The Flight Surgeon Is Not Your Friend

[Birdstrike]

Going through my med recs yesterday (I kept mine after retirement, turned in copies) and started reviewing my experiences with Army Flight Surgeons. I had almost thirty annual physicals stuffed in there.

I don't know what the consensus opinions of these strange beings might be, but based on my overall experiences, my advice to guys just starting out would be...tell them nothing, absolutely nothing...or it will come back and attempt to bite you big time.

The best ones were in the Guard from places like Lexington, OK and the worst were the foreign contracters at Ft. McPherson who had difficulty with English. Just tell them you are disgustingly healthy and make them prove otherwise. One innocent comment can launch an inquisition that can takes months to clear up. Ask your questions to somebody who doesn't know you and who won't have the power to suspend your flying with one stroke of the pen.

 

[weekendwarrior]

Second that one! One piece of advise that was given to me by some mentors in the Army was, if you ever get knocked out for any reason DON"T SAY ANYTHING about it! If you get knocked out and your spouse calls the ambulance, make sure she realizes NOT to say you were ever unconcious. Talk about being grounded. That's an automatic 12 months, cat scans, etc, etc. They don't screw around with stuff like that.

We had a guy in flight school that was feeling dizzy while riding in the back of a TH-67. They landed and he started shaking and passing out. Turned out to be nothing, maybe very dehydrated. Nevertheless, he was grounded for 2 months, and had to get a spinal tap! Ouch!

 

[GogglesPisano]

Second that one! One piece of advise that was given to me by some mentors in the Army was, if you ever get knocked out for any reason DON"T SAY ANYTHING about it! If you get knocked out and your spouse calls the ambulance, make sure she realizes NOT to say you were ever unconcious. Talk about being grounded. That's an automatic 12 months, cat scans, etc, etc. They don't screw around with stuff like that.

We had a guy in flight school that was feeling dizzy while riding in the back of a TH-67. They landed and he started shaking and passing out. Turned out to be nothing, maybe very dehydrated. Nevertheless, he was grounded for 2 months, and had to get a spinal tap! Ouch!

There are only two ways a pilot walks out of a doctor's office: fine or grounded.

 

[ThomasR]

No Friends in Hire Places

You all have hit on a subject that goes silent by those who are jacked by a flight surgeon thinking he is a general in a command performance. Issues goes silent because a flight surgeon can kill your military career, no questions ask. They have absolutaly no military bearing and gloat on their position and ability to manipulate by intimidation.

A surgeon does not command troops and those in higher places should take more interest instead of living by a hackneyed slogan "don't rock the boat."

Getting on the wrong side of a surgeon you will find you have no friends at all willing to risk their own safe place.

Thanks for bringing it up. You might get screwed by the system but you have a friend here.

 

[bigr]

Flight surgeons are no joke. i got the "Nami-Whami" back in '86 at pensacola. been flying cessnas ever since. i wish i had taken the NFO job they offered.

every time i see the movie apollo 13 i laugh at the scene where jim lovell says to deke slayton when they decide to ground ken mattingley right before the launch:

"DEKE, THIS IS FLIGHT SURGEON HORSE $HIT"

another funny scene is when the flight controller goes thru the pre-launch check with all the guys (when they answer "were go flight"). when the flight surgeon answers he is exhaling a huge drag from a cigarette (only a pilot would get the irony). i was the only one in the theatre that laughed out loud.

 

[ThomasR]

bigr

I don't know what a nami whami is but I bet that surgeon didn't either; and he will ground you without ever knowing what it is; they don't research anything.

They read a few lengthy books, cut up some dead animals and learn the difference between a penis and a vagina. They go into the military with a couple bars on their shoulder thinking they are Gen. Patton out to win some make believe war. They grab this, pull that, squeeze here and poke there; say your ok. If you look at them with one eyebrow raised they begin to think about what options they have to put you in line.

They are one step above these corporate weazels that are flushing the U.S. economy down the toilet. They are one small step above weazelness only because in their narrow minds they really believe they are being constructive.

Am I angry, you bet I am. And I would very much like to be able to fire any flight surgeon who does not like what I am saying. Get out of the military and practice your weazely voodoo craft on real sick people.

 

[AlbieF15]

I have a buddy who was roof stomping and fell off into an Alaska snow drift. Ankle got big as a catelope. Took some leave, went home, and got it scoped (othoscopic surgery) on his on time and dime to avoid problems with flight medicine.

I LOVE flight surgeons. They are a hoot to fly with, do a great job taking care of my wife and kids, and if I have a cold, a wart on a finger, or need some medicine for dry sky or other minor irritants...THEY ROCK. I'd get to know them, make friends, enjoy their company. He11...I even worked went to the school of aerospace medicine and became an aerospace physiologist, and I had a great boss (who was a flight surgeon) for over 2 years.

Now...if I had dizzy spells, stomach pains, join issues, depression, or any other potentially serious isses, I would of course disclose them to a flight doc. Right after I went somewhere else, on my own dime, got a referral from a trusted doctor buddy, and had the issue investigated....and was convinced I could stand not flying in the AF again. Until then...I'd keep it to myself. Maybe wrong...but that's what I would do.

However...in defense of some of our doctor brothers... My old F15 commander has 2 metal hips...stayed flying. Another F15 bro is flying with 1 kidney. Yet another has 1 metal hip and another got put together AFTER falling out of a pickup truck at 50mph and got back on status dispite multiple broken bones. A former OV-10 squadron mate who almost lost a leg in an Army helicopter crash (the proverbial "watch this Air Force.." story...) got back on status and flew F16s for years, largely due to the help of one very proactive flight surgeon. Most of the flighter flight docs I've had have been great guys with a warrior spirit who tried to keep people flying. That aside, I've also caught glimpses here and there of other types, like those mentioned on the thread.

Best advice--discretion. Don't babble, and don't run to the flight doc for every little issue. Like pilots, they come in good and bad forms. It is best to know your audience, and if you don't know them...shut up.

24 years of good FAA physicals and 18 of AF physicals...here's hoping for a lot more.

 

[Freight Dog]

My wife is an Army Flight Surgeon and a newly FAA-designated AME for FEDERAL/MILITARY region. When she was going through training at Ft Rucker, she told me the instructors REALLY stressed to all the trainees that their job is NOT to ground the pilots, but to keep them flying. My wife took it to heart, and she is currently deployed to Iraq. I've had a couple of pilots from her unit tell me that she is BY FAR the best flight surgeon they've encountered in the Army and that they're lucky to have her. Her Rear Detachment commander is my drinking buddy, and he told me the same thing on more than one occasion.

My wife told me... if there's any possible way to keep a pilot flying, a good flight surgeon will bend over backwards to find it, and I've watched her work to get a guy back up in the air.

Not all of them are assholes... Just the luck of the draw..

 

[46Driver]

A number of flight surgeons in Pensacola are pilots how did their initial tour, got bored, and went to medical school - my flight school roommate being one of them. "Doc" has got 1800 hours in Whiskey model Cobras so don't assume all Docs can't fly or don't have a pilot's perspective.

 

[BWatz]

I leave for Navy OCS very soon and I'm sweating the "Nami-Whami". I guess it's one of those things that is out of your control.