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USAIR "East" profiting while the West Flounders?

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rajflyboy said:
Could it be true? USAIRWAY East is profitable right now while the West side is losing money ??
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No. It's the same company. Same reservations system, same revenue. It's even the same operating certificate at this point. The only thing separate that is separate are the pilots.
 
hockeypilot44 said:
No. It's the same company. Same reservations system, same revenue. It's even the same operating certificate at this point. The only thing separate that is separate are the pilots.
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Very true but do the routes in the east produce a profit while the routes on the west side lose money ??

Any truth to this?? I have heard this theory thrown around lately.
 
If the East is so profitable, then why are there 8 East planes out in PHX every bank losing money? Shouldn't they be back East making more money?
 
Carl S. said:
If the East is so profitable, then why are there 8 East planes out in PHX every bank losing money? Shouldn't they be back East making more money?
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Gotta be able to get to PHX from CLT somehow. I just want to find out if there is any truth to the rumor at all?

Not meant to slam either side in this post.

Thanks.
 
From what I can tell, neither side is making one thin dime right know. But the planes are packed. Go figure.......:rolleyes:

PHXFLYR:cool:
 
rajflyboy said:
Very true but do the routes in the east produce a profit while the routes on the west side lose money ??

Any truth to this?? I have heard this theory thrown around lately.
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And just how would anyone verify this without having access to the company's books? It's not like the company is going to (or is required to) report on the profitablility of individual routes. Please! The people "throwing this theory around" (yourself included) are simply inciting more stupid discussions that at the end of the day will mean nothing.
 
UALjan15 said:
And just how would anyone verify this without having access to the company's books? It's not like the company is going to (or is required to) report on the profitablility of individual routes. Please! The people "throwing this theory around" (yourself included) are simply inciting more stupid discussions that at the end of the day will mean nothing.
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ahhhh

You are just scared because it very well may be true !!
 
rajflyboy said:
Gotta be able to get to PHX from CLT somehow. I just want to find out if there is any truth to the rumor at all?

Not meant to slam either side in this post.

Thanks.
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You won't find out. It's not a requirement to report revenue that way.

That info is tightly held.
 
1.The east is losing hours this fall (-500) while the west is status quo. 2. there are no financial separations of USAirways east/west (does United west make more than United east? unknown/doesn't matter).
 
It's true. The East is way more profitable than the West. That's why the East only went BK twice and was a week away from liquidating. Nevermind the fact that Doug Parker made emergency funds available to the East workers could cash their last paychecks before the merger was announced.

Yep, The East is the crowning Jewel.
 
People often confuse profit and yield. Flying in the eastern US is higher yield but also higher cost. Flying in the western US is lower yield and lower cost. The merger has caused the cost of the (former) AWA flying to go up.

Bottom line: any discussion of which side is more profitable is nothing more than flame-bait.
 
That's right, rajiflyboy, the fact that AWA went through a chapter 11 in the early 90s means in 2005 AWA and US Airways were both in identical financial shape. You should buy and run an airline.
 
First of all, this post is meant to be neutral...

Are both groups under the same pay scale? US Air has the lowest operating costs out of any of the majors, which is the only reason its still in business. Even still the airline lost 30% of its net worth in 2008. More than any other major. The company is delighted with the East vs West inability to negotiate higher pay.

US Air management was flushed with cash when it tried to buy Delta and lost much of it on fuel hedges and investments in the stock market.

What percentage of the furloughs are coming out of the West side vs the East? For the time being... The West is more junior, no? With no merged seniority list the company has nothing concrete to furlough by except for straight date of hire, right? This was why EAST made USAPA; to buy themselves time to keep their seniority.

It seems the East would rather keep their seniority and lower pay scales, than work with the West and have higher ones in lesser seats. No? Maybe West should have shown more respect to the senior pilot group, given their numbers and tactics? They have the power now till they retire or will this latest lawsuit do anything for the Nic Award?
 
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Flybywire44 said:
First of all, this post is meant to be neutral...

Are both groups under the same pay scale? US Air has the lowest operating costs out of any of the majors, which is the only reason its still in business. Even still the airline lost 30% of its net worth in 2008. More than any other major. The company is delighted with the East vs West inability to negotiate higher pay.

US Air management was flushed with cash when it tried to buy Delta and lost much of it on fuel hedges and investments in the stock market.

What percentage of the furloughs are coming out of the West side vs the East? For the time being... The West is more junior, no? With no merged seniority list the company has nothing concrete to furlough by except for straight date of hire, right? This was why EAST made USAPA; to buy themselves time to keep their seniority.

It seems the East would rather keep their seniority and lower pay scales, than work with the West and have higher ones in lesser seats. No? Maybe West should have shown more respect to the senior pilot group, given their numbers and tactics? They have the power now till they retire or will this latest lawsuit do anything for the Nic Award?
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A well thought out post. Thanks!
 
USAir and America West are not under the same pay/benifit/work rules. It is as it was before.

And what is interesting is everyone essentially concedes that USAir has the $hittiest of work-rules...but are avoiding sitting down to negotiate a single contract since they are not happy with the Nic award.

I know folks on both sides of the fence, and I have talked to both sides, and they would agree that integration via Nic and negotiating a single CBA would benefit the entire pilot group.

But U has an adgenda...and apparently they are willing to go to any length and at any cost in an efford to overturn Nic...and IMHO, it's just not going to happen...

But, let 'em have their day, and then move on....
 
Flybywire44 said:
First of all, this post is meant to be neutral...
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Right. Kind of like a captain who briefs his FO that he does everything by the book and is easy going.
US Air has the lowest operating costs out of any of the majors, which is the only reason its still in business.
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Man, are you confused. US Airways has the highest operating costs in the industry, employee salaries notwithstanding. see: http://industry.bnet.com/travel/1000283/third-quarter-2008-airline-costs/
The West is more junior, no?
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Longevity isn't the same as seniority. So no, the West isn't more junior.
This was why EAST made USAPA; to buy themselves time to keep their seniority.
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And also why USAPA was found liable in a DFR trial. It's not legal.
It seems the East would rather keep their seniority and lower pay scales, than work with the West and have higher ones in lesser seats.
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There's no "lesser" seats. Nicolau kept the relative seniority of both airlines pretty close. Since the merger the East has enjoyed hundred of upgrades. The West, only downgrades.
Maybe West should have shown more respect to the senior pilot group, given their numbers and tactics?
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Respect must be earned.
They have the power now till they retire or will this latest lawsuit do anything for the Nic Award?
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We'll see. Considering the Addington lawsuit's original aim was an injuction enjoining the Nicolau list if that's all Judge Wake awards than mission accomplished. But Wake has taken a month to research the issue deeper because USAPA has made it abundantly clear they every intention of continuing to violate its DFR. So look for Wake to try to put more teeth in his remedy so justice may be served.
 

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