Virgin America 1Q loss $76 million

[n757st]

Ahh, okay...

....ok, he can send them a free check and not take any additional ownership of the company, that won't happen.

 

[redflyer65]

The name on the side of the planes say VIRGIN. That is tied to Branson. There are a hundreds of thousands of ways he can help. (and you better believe he knows how important that brand is to his name) Is it legal? Probably not. I'm not naive enough to think he isn't doing something behind the scenes. He's definitely smart enough to not get caught. That's my take, yours might be different. I would think that even most VA employees think the same.

 

[Dizel8]

Supposedly, the "Bearded One" has personally guaranteed that the investors will be made whole, whatever the cost. Rumor, truth, who knows?

 

[ualdriver]

49M operating loss, 76M net loss on 267M gross revenue. 111M in unrestricted cash left. Someone had better be writing Mr. Cush a big, fat check soon. Another quarter or two like that and guys might not have time to bail before any significant hiring starts at other airlines.

And even more annoyingly, Mr. Cush didn't put a Consolidated Statement of Earnings table in his latest press release so that one can make comparisons to previous quarters. Lame.

 

[fam62c]

Maybe so but I'm curious as to how a public offering of a company that has been consistently unprofitable goes.

Best of luck to all at VA. Some great people there.

It wouldn't go at all, they will need to establish a track record of profitability prior to having a shot at a successful IPO. That's what I'm saying, I think that the investors are willing to keep shoveling in the cash until that happens even if it's years from now, seems crazy but they show no signs of giving up.

 

[Andy]

Branson isn't the only one who has dumped money into this pig. Hedge funds dumped $150M into VA in Dec 2011. The hedge funds will want to IPO VA in order to recover some of their investment.

VA's cash burn is now out of control. In spite of borrowing $150M in Dec, they ended 4Q2011 with $160M in unrestricted cash. They ended 1Q2012 with $111M in unrestricted cash. One more quarter like that and they'll need another truckload of money to burn.

VA may be adding capacity but they're having to slash fares in order to fill their planes. In spite of higher fuel prices, the average fare for VA went from $182.46 in 1Q2011 to $168.11 in 1Q2012.
Plus UAL is adding capacity out of SFO - I'd be surprised if a lot of UAL's capacity increases aren't aimed directly at VA routes.

Perhaps VA will put some lipstick on one or two quarterly reports to show a 'profit' and then IPO it out to the public.

 

[St. Nic]

Put a fork in VA- that pig is just about done!

 

[jonjuan]

NetJet pilots use to say that.

And nja just ordered 2 Billon in new aircraft. Buffett will continue to fund for a looooong time.

 

[jonjuan]

Branson isn't the only one who has dumped money into this pig. Hedge funds dumped $150M into VA in Dec 2011. The hedge funds will want to IPO VA in order to recover some of their investment.

VA's cash burn is now out of control. In spite of borrowing $150M in Dec, they ended 4Q2011 with $160M in unrestricted cash. They ended 1Q2012 with $111M in unrestricted cash. One more quarter like that and they'll need another truckload of money to burn.

VA may be adding capacity but they're having to slash fares in order to fill their planes. In spite of higher fuel prices, the average fare for VA went from $182.46 in 1Q2011 to $168.11 in 1Q2012.
Plus UAL is adding capacity out of SFO - I'd be surprised if a lot of UAL's capacity increases aren't aimed directly at VA routes.

Perhaps VA will put some lipstick on one or two quarterly reports to show a 'profit' and then IPO it out to the public.

Agreed-CASM increased 5.3% (and should only go higher) and their operating margin went from -14% to -18%. The high capacity still in the market will make this very difficult to turn around.

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

It absolutely amazes me that Southwest Pilots get on a Virgin America thread to bash them and turns the tables on Delta saying that we hurt the industry....

Once again.....no retirement, no holding pay, FARs for workrules, no meals, Pay for training.....and the list goes on and on.....but they sure do let all their friends know how much they make......pathetic these aholes get on here pointing the finger at a Virgin Pilot!

Enjoy the right seat wave.....it's going to be a long wait for the left!!!

 

[nordo_2]

And nja just ordered 2 Billon in new aircraft. Buffett will continue to fund for a looooong time.

