Time on ILS approach

[WIDGETBOY]

In an airline enviroment it is pretty much usless to time an ils since usally slowing down and not holding a constant airspeed and the times are based on a constant groundspeed. If you loose you gs on an ils just go-around re-brief for the loc so you don't miss a step down fix or something and take a chance of becoming a smoking hole. Remember safety first.

 

[Tim47SIP]

Start the Time!

Guys, there are reasons that many people start the time at the LOM or FAF for the non precision point on the ILS. It is not to convert over to a Loc only approach or just incase the GS is lost. The TERP's manual and the AIM's both state when and where you may start the missed approach. This is very clear. At the missed approach point. Most of the time the reason for this is full scale deflection. Whenever full scale deflection occures, you have to try to get back to the loc course and then to the missed approach point. When DME is not present, the only means you have to get there is time. If you get full deflection, you dont continue to descend untill you are back on course because of obsticle avoidance. So, you may not be able to get back on the GS once back on the localizer and you dont know precisely how far out you are. I have seen many a student and recurrency pilot try to get down only to find that they have allready passed the MAP and I have them look up before they hit the ground or run into something. They are believers after this session. You just cant start a missed approach proceduer 4-5 miles out from the MAP and expect to have obsticle avoidance. No it is not required at all to start the clock on a precision approach, but any examiner that will bust an individual for starting the time on an ILS is a moron and needs to be reported.

 

[Wiggums]

Another problem with timing approaches is that quite often the timer will start going off just about the time the student will need to roundout. I've seen students try to flare and stop the timer at the same time, it doesn't work out so well.

Changing from an ILS to LOC approach after the FAF is beyond my personal limits in actual. I train my students like I fly.

 

[willi7]

gs

I have found that using the good old five t's works real well. by ommiting a t (time) you train students as well as yourself to skip steps. this can lead to an error on an appoach. It sure doesn't hurt to start your time even if you won't be needing it.....

 

[runtofthelitter]

Re: gs

I have found that using the good old five t's works real well. by ommiting a t (time) you train students as well as yourself to skip steps. this can lead to an error on an appoach. It sure doesn't hurt to start your time even if you won't be needing it.....

Maybe it’s just late, maybe it was that second Corona I had with supper but would you mind explaining just a bit further what you mean?

Maybe I’m just not receiving what you are saying, has happened before.

 

[willi7]

when I teach an instrument student, I try and keep it monkey simple. At every fix they must do the 5 t's(turn, time,twist,throttle,talk.) They may not need to do one, but they have to say it out loud. If you do this you will not miss a 10 degree turn at a final approach fix or forget a time on a ndb or forget that you can descend. All those fun things that can get you. hope this explains things better.

 

[runtofthelitter]

Okay

I only teach the five T’s in relation to the hold, never crossed my mind to teach them at every fix passage.

 

[willi7]

Works real well although it gets old listening to it. Just insert twist as twisting any new radials or bearings and throttle with power settings for your descent.