Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
  • Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
  • Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
  • Share the passion for aviation
  • Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun

UPS: No 'significant' cargo flights from DHL until 2009

Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
  • Invite your friends
  • Share the passion of aviation
  • Friendliest aviation community on the web

rotor&wing

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 28, 2005
Posts
309
UPS: No 'significant' cargo flights from DHL until 2009

UPS says it needs an agreement first then work can begin on a new operational plan for Wilmington hub.

By John Nolan
Staff Writer

Sunday, August 03, 2008
One of the big questions about DHL's proposal to hire United Parcel Service to fly its express delivery packages nationwide is how soon it will start taking away jobs from Wilmington, from where the ABX Air and ASTAR Air Cargo airlines now fly DHL's U.S. cargo.
Ohio officials estimate that a DHL shift to UPS will cost at least 8,000 jobs at DHL's Wilmington air freight hub, a major regional employer. A UPS spokesman said it could be "well into next year" before any changes are noticeable.
DHL said on May 28 that it hoped to work out a contract with UPS within three months and to start making changes in DHL's delivery network beginning later this year.
But that timetable may be unrealistic, because of the complexities of negotiating a deal and putting it into effect, UPS spokesman Norman Black said. UPS is unlikely to begin flying significant amounts of DHL cargo until well into 2009, Black said in a telephone interview last week from his Atlanta office.
"Bottom line is, we expect to be able to negotiate an agreement by the end of this year," Black said. "We, as a vendor, can't build a new operational plan for them until we've got an agreement, until they share information with us about their network and their package flows."
Lt. Gov. Lee Fisher said DHL hasn't given Ohio any new information about the timetable for the proposed deal with UPS.
Fisher made a personal visit to the U.S. Department of Justice in Washington on July 10 to explain Ohio's position that a DHL deal with its rival UPS would reduce competition in the U.S. express delivery market and potentially violate antitrust laws designed to promote competitive markets. If regulators agree, the federal government could join Ohio in a possible antitrust lawsuit against DHL, or Ohio could go it alone under the state's own antitrust law, Fisher said.
Fisher said Justice Department officials told him they had started collecting information about the proposed DHL-UPS deal, but could not start any antitrust investigation until DHL and UPS have a deal in place.
"We are being relentless in our efforts to explore how we can stop this transaction, on multiple fronts," Fisher said.
Ohio would be willing to work with DHL on ways to help reduce its operating costs, but only if the company backs away from the UPS deal and commits to staying in Wilmington, Fisher said. DHL has said it is committed to a deal with UPS.
With the Bush administration scheduled to relinquish power in January 2009, Ohio officials have covered their bases by also bringing their concerns about DHL and the Wilmington jobs to the attention of both major-party presidential candidates, Fisher said. Republican John McCain plans to go to Wilmington in early August for a campaign trip to DHL. Democrat Barack Obama recently met with Wilmington's mayor and workers at DHL.
Ohio has also asked the U.S. Department of Transportation to consider using its authority, independent of an antitrust case, to stop the proposed UPS-DHL deal on grounds it would have negative effect on the U.S. shipping market. Ohio is awaiting responses from both federal agencies.
DHL and UPS say there is no antitrust issue and no need for any government approval. They say it would be a customer-vendor arrangement, similar to DHL's current contracts under which ABX Air and ASTAR Air Cargo fly DHL packages nightly from Wilmington. Replacing ABX and ASTAR with UPS would shift the cargo sorting and flying work to UPS' hub at Louisville, Ky.
DHL projects a $1 billion loss on its U.S. cargo operations this year, but says it needs to continue operating in the United States as a key part of its global delivery network. DHL has forecast that hiring UPS would reduce DHL's U.S. losses to $900 million in 2009, $500 million in 2010 and $300 million in 2011.
DHL said it would also save money by reducing its U.S. delivery network capacity.
"The purpose of our restructuring plan is to build a stronger foundation for sustained operations in the U.S.," Jonathan Baker, a DHL public relations representative, wrote in an e-mailed answer to a reporter's questions. "To do this, a new operating model is required — one that is better matched to the current economy and existing volumes.
"Both rising fuel prices and the downturn in the U.S. economy have had a significant impact on our operations and on the nature and timing of our restructuring plans," Baker wrote.
Ohio's support for DHL in Wilmington
Here is Ohio's accounting of its direct funding contributions in recent years to support expansion and improvements at DHL's Wilmington air freight hub:
Job retention tax credit, valued at $66 million.
Job creation tax credit, 90 percent for five years and 70 percent for 10 years, valued at $13 million.
Rapid outreach grant, up to $2 million.
Training grant, up to $2 million.
Road improvement grant, $1 million.
Dayton-Montgomery County Port Authority sold $270 million in bonds in support of the hub improvement.
The Ohio Department of Transportation is building a $99 million highway bypass project designed to support regional economic department. The project's initial emphasis was DHL's needs, but the state says the new route is still needed to reduce truck traffic through Wilmington and noise in residential neighborhoods. Construction is to be complete by early 2011.
Source: Ohio Department of Development

Contact this reporter at (937) 225-2242 or [email protected].
 