NJ has a long history of cancelling orders.

 

[Mamma]

Put a fork in VA- that pig is just about done!

Pig? Take a peek at what a Virgin 4-year on property captain makes then take a peek at what a maxed out US Air A320 captain makes. You guys need to get your house in order.

Ok, I'll save you the effort:

Maxed out US Air A320 Capt: $125/hr
4-year Virgin America Capt: $123/hr

Can you say "anchor on the industry payrates?"

 

[SWA Bubba]

Once again... WRONG!

It absolutely amazes me that Southwest Pilots get on a Virgin America thread to bash them and turns the tables on Delta saying that we hurt the industry....

Once again.....no retirement, - Great retirement at Southwest.
no holding pay, - Not exactly sure what you mean, but overfly pay starts after 4 minutes.
FARs for workrules, - Awesome work rules, and industry-leading rigs. Make as much or as little as you want. If you're attempting to slam us by saying we work more efficiently than you do, then, uh... YEAH. We like it that way: fewer days worked per month for the same paid hours. You DO realize that's not really an insult, right?
no meals, - Well, you got me here... damn! I guess I'll buy my own lunch with my perdiem
Pay for training..... Complete BS; Delta pilots pay more out of their own pockets to meet their minimum hiring requirements than Southwest pilots. But you already knew that.
and the list goes on and on..... Sure, sure, just keep on shoveling the BS; that doesn't make any of it true (other than the 'no meals' part).
but they sure do let all their friends know how much they make......pathetic these aholes get on here pointing the finger at a Virgin Pilot!

Enjoy the right seat wave.....it's going to be a long wait for the left!!!

Bill, I'm not defending anyone's arrogance about anything, but this thread was about Virgin's financials, i.e. their management's inadequacies. Nobody was point fingers at any Virgin pilots. Wave did work in a comment about Delta "selling out," but he was invited by the original thread poster. He does that a lot. You and he do have a legitimate argument over the merits of his claims, but you're barking up the wrong tree here.

Bubba

 

[redflyer65]

As usual. Bill has no clue about what he's talking about.

Maybe I should quit because I don't get a crew meal on my two hour leg between BWI to HOU. Haha.

Throw in Zero RJs and the best Scope in the industry and SW is a pretty good place to hangout, no matter where you are on the list.

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Once again... WRONG!




Bill, I'm not defending anyone's arrogance about anything, but this thread was about Virgin's financials, i.e. their management's inadequacies. Nobody was point fingers at any Virgin pilots. Wave did work in a comment about Delta "selling out," but he was invited by the original thread poster. He does that a lot. You and he do have a legitimate argument over the merits of his claims, but you're barking up the wrong tree here.

Bubba

Ok Bubba....well said.

just getting sick and tired of the usual clowns treading on others situations like they have it best.

Rant over

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Southwest didnt pay for any extra if the trip went into holding or was delayed on the ground back in the day under Herb

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

As usual. Bill has no clue about what he's talking about.

Maybe I should quit because I don't get a crew meal on my two hour leg between BWI to HOU. Haha.

Throw in Zero RJs and the best Scope in the industry and SW is a pretty good place to hangout, no matter where you are on the list.

Good point Red....your growth comes at the expense of AirTran pilots.....I forgot!

 

[SWA Bubba]

Ok Bubba....well said.

just getting sick and tired of the usual clowns treading on others situations like they have it best.

Rant over

Join the club!

By now, I'm pretty sure that no one on Flight Info has any doubt whatsoever as to what Wave thinks about Delta's new contract.

Bubba

 

[zman]

Actually SWA does have crew meals it's just on the international side AirTran. Once SWA starts going their they will get them as well.

 

[waveflyer]

Join the club!

By now, I'm pretty sure that no one on Flight Info has any doubt whatsoever as to what Wave thinks about Delta's new contract.

Bubba

Haha, probably not.

Just making sure they can't claim ignorance if scope gets pushed up to 90 seats- or 76 seaters gets even further away from them.

My only point on a virgin thread is saying their starting pay is largely influenced by RJ capt pay. But I've not once heard a Swa pilot bash VA for existing. They are competition and we embrace it as capitalism.
One thing I hated about legacies was the prevailing attitude against upstarts and upstart pay- as if we don't live in america.