UPS Pulls Jumpseats

[767-300ER]

UPS just pulled every airline except for A'A from being allowed on our jumpseats through CASS:

"Due to implementation of security procedures, there are some temporary changes to the CASS system. IPA Jumpseat Committee Chair Lauri Esposito says only American pilots will be permitted to access UPS jumpseats. However, this does not affect UPS pilots who want to jumpseat on any other CASS approved airline. Esposito says Flight Operations is working diligently to resolve the problem. Until it is resolved, pilots flying for Horizon, Alaska and United will not be able to jumpseat on UPS aircraft. Again, this does not impact UPS pilots’ jumpseating on participating CASS airlines."

 

[ASH]

Gee...I hope Mr. UPS is mighty humble when he comes and asks for the jumpseat.... come on Brown, let's get some reciprocity going on here.

 

[RVR300]

Wasn't it UPS who spearheaded the whole CASS thing in the first place?

What's the problem?

 

[Capt. Over]

get real ASH....

I certainly wouldn't expect any UPS'er to be "humble" in asking for any jumpseat, especially at CHQ. The pilots aren't the ones screwing up the system.....and you're gonna give them an attitude?

I'd be embarassed to be in the same room with someone like yourself who's got less than 2000 total giving an attitude to someone who's paid their dues and made it to where a lot of us want to go.

Time for a reality check I'd say!

 

[ATR-DRIVR]

Glad ole 'A$$' not signing the J/S form.

We are not on the CASS yet, hopefully soon, but UPS is ALWAYS welcome on my jumpseat! Well ok, maybe not the actual seat but all the open ones in the back till we get all CASSed up!!

 

[SWA/FO]

Hey Capt. Over, does it matter how much time someone has? Even the 2000 hour pilot is "paying his dues" and if he is the Captain, it looks like the jumpseat ride is up to him, right.

Personally, I would not have a problem letting a UPS guy on. Which would have nothing to do with weather or not I thought he had more time then me or had paid his dues (more then me). Because nobody has paid more dues then me!

 

[azxj]

Unless the pilots vote to keep us out of their jumpseats, mine will always be open to them.

 

[T-Gates]

Gee...I hope Mr. UPS is mighty humble when he comes and asks for the jumpseat.... come on Brown, let's get some reciprocity going on here.

You sir are not worthy of any J/S offered to you..... FYI, that was a management desicion, the pilots did not vote to retrict thier jumpseats. So why the hell would you take it out on them? (And last I checked, being a self proclaimed "gear yanker" it's not even your call) Since 9/11 most if not all UPS/DHL/ABX/FDX jumpseaters have been more than professional and appoligetic when asking for a ride. This is just the first bump in the road to full implementation of CASS. Settle down.....

 

[Dav8tor]

UPSers, You are always welcome to take any comfortable available seats on my flights.

 

[Mach 80]

I almost always see the younger, relatively newer guys trying to act so macho when it comes to jumpseats or other issues. You ask for the jumpseat and stand by for either a lecture, their pathetic opinons, or a buncha questions about your contract, managements, etc. As the years roll by and they get older, typically after 50 or so, they mellow out, to the point where all ya get is "welcome aboard" and a discussion on good places to fish or something like that and absolutely NOTHING about the airline industry. Same thing in general when working in the cockpit with fellow crewmembers. So refreshing for all involved.

 

[Russ]

I take no pleasure in it but agreements should be reciprocal or not at all.
I remember the situation with Delta about two or so years ago as JS'ing was starting back up post 9/11. SkyWest was not allowed on the actual on Delta while Delta was allowed on ours. No amount of good faith on our part got D to open the actual back up. Finially we set a date after which the actual was closed to D pilots. Low and behold a solution was found a number of days before it was to go in to effect.

 

[Dizel8]

They should be reciprocal and they are. This issue is not with UPS being unwilling, this has to do with CASS. Something which is governed by Homeland security, or some other goverment agency, getting hard to tell these days.

