UAL App Question

[dojetdriver]

I don't know what interns you know, but I can tell you that when I did the internship, there was not one person (out of about 20) that were related to a United Pilot. Perhaps things were different when you did the internship. Additionally, most of the folks on the internship came from pretty humble backgrounds. I for one put myself through college and flight school without any help from family. My mother is a single parent who taught elementary school for fifteen years, making terrible money and trying to put two kids through college.

The internship was pretty competitive and required some hard work in college, extra-curricular activity, leadership of some sort, and good flying/technical knowledge. You had to complete a long application and interview process, and have some personality to pass the interview.

There was a time when the UAL TK had about 5-6 interns per SEMESTER. Usually 1 or 2 ER, 1 or 2 UND, 1 or 2 Purdue, and 1 or 2 MSCD, 1 or 2 from other schools. LT, FIT, ect. Don't know about the world HQ or other locations. Late 90's-2000, it went up to what, 50 at the TK alone?

It used to be A LOT more competitive. And the previous poster was correct. Where I went to college, they would post the list of people to interviewed by the COLLEGE, before being sent to interview with the UAL people for final selection.

The initial list was usually around 12 people, of those maybe 3-4 would make the cut to go interview with the UAL people, then 1 or 2 got selected to do the intern. It sure was a bizarre coincidence that the 1 or 2 almost always had a parent at UAL. A fleet manager, standards CA, widebody CA, TK instructor, ect.

Don't get me wrong, some of them were great people. Some were less than great people and had everything in life handed to them and had no shame in telling the world about it.

Then entire time, I only knew of 2 that didn't have a parent at UAL. And those two were the definition of hard charging/go getters that are driven to succeed.

Point of the story, it was at one time SUPER COMPETITIVE, and like everything else in this industry. It came down to who you know or are related to.

 

[T-Bags]

100 of every 1000 hired were minorities.

Just curious what percentage of the applicants were minorities?

By the way, it is entirely possible that Steve Ritchie might suck in a crew environment. It is entirely possible as well, that AL Haynes would suck in a fighter.

PIPE

You do know that the F-4 WAS a "crew" airplane...

But your point is valid. The total number of hours you have or even your number of MIG kills is less important to this job than the type person you are.

 

[T-Bags]

So the guy has a problem with mental math, you have a problem with "message board spelling" and I assume you got hired.


I hope everyone has seen the Youtube piece about the UAL crew that got lost at PVD. Another case of every airline talking about your airline during recurrent CRM training.

So if you and I compete for a job as a 4th grade english teacher, you'll get the job. Feel better now? On the PVD thing, do you guys honestly talk about that in recurrent? I guess there are some REAL good lessons. The UAL guys made a wrong trun in the fog. They FESSED UP. The controller was a complete F'n tool who should have been fired. The USAir crew were heros for sticking to their guns and preventing a Class A. Since flight hours are so important, how many flight hours did the UAL Capt and F/O have?

Do you also talk about the NWA accident under similar circumstances at one of their HUBS? Or the DAL runway incursion at LAX? Or the SWA incursions? If you're smart, you'll take these things as learning experiences so that you hopefully won't do it yourself. We have a "film" of the UAL incident more than likely because UAL wanted it's pilots to LEARN from it and become safer aviators, rather than hiding it under a rug.

 

[T-Bags]

Bigotry now? I am only stating facts tbag.

Again, your choice of words reveals your true character. Calling people names really shows that you are unable to express yourself in an educated or respectful manner. I would expect nothing less from an individual such as yourself.

Yet you call others "son" in this thread and accuse a guy of not having a life because of the time he posted his reply. If you're as "experienced" as you claim to be, what does it say about you that you have so many posts on this message board? What does it say about you that you're posting on a topic that you claim is not relavent to you?

I don't post on Mesa threads about the hiring process. Why? Because I don't GIVE A SH!T! Same goes for ANY AIRLINE BUT MY OWN. The fact that you insist on complaining about UAL's process indicates you're still bitter. GET OVER IT!

Ironically, SWA had about the same success rate for those interviewed as UAL. UAL called people in based on a computer score. AMR and DAL had MUCH better processes ("hey Cecil, can I cut your grass?" "Can anybody get my app on Plato's desk?").

If you're a quality guy, then you LOVED SWA and UAL's process. It meant getting an interview (and a chance) long before you would have otherwise. But if the only qualification you have is a bunch of flight hours, you hate it.

 

[pipe]

I don't know what interns you know, but I can tell you that when I did the internship, there was not one person (out of about 20) that were related to a United Pilot. Perhaps things were different when you did the internship. Additionally, most of the folks on the internship came from pretty humble backgrounds. I for one put myself through college and flight school without any help from family. My mother is a single parent who taught elementary school for fifteen years, making terrible money and trying to put two kids through college.

