United gets cozy with Gulfstream

[contrail67]

Rez, you said, "but don't pretend that we aren't to blame here."

We're not to blame. I'm not to blame. The guys who whore themselves out at GIA are to blame. Please, don't use the phrase, "we." Yes, it's the free-market at work, agreed. But, "free-market" is not synonymous with "the proper way it should work." With that type of logic, you can argue that the mafia is part of the "free-market."

And, you can't criticize a SWA guy for paying for a type. There's a difference between paying for a qualification that helps you get a job (i.e., a degree, MBA, a type rating, etc.), and flat-out paying for a job. Other professionals might pay for qualifications, but none of them ever pay for their jobs. Only these GIA-types do that.

The sick thing about it is that SWA could easily type the guy on his checkride....but they make him/her get the type before they walk in the door. WTF.

 

[GuppyWN]

So is a SWA F/O who pays $8000 for his 737 type to fly in his seat a "toolbag" too?

The nice thing about it is the right seat of the 777 gets a type rating at United...for free.

You freaking kill me. You already HAVE THE JOB when you are asked to buy your type rating.

Now I'm going to be a jerk. I make over $200 per hour. How long do you think it took to get my money back on that type rating, Mr. LOOK AT ME I"M A 777 FO? Don't get me wrong - I think you are cool beyond belief, just not that smart about picking your battles.

Gup

 

[Abernathy]

I thought the whole point of SWA having you get your Type on the 737 was to ensure your competence and because they CAN. For $92/hr at 79hr guarantee at 2nd year FO pay, you'd be an idiot to turn them down.

SWA can command the ability to require a 737 type and get the most qualified and willing applicants because their compensation package makes it worth it. If MESA or the bastard airline USAir has become required a type, most likely the same applicants would tell them to screw off.

If you have a company that pays double what Airline X does, you're going to do what you can to weed out the weakest links so you can get the people who really are worth what you pay them.

Now if they could just get you SWA guys to chill the F*** out sometimes. Recently we were no.1 holding short while we could see an aircraft of final so we didn't bother calling up tower for departure quite yet, and SWA behind us kept saying "we're ready"..."we're ready here.." "Southwest's ready..." every 5 seconds. Tower of course ignored all the calls.

 

[Mr.B]

You freaking kill me. You already HAVE THE JOB when you are asked to buy your type rating.

Now I'm going to be a jerk. I make over $200 per hour. How long do you think it took to get my money back on that type rating, Mr. LOOK AT ME I"M A 777 FO? Don't get me wrong - I think you are cool beyond belief, just not that smart about picking your battles.

Gup

Well you know, when you're trying to argue with one of the highest-paying airlines out there, you need SOME ammo.

You type-ratin buying, 8 leg-a-day flyin, 737 for life drivin guys kill me.

When will you be hiring?

 

[contrail67]

You freaking kill me. You already HAVE THE JOB when you are asked to buy your type rating.

Now I'm going to be a jerk. I make over $200 per hour. How long do you think it took to get my money back on that type rating, Mr. LOOK AT ME I"M A 777 FO? Don't get me wrong - I think you are cool beyond belief, just not that smart about picking your battles.

Gup

So have that guy show up to class without his $8000 type rating..and see if he goes on the payroll....You freaking kill me too....

And by the way Mr. $200 per hour....congrats!...but at least I'm not ugly!

and yes....777FO that will be 777 CAPT....u see there is no battle to pick.

 

[acpilot]

...and yes....777FO that will be 777 CAPT....u see there is no battle to pick.

Gee, you must be, like, a SUPERPILOT or something!

 

[waveflyer]

Swa requires type bc they want their pilots invested in the company. They want them to feel ownership and sacrifice and it's one of the things that makes wn tick. That of course wouldn't work at UAL or aa or DAL bc the top managers tend to be in it for themselves, not for the greater good of the company/shareholders/employees/country- it would just be hypocritical and a transparent $$grab.

Gulfstream will continue to gain customers as long as each pilot believes they will be the next wn or fdx or ups pilot- then that equation to get the turbine time is worth it- Less and less though as more majors become less desirable $$-wise.

But it underscores the need for civilians to be integral in the hiring process - we can educate the others on which regionals are shady and which are good stepping stones.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Rez, you said, "but don't pretend that we aren't to blame here."

We're not to blame. I'm not to blame. The guys who whore themselves out at GIA are to blame. Please, don't use the phrase, "we." Yes, it's the free-market at work, agreed. But, "free-market" is not synonymous with "the proper way it should work." With that type of logic, you can argue that the mafia is part of the "free-market.".

I won't address your SWA comments because I am not part of that discussion.

Sorry, you can't be a member of this profession, know this is happening, do nothing and put the burden on those who patronize GIA. Most GIA'er are young and motivated or middle aged and ready for a new career. Most are ignorant of the stigma of GIA.

In addition, plenty of GIA "grads" are working at SWA, FDX and other career carriers... so the pipeline works.

Coming on a moniker message boards is fine, but from a certain perspective there is nothing wrong with GIA. It conforms to our free market, individualist, me me me culture.

If you want change (and I do too), then act.

 

[ual321]

Bottom of the barrel major airline paired with the bottom of the barrel commuter! I see nothing wrong with this.

Just like when united switched from Coke to Pepsi several years ago. United was no longer the airline of choice, why should they serve the number one drink of choice.

 

[Superpilot92]

Gee, you must be, like, a SUPERPILOT or something!

did someone call?

 

[ATRCA]

did someone call?

Well played.......

 

[relief tube]

It's too bad that passengers won't know the difference between an extremely low-experience pilot flying them on Gulfstream, vs. the pilots who have worked their way to their position, ala Southwest, AirTran, etc.

What makes you think there's no ex-GS people at SW or AT. Especially at Airtran I bet there's a bunch.

 

[FNG320]

These are the same flights Gulfstream already provides via codeshare with Continental. No new flights here... looks like they are just adding the United code to their existing service.

Exactly. UAL and CAL both do codeshare with Gulfstream International in different markets. These flights use to be just CAL. They have just expanded the code share to UAL. Just a way to pump up the source of passengers, and maybe even let them expand the routes.

Just my opinion......

FNG

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

I think it's a travesty that those with the cash, and no experience, are allowed to pay to fly right-seat at Gulfstream International Airlines.

For $32,000, after you've paid for all your ratings up-through Commercial-Multi Instrument, they'll put you in the right seat of a BE1900D with only 250 hours total time. See http://www.gulfstreamtrainingacademy.com/Programs.html .

It's too bad that passengers won't know the difference between an extremely low-experience pilot flying them on Gulfstream, vs. the pilots who have worked their way to their position, ala Southwest, AirTran, etc.

Kinda like the people who had to buy a 737 type rating to get a job?? I hear ya!!

Gup's on top of the world since it's the only world he knows.....leather jackets, 6 legs a day, lubbock layovers, and (gasp) VNAV!!!! Holy crap, I've missed a real opportunity by not applying.....

 

[ProFracPilot]

Isn't the GIA-UA code sharing deal as much a part of the move by CO to Star Alliance as anything else? Perhaps it is not the same, but I was on a COEX aircraft to a UA connection the other day. Both legs had UA flight numbers.

Other than to provide yet another thread in which to bash GIA (which is always welcome), there's nothing to see here.