After 9/11 the jumpseats on most freighters went buhbye, again not because of the freighters themselves, but because of security.

This too shall pass!

 

[CrazyErnie]

So where would a fellow find which city pairs UPS could connect anyway? Is there a phone number involved?

And don't be fooled by the listed experience. It's not accurate.

 

[Russ]

Its a simple matter if they can access mine, I should be able to do the same to theirs. As it stands I can't. One less way for me to get to work/home. If it means enough they will pressure mngt to do what is required to comply. I have seen with my own two eyes what pressure pilots at their level can apply when they want something done.
If its any consolation to you, I do not apply my beliefs unilaterally. As long as they are still on the list provided to me they are allowed on despite my beliefs and the individual pilots won't receive any speech from me about the double standard.

 

[T-Gates]

Its a simple matter if they can access mine, I should be able to do the same to theirs. As it stands I can't. One less way for me to get to work/home. If it means enough they will pressure mngt to do what is required to comply. I have seen with my own two eyes what pressure pilots at their level can apply when they want something done.
If its any consolation to you, I do not apply my beliefs unilaterally. As long as they are still on the list provided to me they are allowed on despite my beliefs and the individual pilots won't receive any speech from me about the double standard.

UPS pilots and thier union IPA, have led the way in CASS implementation, they were the first carrier to satisfy all the TSA/FAA requirements. With every system, there are initial hiccups. Yes, I agree that JS agreements should always be reciprocal, but in the case of the nation's cargo airlines it's no thier fault. They have been held back form allowing other pilot in thier jumpseat by the Homeland Security Department ever since 9/11. Most airlines pilot groups, knowing full well that this was not a UPS Pilot/IPA descision, decided to respect that, knowing that UPS pilots (FDX/ABX/DHL too) all needed to get to work regardless.

Just because they cannot reciprocate, doesn't mean they are not worthy of the ride. IMHO

 

[Flyer2000]

I applaud UPS and their efforts with CASS. However the TSA/FAA requirements were/are basically......a cockpit door. To the best of my knowledge ALL 121 passenger carriers were required to install a more secure door. The cargo carriers were exempted from this requirement, and their respective managements felt no real pressure to comply (with a few exceptions). Had the pilots groups/unions pressured their managements to install the doors, their "cabin" seats would have been available to all of us the same as it currently is with all the passenger carriers. CASS will bring us back to a pre September 11th status. And CASS is still limited to domestic only (not that that is a bad thing).

Having said all of that it has always been my position that the jumpseat not be politisized (sp?), and pilots not be penalized for their managements stupid mistakes/decisions. All cargo carrier pilots have been, and will continue to be welcome on my aircraft anytime.

 

[ASH]

I reference to my earlier post, I need to clarify something. I have absolutely NO PROBELM giving the J/S to whoever is in need. I did not make that statement, saying that a UPS'er had better be humble toward me, I said it because of the enormous problem of people using the J/S for political purposes, which is a no-no in my book. I did not mean to offend anybody, or appear heartless...not my intention. All BROWN ABOARD ANYTIME!!

 

[SWAdude]

Hey Capt. Over, does it matter how much time someone has? Even the 2000 hour pilot is "paying his dues" and if he is the Captain, it looks like the jumpseat ride is up to him, right.

Personally, I would not have a problem letting a UPS guy on. Which would have nothing to do with weather or not I thought he had more time then me or had paid his dues (more then me). Because nobody has paid more dues then me!

Just curious SWA/FO. If you did have a problem with it, what would you do??

 

[UPSer]

The real deal with our jumpseat is that UPS is doing some type of review of the security procedures of CASS for United, Alaska and Horizon. I don't know what or why they are doing it or if it was mandated by TSA. American pilots can still utilize CASS.

UPS says that the review is temporary and they will reopen the jumpseat to the newest CASS participants as soon as possible.

 

[Eagle-ista]

I hate to appear selfish, but, what is the status of American Eagle in regard to UPS and CASS? We are CASS-approved - have we been removed from UPS' list or can we still go?