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Union Busting at NWA -- will pilots support the IAM or not?

  • Thread starter Thread starter shon7
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shon7

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 30, 2002
Posts
423
Seems like the IAM might strike at NWA. If so will pilots support this or will this be another AMFA. Does NWA have plans in place for an IAM strike as well?



November 18, 2005 (taken from Wired to the Prez)Black Wednesday
On Wednesday November 16, 2005 Northwest Airlines used the bankruptcy court to drastically alter their employees’ livelihoods by temporarily reducing wages 19 percent and only paying 75 percent of wages for sick days. These reductions will remain in effect until a long-term agreement is in place, or the completion of a Section 1113(c) trial to reject our contracts.
Doug Steenland and the cold-hearted, conscience-devoid merry men on his financial team have spun an evil web of corporate greed that can only be described as callous and arrogant while hiding under the protection of the bankruptcy law.
Northwest has informed District 143 that these cuts were put in effect at 12:01 November 16th. This means that all work performed or sick time taken on that day will be at the court imposed rate, even if the work performed occurred prior to the judge signed the order. District 143 feels that work performed under our collective bargaining agreements before the judge’s order should be paid at the rates in our contracts and we will be filing a grievance on the matter.
These temporary pay cuts, imposed by a judge’s order without the consent of the Machinists Union, are staggering and will affect every element of our lives. Your negotiators repeatedly told the company that our members should not have to endure these types of cuts, especially many of our clerical members who will now be working for close to minimum wage.
Although these cuts will have a tremendous impact on employees, without effective leadership and management no amount of sacrifice will help our airline.
Doug Steenland has employed a financial and legal team fresh off the US Airways bankruptcy. The cuts they sought from IAM members at that carrier were so severe that Machinist negotiators could not agree to them. It appears their intent is to seek even more from Northwest employees.
There should be no misunderstanding, especially after this week’s court action, that we are in a fight for our livelihoods.
Our negotiations for a long-term contract continue under the shadow of a January trial to reject our collective bargaining agreements. If our contracts are terminated, we have the legal right to strike.
If there is to be any successful conclusion to these negotiations, they must occur at the bargaining table. Northwest cannot hide under the protection of bankruptcy law and expect a positive outcome.
The IAM does not deny that Northwest is in financial crisis. However, any sacrifice your negotiators may agree to must be fair, equitable and absolutely necessary for Northwest Airlines to restructure. The Machinists Union will not allow Northwest to use this bankruptcy as open season on IAM members. .
This round of negotiations will determine if there is a next round of bargaining. An agreement must be reached at the bargaining table; otherwise it becomes showdown at the OK Corral in court.
Stick together and stay informed and prepare for the fight of our lives.
In Solidarity,
Bobby De PacePresident/Directing General ChairIAMAW Air Transport District 143
 
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Is the IAM representing mechanics that replaced the AMFA? Seems pretty messed up over there any way you slice it.
 
OB-CPO said:
Is the IAM representing mechanics that replaced the AMFA? Seems pretty messed up over there any way you slice it.
No.

AMFA was the mechanics' and aircraft cleaners' union. The Scabs are non-union.

IAM represents the ground service workers, baggage handlers, etc.

And yes, either way you slice it, it's fu*ked up.

Wouldn't it be ironic if it wasn't the two sickest airlines, but rather two of the healthiest airlines that eventually went the way of Eastern / PanAm because the workers had a backbone? :(
 
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I want to know how the scabs are being treated at N.W. I hope every union worker spits on them and tells them what a piece of sh!t they are!! Anyone care to comment?
 
UPS DC8 said:
I want to know how the scabs are being treated at N.W. I hope every union worker spits on them and tells them what a piece of sh!t they are!! Anyone care to comment?

Don't know about the other NWA people, but I know how I treat them. One of them came over to fix our jetbridge the other day and he was trying to start small talk with me. I just turned and walked away without saying a word. I hope that's exactly what they're used to.
 
OB-CPO said:
Is the IAM representing mechanics that replaced the AMFA? Seems pretty messed up over there any way you slice it.

Hey, OB CPO is your avaitar the same Waco the was used in the Raiders of The Lost Ark?
 
If so will pilots support this or will this be another AMFA

As long as the pension remains viable the pilots will sit back and let NW pick off the other unions one-by-one....then management will turn to them for the coup de grace
 
Spooky 1 said:
Hey, OB CPO is your avaitar the same Waco the was used in the Raiders of The Lost Ark?

yes Obi Wan it is... And the tail number in the movie was "OB-CPO"

Hey you guys wouldnt know where the new forum everybody is talking about is? URL anybody? HELP!
 
OB-CPO said:
Hey you guys wouldnt know where the new forum everybody is talking about is? URL anybody? HELP!
Take a look at my signature. That should get you there. Weather sure is nice. You might say that it's clear - and - a - million. .com :)
 
Hard to have a lot of sympathy for the IAM after they refused to give AMFA any help, and then went after some of the cleaning jobs that were held by AMFA members. I said the other unions would end up regretting the decision not to support AMFA in their strike, even though there were tensions between the different groups. Steeneland and company are now cutting them apart piecemeal, and the industry as a whole will be worse off afterward.
 
PCL 128 wrote:
One of them came over to fix our jetbridge the other day and he was trying to start small talk with me. I just turned and walked away without saying a word.

Oh, that's rich! Did you strike along side the AMFA?

If not, you sure are a big man.

