Trust No One!

[acaTerry]

The 'big boys' never 'visually' check the fuel tanks, they have gauges they trust. When you go from flying an airplane like that to a small piston, your habit patterns are not in place.

That goes for a bunch of stuff, not just checking fuel level at preflight. I'm glad that this particular lesson was learned for free.

Having flown as a "big boy", I have to point out flawed logic in your post. The fuel guages in the large aircraft are required to be accurate. The guages in the small planes only have to be accurate when dead empty. Also, I have had fuel guages deferred in big planes, albeit rarely, and we do a visual checking of the magnasticks in these cases. Again, the pilot must be flying the plane he is in now rather than the one he was flying earlier.
Fly safe guys. Drink school and stay in milk.
Terry

 

[Amish RakeFight]

Having flown as a "big boy", I have to point out flawed logic in your post. The fuel guages in the large aircraft are required to be accurate. The guages in the small planes only have to be accurate when dead empty. Also, I have had fuel guages deferred in big planes, albeit rarely, and we do a visual checking of the magnasticks in these cases. Again, the pilot must be flying the plane he is in now rather than the one he was flying earlier.
Fly safe guys. Drink school and stay in milk.
Terry

The MEL of fuel gauges reminds me of the Air Canada (??) flight a while back where the FO miscalculated the metric conversion of fuel ordered and both engines subsequently flamed out. Luckily, the captain was an avid glider pilot and knew of an old military base which he successfully glided the aircraft to a safe dead stick landing.

 

[Say Again Over]

The MEL of fuel gauges reminds me of the Air Canada (??) flight a while back where the FO miscalculated the metric conversion of fuel ordered and both engines subsequently flamed out. Luckily, the captain was an avid glider pilot and knew of an old military base which he successfully glided the aircraft to a safe dead stick landing.

I thought the blame on that accident had to do with not complying with the MEL.

 

[acaTerry]

The MEL of fuel gauges reminds me of the Air Canada (??) flight a while back where the FO miscalculated the metric conversion of fuel ordered and both engines subsequently flamed out. Luckily, the captain was an avid glider pilot and knew of an old military base which he successfully glided the aircraft to a safe dead stick landing.

I think that in a transport category plane if the guages are out, you don't go. I lost a good freind of mine in a J31 over a fuel issue. NTSB report is clear, but he was one of the most conscientious pilots I ever flew with and I still find it hard to believe.

 

[FlySacto]

I thought the blame on that accident had to do with not complying with the MEL.

I think they did the calculations three times before they launched. On the second leg they lost it. They supposedly were hosed by a conversion factor new to the airplane going from metric to english units. 10,000 liters doesn't equal 10,000 gallons.

 

[FlySacto]

I think that in a transport category plane if the guages are out, you don't go. I lost a good freind of mine in a J31 over a fuel issue. NTSB report is clear, but he was one of the most conscientious pilots I ever flew with and I still find it hard to believe.

IIRC the MEL let us go with the bad gauge as long as the FF guage worked on that side and the totalizer worked.

 

[Say Again Over]

Gimley Glider, What I seem to remember is that the MEL calls for either the L/H or R/H gauges to be working, an engineer doing some testing before the flight had pulled C/B's and rendered all fuel indicators inop, crew flew it anyway, just a recollection, not sure.

 

[AC560]

I think that in a transport category plane if the guages are out, you don't go. I lost a good freind of mine in a J31 over a fuel issue. NTSB report is clear, but he was one of the most conscientious pilots I ever flew with and I still find it hard to believe.

There was no mechanical failure in the aircraft that I am aware of. They just thought they had boarded more fuel then they actually had,

 

[Say Again Over]

Acording to reports (had to look) both FQI's were inop, crew got dinged because there was a delay to declare an emergency and the aircraft was not airworthy due to inoperative a/p.

 

[acaTerry]

Acording to reports (had to look) both FQI's were inop, crew got dinged because there was a delay to declare an emergency and the aircraft was not airworthy due to inoperative a/p.

By the sounds of it one went, then both, then one came back and then both engines dead again. Tough to get a word in there. We'll never know b/c the CVR was inop.