"We are being relentless in our efforts to explore how we can stop this transaction, on multiple fronts," Fisher said.


Reminds me of the movie "Fatal Attraction". You Astar pilots are going to court to force your ex-girlfriend to still be your sweetheart?

What if you're successful? I can't imagine DHL continuing to accept $1 BILLION in losses annually in the US. I'd guess their Plan B is to fold their US operation and by default forfeit all their US business to FedEx and UPS. If so, how do the Astar pilots come out any better?
 
Reminds me of the movie "Fatal Attraction". You Astar pilots are going to court to force your ex-girlfriend to still be your sweetheart?

What if you're successful? I can't imagine DHL continuing to accept $1 BILLION in losses annually in the US. I'd guess their Plan B is to fold their US operation and by default forfeit all their US business to FedEx and UPS. If so, how do the Astar pilots come out any better?

Fold it MON!!!! Just PAY ME and let me LEAVE!!!
 
New timeline: Contract signed in 2009, DOJ filing shortly afterwards. UPS/DHL compelled to open all the books by subpoena......then the fun begins!
 
Reminds me of the movie "Fatal Attraction". You Astar pilots are going to court to force your ex-girlfriend to still be your sweetheart?

What if you're successful? I can't imagine DHL continuing to accept $1 BILLION in losses annually in the US. I'd guess their Plan B is to fold their US operation and by default forfeit all their US business to FedEx and UPS. If so, how do the Astar pilots come out any better?

Troll Alert
 
Troll Alert

To defend BBB, I think he has a valid point. I'm not trying to be incendiary, but what will happen if this deal falls through? Everyone is quick to jump on the "bash UPS" bandwagon, but truthfully, has anyone contemplated the alternative? So, deal falls through with UPS. They now sign up ________ . (you fill in the blank) It could be ABX/ASTAR, or it could be someone else.

If you look back at my posts on this subject, I'm very sympathetic to your plight. I've been furloughed 3 times in 5 years. There truthfully was no option to go back, so it felt like my company just got shut down. Well, actually, one did, but that is besides the point. So, I know what you are feeling. But, just because someone posts an opinion and a question that contradicts your own point of view, they don't become a troll. We all need to take a step back for a bit...
 
To defend BBB, I think he has a valid point. I'm not trying to be incendiary, but what will happen if this deal falls through? Everyone is quick to jump on the "bash UPS" bandwagon, but truthfully, has anyone contemplated the alternative? So, deal falls through with UPS. They now sign up ________ . (you fill in the blank) It could be ABX/ASTAR, or it could be someone else.

If you look back at my posts on this subject, I'm very sympathetic to your plight. I've been furloughed 3 times in 5 years. There truthfully was no option to go back, so it felt like my company just got shut down. Well, actually, one did, but that is besides the point. So, I know what you are feeling. But, just because someone posts an opinion and a question that contradicts your own point of view, they don't become a troll. We all need to take a step back for a bit...

Big Beer Belly, BrowntotheBone, eatme and a host of other names here is the same person who use to be known as "Rhoid", a fired Airborne employee. His only purpose is to harass airline employees.

BTW, his comment of this being like the movie of "Fatal Attraction" shows his ignorance even more. I've seen that movie, and it has no relevance whatsoever to this situation.

As far as ALPA's lawsuit, it has merit.
 
how about harold and kumar go to white castle? maybe there is a comparison- who knows? but riding that cheetah, sweet!
 
Big Beer Belly, BrowntotheBone, eatme and a host of other names here is the same person who use to be known as "Rhoid", a fired Airborne employee. His only purpose is to harass airline employees.

BTW, his comment of this being like the movie of "Fatal Attraction" shows his ignorance even more. I've seen that movie, and it has no relevance whatsoever to this situation.

As far as ALPA's lawsuit, it has merit.

I can't say for BTTB or eatme, but I have seen BBB on this board for a while. Long before the DHL problems. I just think he is proud of his company, which he should, thats a good thing to have. But I don't understand how he says he just shows up, does his job, collects his paycheck and goes home when it is clear by his posts he cares more than just that.

Thats not meant in any harsh way BBB. I like your posts, but I dislike this DHL deal more. And I think this is more personal between the carriers DHL is displacing rather than what you think the feelings are against UPS. And as I posted earlier, I do not blame UPS for any of this mess. I know it is 100% DHL. But I will say that your Norman Black is less than desirable. I can only imagine what he will say about your group when you are at heads with your management.
 
Last edited:
But I will say that your Norman Black is less than desirable. I can only imagine what he will say about your group when you are at heads with your management.

Beginning with the '97 Teamster's strike and over the ensuing years I have to grown to have a strong dislike for Black. He is a corporate spokeshole, no doubt about it.


BBB
 

Latest posts

Latest resources

Back
Top