So let me see if I have this right. You didn't honor the strike. And then you turn your back on a guy who is continuing to help you earn that paycheck you so much wanted to continue. Hmmm...

You sound like a hypocrite to me.
 
PsubS said:
PCL 128 wrote:

Oh, that's rich! Did you strike along side the AMFA?

If not, you sure are a big man.

So let me see if I have this right. You didn't honor the strike. And then you turn your back on a guy who is continuing to help you earn that paycheck you so much wanted to continue. Hmmm...

You sound like a hypocrite to me.
He flies for Pinnacle (hence the PCL 128 - it's the council he belongs to).

We didn't have the ability to "honor" an AMFA strike, since we don't work for Northwest. The only way WE could have honored the strike was if Northwest pilots walked... and even then the legality of such an effort is "questionable", although a lot of people might have been conveniently "sick".

Unfortunately, as someone else already pointed out, the ignorance of NWA ALPA to honor the AMFA strike, even with the bad blood, is already coming back to haunt them.

Breaking the unions up, one by one.
 
PsubS said:
PCL 128 wrote:

Oh, that's rich! Did you strike along side the AMFA?

If not, you sure are a big man.

So let me see if I have this right. You didn't honor the strike. And then you turn your back on a guy who is continuing to help you earn that paycheck you so much wanted to continue. Hmmm...

You sound like a hypocrite to me.
He's a PFT'er too. That's what makes it even better.

I don't understand how paying for a job gives you any right to look down on someone who takes someone elses?
 
Ummm.... everyone pays for training. It's just the degree to which you do it. He didn't walk past a bunch of striking Pinnacle pilots to get his seat. I am not a big fan of PFT, but it is nowhere near scabbing.

That said, is AMFA still out on strike? I don't work for NW or subsids so I don't know the latest.
 
OB-CPO said:
yes Obi Wan it is... And the tail number in the movie was "OB-CPO"

Hey you guys wouldnt know where the new forum everybody is talking about is? URL anybody? HELP!

I have a friend down in Orgeon that owns that airplane. Really nice!
 
pianoman said:
That said, is AMFA still out on strike? I don't work for NW or subsids so I don't know the latest.

Technically yes, but I haven't seen any picket lines in a few weeks. They've pretty much lost at this point. It was a failed venture from the get go. They just didn't have the leverage to pull it off with all of the SCABs willing to steal their jobs.
 
pianoman said:
Ummm.... everyone pays for training. It's just the degree to which you do it. He didn't walk past a bunch of striking Pinnacle pilots to get his seat. I am not a big fan of PFT, but it is nowhere near scabbing.
That's a ******cop-out and you know it.

There's a HUGE difference in paying for college and the ratings required to obtain a basic job and paying for "aircraft-specific" or "specific-job-required" training which is somehow not required for people with more experience.

For example, a Doctor pays for all his college which takes him a decade of internships that give him certain "certifications" along the way towards a GP's license or a Specialization. If he wants a job at a specific hospital AFTER that such as the Mayo Clinic or John Hopkins, he doesn't go and spend another $80,000, he ***** EARNS IT by gaining experience and qualifications IN HIS CURRENT JOB!

And yes, Southwest if PFT too. If the government hadn't paid for mine, I'd still be sitting without the 737 type.

/rant
 
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Actually a Doctor is a good example. He pays for his college education, specialized training, and then works at way sub par wages during intern and residency years working on the job, and then he can go out and set up his own practice at his own expense, or, become employed at far less by a hospital or clinic.
In years of over supply, many pilots go get their own ratings for as long as an employer can get someone ready to go, why would they pay to train someone unless it is an upgrade situation.
 
Publishers said:
Actually a Doctor is a good example. He pays for his college education, specialized training, and then works at way sub par wages during intern and residency years working on the job, and then he can go out and set up his own practice at his own expense, or, become employed at far less by a hospital or clinic.
In years of over supply, many pilots go get their own ratings for as long as an employer can get someone ready to go, why would they pay to train someone unless it is an upgrade situation.
You're VERY conveniently leaving out one important fact that makes your argument completely wrong:

A doctor MUST have that college education and specialized training to work as a doctor. It's called an M.D. and he can't work without it. A doctor does not get to buy his way into a SPECIFIC hospital (company) by BUYING a specific license.

As a pilot, you must have a Commercial Multiengine Instrument Rating or you cannot work as a pilot. Anything more than that, ESPECIALLY buying a SPECIFIC rating or required schooling to obtain a job that must be filled ANYWAY is something NO other honorable profession does. We have become whores to our own greed.

To answer your last rhetorical question: as an airline, a 121 Air Carrier flying large category aircraft MUST have a Second In Command in the flight deck. It's assinine for someone to PAY a company for training that company will have to do ANYWAY. If people stopped doing it, airlines would have to train these people AT THEIR OWN COST.

Oh never mind... people are too stupid to ever realize they're contributing to their own professional demise.
 
Lear70 your right on the money. After Midway went out (the original Midway that is) I was out of Aviation for 2 years. This was back when a ton of regional's were pay to play..There was no way I was going to do that...so I worked outside the field and waited. The whole time I networked and kept in contact with HR folks at Company's I wanted to work for.

Paying to play is just plain wrong on so many levels. I got into a heated discussion with a station manager years ago about this. He said well it cost the co. good money to train you and then you leave. I said how about if you get a new deice truck but before you use it you have to pay to be trained on it. He said That is not the same it is a piece of equipment required for the job. And I said Bingo!
 

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