to investigate the east's pensions? Another greedy USAPA move.

that does not make sense.

M

 

[Guppiedriver]

Believe me when I throw this out - there aren't as many East pilots that want to bid PHX as there are senior West FO's who would bid Captain out East in a heartbeat, or West Captains that want to bid wide-body in PHL. Thats the truth - whether you want to admit it or not.

Now how the hell could you know this? It's not the truth, it's some WAG that you pulled out of your arse.

 

[Jim]

that does not make sense.

M

That's because you're a USAPA apologist with no integrity.

 

[Metrojet]

Now how the hell could you know this? It's not the truth, it's some WAG that you pulled out of your arse.

Guppiedriver -

It is called staying involved by talking to many pilots about current events and asking about where people live and knowing their lifestyles.

How many West pilots live in the middle of the country like Minneapolis, Chicago, St. Louis, Dallas, New Orleans, Kansas, Houston, or Denver. If your going to the airport to commute and their is a flight to PHL or CLT and a flight to PHX - and you can hold a Captain's bid out East, or a FO bid in PHX - where ya gonna go? It is about a 2 hour flight either way.

And as to East pilots bidding West - most former PSA folks were smart and moved East years ago when they sold their high dollar CA homes.

Anyway - re-read post 34 paragraph 12 by TWA Dude - where he says "even if true - irrelevant". If I were way off base on my analysis - wouldn't he maybe have said totally false?

Metrojet