The internship was pretty competitive and required some hard work in college, extra-curricular activity, leadership of some sort, and good flying/technical knowledge. You had to complete a long application and interview process, and have some personality to pass the interview.

Once selected, an intern worked at United for a semester for no pay. This basically served as a three month interview by everyone at TK or WHQ, including your immediate pilot supervisor. There were some benefits including unlimited flight simulator time, jumpseating, newhire/recurrent/upgrade classes, CRM training, and of course pref-interviewing.

Being an intern doesn't make you a better person or make you more qualified. The reason interns get special consideration is simply because interns are a known entity. They have been screened already and have shown long-term interest in United. In general they drink the kool-aid and don't cause much trouble. They still have to meet the same minimums as everyone else. Some interns are great people, others are tools. United and most other airlines with such programs seem to have success with former interns. This is no different than any other industry.

I appreciate your perspective, but there is no need to mock the accomplishments of others. We all have different ways of getting to the same place, and in the end everyone who is qualified will have a chance for a job at a great company (assuming that exists anymore). Plenty of guys didn't do an internship in college and are senior to me at my company because they got into a flying job a semester or two before I did. Good on them, we all make our choices and take our own path.

Like I said, there are always exceptions. I am not mocking anybody or their accomplishments. I would argue however that a UA internship, in the big scheme of things, doesn't qualify as an accomplishment to most of us.

As for the part about the Kool-Aid, you are right on. It is one reason why it's so hard to get the group to stand up to Tilton and friends. Truthfully, the internship is a mgt. coup.

PIPE

 

[Guitar rocker]

Yet you call others "son" in this thread and accuse a guy of not having a life because of the time he posted his reply. If you're as "experienced" as you claim to be, what does it say about you that you have so many posts on this message board?

Son, let me explain something to you. I thought that it was pretty easy to comprehend, but not so for some I guess. You cant even begin to compare the word "son" to a few things that you have said. Lets recap those:

1. "Maybe it took him that long to roll your fat @ss mom off him and get her out the door." Now if that isnt classy, I dont know what is. If you have to express yourself in that type of manner at this level and on some website, I guess you cant be all that intelligent.

2. "Dumb @ss" ...again, you are showing your intelligence.

How do you know how experienced that I am? I havent claimed to be one way or another. I might be a student pilot or might be an astronaut. Dont just assume there son. And just for your information, the number of posts that I or anyone else has is irrelevant in any discussion.

 

[Guitar rocker]

So if you and I compete for a job as a 4th grade english teacher, you'll get the job. Feel better now?

Do you also talk about the NWA accident under similar circumstances at one of their HUBS? Or the DAL runway incursion at LAX? Or the SWA incursions? If you're smart, you'll take these things as learning experiences so that you hopefully won't do it yourself. We have a "film" of the UAL incident more than likely because UAL wanted it's pilots to LEARN from it and become safer aviators, rather than hiding it under a rug.

Your missing some basics to be a teacher at all.

Oh, so UAL pilots must be the only ones that "FESS" up to anything and that way you can all "LEARN" from that incident. Geeez....to imply that we dont study and learn from incidents of others is ridiculous. Where have you been? In a recurrent class, we dont just go over our own incidents but we learn from everyones mistakes. It can happen to anyone at anytime.

You are making it sound like everyone else is trying to "hide it under the rug" and that only you UAL guys are out there to "fess up" and "learn".....in your opinion ofcourse. That is arrogance at its finest. You are becoming an embarrassment to pilots in general and to your fellow UAL co-workers on this site rather quickly.

 

[Hvy]

Hey Rocker...who do YOU work for? Too embarrassed to share the answer with all of us "young pups"? We're waiting.......

 

[mdf]

Dang. A full fledged UAL bash thread. Welcome back!

 

[Guitar rocker]

Hey Rocker...who do YOU work for? Too embarrassed to share the answer with all of us "young pups"? We're waiting.......

I fly small single engine planes in and out of small strips in south america. And also sell Kirby vacuum cleaners on the side....the new Kirby 650X is something that you should have HVY. I'll be happy to sell you one for a mere 2 grand. And on the weekends, I play lead guitar in a rock band in Chicago. Tear the house down......

 

[Hvy]

I fly small single engine planes in and out of small strips in south america. And also sell Kirby vacuum cleaners on the side....the new Kirby 650X is something that you should have HVY. I'll be happy to sell you one for a mere 2 grand. And on the weekends, I play lead guitar in a rock band in Chicago. Tear the house down......

Just as I thought...My Dyson outperforms your Kirby. Were you the guy I kicked off the front porch last week that couldn't comprehend the "NO SOLICITING" sign? You came back with, "I ain't no prostitute." Must have been....

 

[Guitar rocker]

Just as I thought...My Dyson outperforms your Kirby. Were you the guy I kicked off the front porch last week that couldn't comprehend the "NO SOLICITING" sign? You came back with, "I ain't no prostitute." Must have been....

