UAIR pilots to vote

[lowecur]

But will they be able to tally before the judge makes his decision tomorrow? The judge will grant UAIR 23% for all the other work groups, and probably withhold a decision on the pilots pending the tally. UAIR released this statement after an acrimonious session in PIT. I'm sure the threat of a lawsuit from members played into this decision. I'm guessing a 65 to 70% majority will rule the day. The seniority deal is out the window if this passes, so Freshwater and the other seniors can bump less senior pilots if they decide to go all Airbus. We'll see if job actions will eventually prevail.

Reuters
US Air Pilots to Vote on Pay-Cut Proposal
Wednesday October 6, 3:43 am ET
By John Crawley


WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Bankrupt US Airways took a crucial step toward securing $300 million in concessions from its pilots union late on Tuesday when leaders of the labor group said they would forward a plan to cut wages and benefits to all pilots for a vote.

The 12-member executive committee of the Air Line Pilots Association has been sharply split on the need for more wage and benefit reductions, and key members had blocked previous efforts to let the group's 3,200 pilots decide the matter for themselves.

Tuesday's decision to forward the proposal that includes an 18 percent wage cut was preceded by an acrimonious day-long meeting in Pittsburgh. Pilots, like other unions at US Airways, are under enormous pressure to agree to concessions to avoid court-imposed cuts.

The company is set to go to bankruptcy court in Virginia on Thursday to press the need for temporary forced concessions, which would cut more deeply than anything that would be reached voluntarily.

"We have again stepped up to save this company so that it can emerge from bankruptcy and demonstrate sustained profitability," said Capt. Bill Pollock, chairman of the Master Executive Council for the US Airways pilots.

US Airways has struggled for months to get its major unions to agree to nearly $1 billion in new annual cost savings to help it restructure as a low-cost carrier and survive. The company hopes voluntary cuts taken by pilots, its most powerful unionized work force, will prompt other unions to go along.

"We have enormous respect for Capt. Bill Pollock and the (executive committee) for their leadership and good judgment in passing a resolution that allows our pilots a choice in the direction of this company," said US Airways chief executive Bruce Lakefield.

Flight attendants, mechanics and airport workers are talking to the company, but there are no indications that agreements are close.

BITTER NEGOTIATIONS

The big unions filed sharp objections on Tuesday with the bankruptcy court to the airline's bid to impose savings that include a 23-percent across-the-board cut in wages and reduced pension contributions.

US Airways says it needs to save $38 million a month over the next few months to pool enough cash and survive past January.

The Association of Flight Attendants said US Airways has "neglected to meaningfully pursue negotiations" on voluntary contract modifications, and instead "seeks to use the hammer" of the bankruptcy court to force a solution.

Mechanics represented by the International Association of Machinists (IAM), which has so far refused to reopen its contract for new concessions, took the criticism a step further by blasting the company's reorganization plan.

The IAM says the restructuring is "anything but realistic" and depends mostly on "slashing labor costs to the core" while "hoarding unrealistically high levels of cash."

US Airways spokesman David Castelveter reaffirmed the company's immediate need for cost cuts and defended the reorganization's course.

"We believe that we have a strong plan, one that with the right cost structure will not only make the company prosper but will enable it to become more competitive," Castelveter said.

The company announced management cuts on Monday exceeding $45 million annually, including hundreds of job cuts and wage and benefit reductions of more than 20 percent.

US Airways entered bankruptcy for the second time in two years on Sept. 12.

 

[LearLove]

MEC CODE-A-PHONE UPDATE
​

October 5, 2004
​

This is Jack Stephan with a US Airways MEC update for Tuesday, October 5th, with two new items.

Item 1. The MEC reconvened its meeting today in PIT, and after discussing the Transformation Plan TA with the Negotiating Committee and ALPA’s legal and financial advisors, overwhelmingly voted to send the Transformation Plan tentative agreement out for a membership ratification vote. This resolution has been posted on the pilots only website under “MEC Information.”



Balloting will begin soon and will close at 10:00 a.m. on October 21st. Balloting information will be mailed and emailed to all pilots in good standing, announced on the code a phone, and posted on the pilots only website. Education materials will also soon be sent out, which will include a Chairman’s letter, the text of the TA, a TA fact sheet, and a detailed position paper listing advantages, disadvantages and the alternatives of the major Tentative Agreement provisions, as required by MEC resolution. These materials will also be available through mail, email and the pilots only website. Road shows have also been scheduled. The revised schedule is as follows:

Friday, October 8 in CLT at the Renaissance CLT Suites at 10 a.m.

Monday, October 11 in PHL at the Renaissance PHL Hotel Airport at 10:30 a.m.

Tuesday, Oct. 12 in BOS at the Holiday Inn Boston-Logan Airport at 10 a.m.

Wednesday, October 13 in DCA at the Crystal Gateway Marriott at 10 a.m.

Thursday, October 14 in PIT at a location to be determined at 9:30 a.m.

​

The location of the PIT meeting will be announced on the code-a-phone and website as soon as it is available. The Comm Center will be reactivated shortly. The dates and times of operation will be announced on the code a phone and website.



