Sonny Crockett
Well-known member
- Joined
- Aug 9, 2005
- Posts
- 584
FW: TA Leaks out from MEC ??? This could be a RUMOR or BS !!!!
No more than a 3 year deal as they want to be at the table when synergies are fully realized.
As far as the transition agreement I hear its complicated at the agreement in principal has no language and they do not want to get burned in negotiating the language because that’s what happened in BK1 with no language and a vote on a term sheet and not a contract. I hear the furlough and job protection rocks but until the final interpretation is done by the lawyers from both sides and language is argued they don’t want to put anything to the pilot group. I don’t know the actual details just where they are in the process.
As far as pay, I think the 12-13% figure is low. Here is the logic.
There is NO WAY that the CAL MEC is going to send a deal to its pilots that don’t give them significant raises. In order for us just to get to their rates in the 767 and the A320 fleet it requires almost 20% to get there. The 777 not as big but somewhere in the 6-8% range. Now that’s the starting point which is CAL’s rates. You have to look at it from the CAL side and their MEC as well. Realistically, If the shoe was on our foot and we where the higher paid, we would lynch our MEC for not providing raises after a 9 year concessionary screw job. You also have to figure that the DAL contract actually hurt us as the rates are still lower than CAL’s on most fleets. The CAL argument is they get our work rules and the cap will be raise but on the flip side because of our work rules a lot of their guys will take pay cuts. For instance some of their international guys because no duty rigs and no work rules make 120 hours of pay a month. Reduce that to 85 and they take a huge hit. It is going to be difficult to make both sides happy but the start is going to be in pay rates and because of the situation we (ual pilots) are in, we will be getting the bigger of the raises.
Here is my educated guess based on the little that I have heard and comparing industry contracts to include Alaska and Southwest. We will get CAL plus 7-10% initially with needing 5% per year for a 3 year deal to stay with Delta. Caps are going to come down while we have furloughs and guarantee will come up. Attached is the CAL and DAL contracts for comparisons.
I have told my guy that unless the above is achieved which will give us 30-40% over 3 years, the answer will be NO. They also have a big nut to crack with the “A” fund guys at CAL as this becomes a UAL liability when CAL and UAL are merged. There has to be a makeup to make guys without a frozen “A” plan to be made whole. There is a lot of things going on. These are only my guess’s on most of the big issues.
FROM AN MEC SOURCE
AUTHOR UNKNOWN
No more than a 3 year deal as they want to be at the table when synergies are fully realized.
As far as the transition agreement I hear its complicated at the agreement in principal has no language and they do not want to get burned in negotiating the language because that’s what happened in BK1 with no language and a vote on a term sheet and not a contract. I hear the furlough and job protection rocks but until the final interpretation is done by the lawyers from both sides and language is argued they don’t want to put anything to the pilot group. I don’t know the actual details just where they are in the process.
As far as pay, I think the 12-13% figure is low. Here is the logic.
There is NO WAY that the CAL MEC is going to send a deal to its pilots that don’t give them significant raises. In order for us just to get to their rates in the 767 and the A320 fleet it requires almost 20% to get there. The 777 not as big but somewhere in the 6-8% range. Now that’s the starting point which is CAL’s rates. You have to look at it from the CAL side and their MEC as well. Realistically, If the shoe was on our foot and we where the higher paid, we would lynch our MEC for not providing raises after a 9 year concessionary screw job. You also have to figure that the DAL contract actually hurt us as the rates are still lower than CAL’s on most fleets. The CAL argument is they get our work rules and the cap will be raise but on the flip side because of our work rules a lot of their guys will take pay cuts. For instance some of their international guys because no duty rigs and no work rules make 120 hours of pay a month. Reduce that to 85 and they take a huge hit. It is going to be difficult to make both sides happy but the start is going to be in pay rates and because of the situation we (ual pilots) are in, we will be getting the bigger of the raises.
Here is my educated guess based on the little that I have heard and comparing industry contracts to include Alaska and Southwest. We will get CAL plus 7-10% initially with needing 5% per year for a 3 year deal to stay with Delta. Caps are going to come down while we have furloughs and guarantee will come up. Attached is the CAL and DAL contracts for comparisons.
I have told my guy that unless the above is achieved which will give us 30-40% over 3 years, the answer will be NO. They also have a big nut to crack with the “A” fund guys at CAL as this becomes a UAL liability when CAL and UAL are merged. There has to be a makeup to make guys without a frozen “A” plan to be made whole. There is a lot of things going on. These are only my guess’s on most of the big issues.
FROM AN MEC SOURCE
AUTHOR UNKNOWN