Mmmm, no. My sign does say, "Im a prostitute." You must have me mistaken for someone else.

My Kirby will suck that piece of yours right down.

 

[dojetdriver]

Kit Darby mowes Chuck Norris's grass, AND takes his kids to soccer practice.

 

[mkingmei]

you guys all must have a really sorry sex life. find a girlfriend and stop spending so much time in front of the computer. don't you talk about work enough when you're at work and getting paid to do it?

 

[contrail67]

Its the only way they can get their hard drive stimulated.

 

[mkingmei]

you guys all must have a really sorry sex life. find a girlfriend and stop spending so much time in front of the computer. don't you talk about work enough when you're at work and getting paid to do it?

For those who may have been offended by the above comment, I am now here to tell you it was not me that posted this trash. It was another individual using my logon. I do apologize for the confusion.

 

[UALBRAT]

Family Member?

I'll enlighten you.

1) You need good grades in college at one of the usual aviation schools that have the program (not exactly Rhodes Scholar stuff).

2) Extracirricular activities (read: flight team dork, Alpha Eta Rho dork)

3) Family "member" at UAL (read: Daddy is a Captain)

4) Enough money to afford to take a semester off, pay for your move, pay for your housing, and work for free (read: Daddy is a Captain)

As with anything, there are exceptions. However, I can personally attest that the majority of the ones I know fit the above profile to the tune of at least 3 out of 4.

PIPE

As for the Family "member", when I graduated from Embry-Riddle in 1987 UAL was just beginning their EEOC campaign. My family member was already a 30 year UAL veteran and at the time the most senior Captain on the 737-300 at ORD. He was one of the most respected Captains and was well known as an all around great guy at UAL. Additonally, when I applied at UAL, I had a dozen letters of recommedations from other like individuals at UAL that knew me since the day I was born. After EIGHT years and the implementation of the Employee Son/Daughter program I finally received an interview. I had around 9000 hours at that time. Two weeks later, got the FU letter from Nancy Stuhke. Been flying a desk for the last 4 years. No reserves,overnites, early or long days. I get decent pay and have not had to pack a suitcase. Still miss flying though.

If anyone has any old issues of the ALPA magazine, my old man is on the cover carrying a UAL picket sign. Maybe that's why I did not get hired?

 

[dojetdriver]

As for the Family "member", when I graduated from Embry-Riddle in 1987 UAL was just beginning their EEOC campaign. My family member was already a 30 year UAL veteran and at the time the most senior Captain on the 737-300 at ORD. He was one of the most respected Captains and was well known as an all around great guy at UAL. Additonally, when I applied at UAL, I had a dozen letters of recommedations from other like individuals at UAL that knew me since the day I was born. After EIGHT years and the implementation of the Employee Son/Daughter program I finally received an interview. I had around 9000 hours at that time. Two weeks later, got the FU letter from Nancy Stuhke. Been flying a desk for the last 4 years. No reserves,overnites, early or long days. I get decent pay and have not had to pack a suitcase. Still miss flying though.

If anyone has any old issues of the ALPA magazine, my old man is on the cover carrying a UAL picket sign. Maybe that's why I did not get hired?

Wow, incredible story. Amazing, the company can't reward a loyal employee by hiring their child, much less somebody who was a competitive candidate.

I heard that Al Haynes's got turned down as well. Anybody know if that is true or just urban legend?

 

[Sonny Crockett]

Wow, incredible story. Amazing, the company can't reward a loyal employee by hiring their child, much less somebody who was a competitive candidate.

I heard that Al Haynes's got turned down as well. Anybody know if that is true or just urban legend?

It was Denny Fitch's son that was turned down, however he was later hired in 2000.

My old man was a NWA 35+ year 747-400 Capt and I didn't "get" an interview. I could care less....

 

[dojetdriver]

It was Denny Fitch's son that was turned down, however he was later hired in 2000.

My old man was a NWA 35+ year 747-400 Capt and I didn't "get" an interview. I could care less....

Thanks for the clarification. Still, the child of one of the poster boys for CRM and professional aviation in general can't get hired. Wow.

 

[Black Hawk]

The fact that you insist on complaining about UAL's process indicates you're still bitter. GET OVER IT!

Ironically, SWA had about the same success rate for those interviewed as UAL. UAL called people in based on a computer score.

If you're a quality guy, then you LOVED SWA and UAL's process. It meant getting an interview (and a chance) long before you would have otherwise. But if the only qualification you have is a bunch of flight hours, you hate it.

Even though the rejection/acceptance rates are about the same you don't hear anywhere near the amount of complaints about SWA's process. We all know UAL's tactic was to be abrasive to see how candidates react but you got to wonder what that proves. Maybe UAL will show a little more class this time around.