Item 2. The Council 41 reps sent a letter to their pilots yesterday that compares our current contract provisions to provisions that they believed would be implemented if a judge would grant the Company’s 1113(e) motion, and also compares those items to provisions from the tentative agreement reached last week. This comparison is incomplete and misleading because an 1113(e) motion is for short term economic relief only.



The TA should be compared to long-term relief that would be sought in bankruptcy under the provisions of 1113(c). According to our advisors, an 1113(c) motion would contain provisions no better than the TA, and could in fact, contain some provisions that would be much worse.



Please refer to official MEC documentation for your decision making. Make every effort to attend one of the roadshows. And as always, demand the facts, and take advantage of all the educational tools we will provide for your deliberations.



Please remember we have 1,879 pilots on furlough.



Thank you for listening.

 

[lowecur]

​

Item 2. The Council 41 reps sent a letter to their pilots yesterday that compares our current contract provisions to provisions that they believed would be implemented if a judge would grant the Company’s 1113(e) motion, and also compares those items to provisions from the tentative agreement reached last week. This comparison is incomplete and misleading because an 1113(e) motion is for short term economic relief only.



The TA should be compared to long-term relief that would be sought in bankruptcy under the provisions of 1113(c). According to our advisors, an 1113(c) motion would contain provisions no better than the TA, and could in fact, contain some provisions that would be much worse.

Typical terrorist tactics. Distort the facts and confuse the membership. I think Fred will find much to his chagrin, that most of his constituancy has grey matter between their ears, and will vote for survival.

If I understand it correctly, the 23% is across the board and only temporary for 60 days, so the new TA if radified, will go into effect after 1113(e) expires.

 

[TWA Dude]

lowecur, just pray that in your life you'll never have to face the decision that the pilots of USAirways are facing now. Nobody there actually wants the company to liquidate. Sometimes one must vote one's conscience come what may.

 

[rightrudder]

Typical terrorist tactics. Distort the facts and confuse the membership. I think Fred will find much to his chagrin, that most of his constituancy has grey matter between their ears, and will vote for survival.

If I understand it correctly, the 23% is across the board and only temporary for 60 days, so the new TA if radified, will go into effect after 1113(e) expires.

The only reason you give a rats a$$ about this situation is your precious EMB stock. Why should you care if USAir liquidates or stays afloat? You could care less about the employees at this company who are in a terrible predicament. You do not belong on this board. You are not a pilot or an airline person. You are a stock speculator. go hang out on the yahoo finance board, or some other place where you can be among your own kind.

 

[lowecur]

The only reason you give a rats a$$ stop using my analogies about this situation is your precious EMB stock. Those 170's would be grabbed up quicker than you could say leftrudder by Republic Airways. Why should you care if USAir liquidates or stays afloat? Because I hate to see fat cat vindictive moron's like Freddy jeopardize thousands of employees and their families for his own self righteous needs. You could care less about the employees at this company who are in a terrible predicament. No, I do care, and that's why common sense will prevail. You do not belong on this board. You are not a pilot or an airline person. You are a stock speculator. go hang out on the yahoo finance board, or some other place where you can be among your own kind. No.

.....

 

[lowecur]

lowecur, just pray that in your life you'll never have to face the decision that the pilots of USAirways are facing now. It's a no-brainer. Nobody there actually wants the company to liquidate. Wrong. Sometimes one must vote one's conscience come what may. Especially when your a few years from retirement, your kids' are grown up, and you don't need the money.

.....

 

[TWA Dude]

Especially when your a few years from retirement, your kids' are grown up, and you don't need the money.

Huh? If they didn't need the money they'd have quit already. If it was such a no-brainer the pilots' would be offering more than what the company is asking so they could be more viable. There comes a point when givebacks yield nothing.

Who are you? Your profile doesn't indicate your involvement in the airline industry other than owning some stock. I've flown for two regionals and two majors for the past eight years and belonged to three different pilot unions. Oh yeah, plus I've owned my share of airline stocks and GE.

 

[General Lee]

He is an analyst with no airline experience.




Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[lowecur]

Huh? If they didn't need the money they'd have quit already. I don't need the money, and I haven't quit yet. What kind of a statement is that?If it was such a no-brainer the pilots' would be offering more than what the company is asking so they could be more viable. The no brainer is the yes vote on the TA. There comes a point when givebacks yield nothing. There is no line in the sand when you're out of work.

Who are you? I'm a semi retired insurance agent and amateur analcyst that luvs this business. Your profile doesn't indicate your involvement in the airline industry other than owning some stock. So. I've flown for two regionals and two majors for the past eight years and belonged to three different pilot unions. Gee, you get around alot. Oh yeah, plus I've owned my share of airline stocks and GE. You haven't made much money, unless you've shorted those stocks.

.....

 

[lowecur]

He is an analyst with no airline experience.




Bye Bye--General Lee

Hey GL, looks like you may have a deal soon. Hurry up, ERJ needs those orders before the end of the year.

 

[Beechdriver32]

He called himself an amateur ‘Anal Cyst’. Personally, I think you are a professional.

