validity of X country done in Europe

Ny-flyer

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Hey

I have a few dozens of X country hours made on an european acft in Europe.

I'm training in the US with a restricted private pilot license(based on a foreign license) to get a SE Commercial pilot license (part 61).

I' m trying to meet the requirement of FAR 61.129. However, I need according to (a)(2)(ii) 50 hours of X country. I have barely only half of this requirement that were made on a N acft in the US.

I tried to get an answer by looking at the FAR AIM. Unfortunatly I can' t find an answer. I called AOPA & FAA according to them my cross country hours are not valid. Can anyone confirm me the fact that my X country hours are not valid or show me a link where I can find an answer on the FAR AIM. Thank you very much for your help
 
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VVJM265

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Just dug threw FARs & personally, I don't think that it matters. I have a friend who just got their ATP and 90% of their time was in Japan & Europe. But if the FAA already says the hours aren't valid then that should be the end of that. However, I'd try a different FSDO & Inspector and go there in person with your logs. Explain the situation, you may get a different answer.

Best of luck,
VVJM265
 

nosehair

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Cross-Country time in another country is legal. There is no geographic limitation. What if I'm rich and I want to do my x/c training in a jet to Europe. It still counts. All time counts. Regardless of the location, and it does not have to be in a U.S. Registered airplane. Dual time does have to be with an FAA certified instructor, but that can be in any country.

You will have to be prepared with a map to show to the examiner that the logged x/c flights were 50 miles or more.
 

Gutenberg

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Oh boy, can I help you on this one! I had a student who was flying on a US license based on a Netherlands license, working towards his instrument rating. You need to call OK city and get a letter saying that your license is based on one that required all of the same times that a US license requires. (Some countries don't require you to do everything we do, like the night requirement, for instance.)

If an XC in Europe is defined as 49nm or something like that, none of that time will be valid. After that, make sure you and your instructor can prove to the DPE that your times in Europe meet the US private requirements, just to cover everyone's ass (the DPE's and your instructor mostly).

My student didn't get that letter and had to go into the FED's office with Netherlands charts to prove that all of his XC time was 50nm. The DPE was very stressed out through the whole ordeal, but eventually everything turned out OK and he got his instrument rating.

Whew!
 

Ny-flyer

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Thank you guys. I guess the call to OK city is to have what is called the certification of authenticity. I will call another FSDO and ask them precisely the question. About the 3 legs X country in 61.129 if done in Europe on an european acft does anyone have any clue if it is valid? I guess it is the same as for the X countries.
 

NoPax

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If it meets the requirements in 61.129 it's valid, so don't worry about it. It also doesn't matter if you did it an African, American, European registered airplane.

As the previous poster said, make sure you can back it up when asked to by an Examiner, by bringing charts etc.

Make sure that you carefully read 61.129 - ie 'solo'. Solo means not one other person in the aircraft, doesn't matter if your friend, wife, safety pilot or instructor was with you, it wouldn't count. I flew with a number of Europeans, that insisted their time was solo in Europe, then when the examiner came, he would ask the student to talk about the flight etc. anthing interesting happen etc.

The only things that I know of that aren't valid concerning foreign matters with the FAA are Foreign Military Qualifications, and ratings not recognized by ICAO (eg IMC rating in UK).

Try to find an examiner that has flown with many foreign pilots, if you like I can recommend a handful from Los Angeles area.

Enjoy your time in the states
 

CDVdriver

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We've been dealing with this issue a lot.
All the time counts as long as it's >50nm
The logging of time is usually done differently in Europe.
No Instructor signatures in the logbook, no comments in the remarks section and they expect you to believe they meet the requirements.
However, most of the time we can make it work.
 

Ny-flyer

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Thx for the answers.

Last Friday I called another FSDO and I got a negative answer. The reason is that my X country were done when I did not hold a US airmen certificate. In other words now that I have a US airmen certificate if I would fly a X country in Europe on an european acft it would be valid but since I did those X country prior the date I got my US restricted PPL well for the FAA it' s not valid. I got the same answer 2 weeks ago by another FSDO and AOPA.
 

NoPax

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Are you trying to justify spending even more money???

The time counts so long as you flew the airplane over 50NM. Its a cross-country according to the FAA.Bring charts to the examiner, and show him/her that each flight/leg was over 50NM. Simple.

The only beef the FAA could have is the '20 hours of training towards the Commercial Certificate'. I can see an argument that since you didn't hold an FAA certificate and didn't fly with an FAA instructor, how could you train for an FAA commercial certificate. This is reading into it a little too much.

Unlike Europe, the FAA are not going to go through your logbook with a fine tooth comb, unless you give them a reason to.
 

millhouse21

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So, the FAA is saying that when you flew in europe, it doesn't count because you didn't hold a US pilot certificate??? That sounds pretty fishy to me. Perhaps they don't understand what you are asking. If you were qualified to fly that aircraft, it shouldn't matter what kind of certificate you held. PIC is PIC. Let me elaborate. A US Navy pilot flying F18s over Iraq might not hold any FAA issued certificates. He is also not flying an N registered aircraft. Would the FAA say that he can't log the time? No, because he was fully qualified per the flight rules he was flying under. You are (or should be) in the same boat as that F18 pilot.
 
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