Lowecur,


Seriously, you keep me laughing, your inputs are very funny. Good luck with your ERJ shares, just remember that this is not a ‘hobby’ for most of us, it is our life. Just keep that in mind when you post some of your ‘jokes’.


Regards-

BD32

 

[lowecur]

He called himself an amateur ‘Anal Cyst’. Pain in the A$$. Personally, I think you are a professional. Professional Insurance Agent.

Lowecur,


Seriously, you keep me laughing, your inputs are very funny. Good luck with your ERJ shares, just remember that this is not a ‘hobby’ for most of us, it is our life. Just keep that in mind when you post some of your ‘jokes’. You need a sense of humor the most when things seem the worst. I try to be serious and inject some levity to make it a little more interesting. Unfortunately, not everyone is on the same page. You just can't please the world.


Regards-

BD32

.....

 

[AA717driver]

Lc--TWAdude hasn't "gotten around" by his choice. He and I and thousands of others live this 'game'. Anal-ysts just kibitz.TC

 

[TWA Dude]

I don't need the money, and I haven't quit yet. What kind of a statement is that?

You implied that the almost-retired guys were trying to sellout the rest.

The no brainer is the yes vote on the TA.
How would you know? You don't work there.

I'm a semi retired insurance agent and amateur analcyst that luvs this business.
Thank you for answering. I welcome your opinions here but advise that you might benefit from putting yourself in other people's shoes. You tend to be callous to the plights of real people.
It's easy to look at this industry from the outside and point fingers but when you're living it the perspective can be different. It's very easy to blame Labor for everything. Well guess what, you have to pay employees to work and happy employees work harder than unhappy ones. And it's usually not a matter of pay but of respect that makes employees happy. The USAir employees have been cornered and are now being told to shoulder the blame for that which isn't their fault. How would you feel, especially with the knowledge that your repeated concessions may have no effect anyway? If a ship is sinking does it not make sense to jump before the final dive?

Gee, you get around alot.
Not all by choice.

You haven't made much money, unless you've shorted those stocks.
I'm a pilot, not a broker. GE's done me well so far.

 

[TWA Dude]

TC, you're the original compassionate conservative. Peace up, bro.

 

[Double Shot]

EMB products are a P.O.S.

 

[lowecur]

You implied that the almost-retired guys were trying to sellout the rest. They are.

How would you know? You don't work there. Let's just say I have a sixth sense. We'll see who's right at the end of the month when you should see a landslide vote to accept the TA.

Thank you for answering. I welcome your opinions here but advise that you might benefit from putting yourself in other people's shoes. You tend to be callous to the plights of real people. Actually, I'm very sensitive to the plight of the majority, but I don't have alot of patience for employees who continually try to piss into a hurricane. At some point you just have to accept the inevitable, circle the wagons, start a new base and rebuild. As a recent article stated, deregulation is finally beginning to work. The legacy's always found a way to rebuff the LCC startups and this thing called capitalism.

It's easy to look at this industry from the outside and point fingers but when you're living it the perspective can be different. It's very easy to blame Labor for everything. I don't blame labor for anything. Everything you have seen in this business the last 20 years is the process of nobody wanting to give an inch or work together. Both mgt and labor are at fault for carrying their causes to extremes. Perhaps there will be lessons learned from what's going on, but I have my doubts, as the usual ego's will surface in future negotiations.

Well guess what, you have to pay employees to work and happy employees work harder than unhappy ones. And it's usually not a matter of pay but of respect that makes employees happy. Sorry, but I believe it's both.

The USAir employees have been cornered and are now being told to shoulder the blame for that which isn't their fault. How would you feel, especially with the knowledge that your repeated concessions may have no effect anyway? This business is changing in leaps and bounds by the minute. There is no way UAIR mgt could have predicted $50 oil or LUV's incursion in PHL. You try and make mgt decisions based on the latest available data that will make the business viable and keep people employed.

If a ship is sinking does it not make sense to jump before the final dive? No, not unless you have another job.


.

.....

 

[lowecur]

EMB products are Marvelous.

I agree.

 

[Publishers]

Frankly

Frankly I wish Lowecur would quit annoying people with his banal attitude and semi-business related language. After all, that is my job.

I have spent 40 years in business learning how to aggevate managment and labor all at the same time dazzeling both with the by products of bull with my incredible memory of the non-significant. Most would rather I forgot long ago the facts that I have managed to retain so that they are dredged up at the absolute worst time in pursuit of some remote point. Lowecur has managed at an apparently younger age to come up with the same agruments.

One of the great things about this business is we have pilots. Now in other businesses without the benefit of pilots, middle management is forced to spend their days hanging around and making the same type comments we see on these boards towards Upper Management. Here we have pilots and management taking sides. Of course, if things get really bad, we can pick on flight attendants. Meanwhile, mechanics are sitting in a bar somewhere devoid of personal computers saying screw off to all of us.

USAirways is dead. It is as dead as one gets in the business world. The trouble is that instead of recognizing that and moving along, everyone will hang around and bitch about things and the way it used to be until someone has the graciousnous to put a bullet into the carcus.