The actual ASA PBS LOA is out.

[www.]

Seven captains and seven FOs on vacation do not really constitute growth in the industry that results in people moving on and up. The general consensus seems to be that no airline will be doing any significant hiring for a while, which in turn means stagnation in the seniority lists. Pilots should consider the likelihood that they will remain where they are (seat and seniority) for a while.
Unless I am much mistaken, of course.

I thought this was about PBS, not growth?

So once again. Your telling the people on the bump that don't consider PBS even though you may begin to get a hard line if PBS passes?

 

[aircombat]

This is awesome. Suddenly everyone is worried about reserve. Is that because 8 year captains are discovering reserve again for the first time. Missed you guys on the last round of negotiations.

Hey I have an idea. We ditch the union... bam 2% raise. We get skywests working agreement... see PBS... I think then we might have a shot at growth.

Oh yeah... Who is the arrogant idiot that thinks we will have industry leading PBS on our first attempt? We have been using line bidding forever and still F&&&ed up the scheduling section of our last contract.

I will vote yes... just to watch the senior guys eat poop for the first 6 months trying to figure out the system. Excited to hear the crew room once this turd passes.

Love that we can't do a mock bid. Wonder why that is.

Sorry Crash Pad still not really a shot at growth if we adopted Skywest’s work agreement. We would still be more expensive. It’s one of the disadvantages of being a senior airline. Our other departments are also more expensive. Merging the seniority lists is the only hope for growth.

You are right that the people that hover over their computer will have a better chance at a good schedule. The people that go over this pairing by pairing will be better off. Seems like a lot of work to me. How many pairings are on the 200 per month?

 

[Poppa Hodax]

Your (sic) telling the people on the bump that don't consider PBS even though you may begin to get a hard line if PBS passes?

The seven folks on the bump might get a line, depending on line construction. There are a lot of things that will impact how much time is left over towards the bottom of the Scheduling grab bag for guys to build lines. In discussion with some Union guys, I was given to understand the old system of X number of days on/Y number of days off doesn't really apply under PBS. The system will build a line to meet the number of hours you want to fly. Pilots might have to fly a three day followed by a two day to meet what they told the computer they want to fly. All of that, in addition to whether folks are on vacation, training issues, and the like, not to mention that every month Delta sends over what they want ASA to fly will determine whether the cusp guys get a line or not. I don't believe that the blanket statement of seven pilots are on vacation guarantees that seven more guys get a line under PBS.
But for the sake of discussion, let's assume that the seven guys on the cusp get a line. The rest of the reserves still don't get a lot.
My point wasn't about growth or whether one might or might not get a line, but rather that the Union and the Company had a chance to improve the lot of all the Reserves, and that improvement might have swung some reactionary no votes to yes votes, as well as made life in general, and during the upcoming negotiations, more bearable.

 

[OCP]

But for the sake of discussion, let's assume that the seven guys on the cusp get a line. The rest of the reserves still don't get a lot.

Just to nit pick a little, that is not true. Because those 7 people got a line then everyone moves up and maybe someone who couldn't get weekends off now can. Or now someone can get long call. When you are on reserve, every little bit makes a big difference in quality of life.

 

[sweptback]

Just to nit pick a little, that is not true. Because those 7 people got a line then everyone moves up and maybe someone who couldn't get weekends off now can. Or now someone can get long call. When you are on reserve, every little bit makes a big difference in quality of life.

Not to mention with those 7 pilots' pairings now out of open time, hopefully reserves will do what they were meant to do, cover IROPs and sick calls. Not staff the airline, like they are doing now.

 

[www.]

The rest of the reserves still don't get a lot.
My point wasn't about growth or whether one might or might not get a line, but rather that the Union and the Company had a chance to improve the lot of all the Reserves, and that improvement might have swung some reactionary no votes to yes votes, as well as made life in general, and during the upcoming negotiations, more bearable.

Well you can say they got a great deal, specifically what they asked for in a new RES system, under section 6 last time and some pilots got very little when it came to the Sec. 13.

Section 6 starts in a few months. Clean up the enite contract then.

 

[www.]

Sorry Crash Pad still not really a shot at growth if we adopted Skywest’s work agreement. We would still be more expensive. It’s one of the disadvantages of being a senior airline. Our other departments are also more expensive. Merging the seniority lists is the only hope for growth.

You are right that the people that hover over their computer will have a better chance at a good schedule. The people that go over this pairing by pairing will be better off. Seems like a lot of work to me. How many pairings are on the 200 per month?

Uh, they don't have an agreement. They do not have a union. And they are using AOS for PBS.

 

[Poppa Hodax]

I don't believe that the blanket statement of seven pilots are on vacation guarantees that seven more guys get a line under PBS.

Just to nit pick a little, that is not true.

My apologies. I thought I had made it clear that I didn't think it was true, as well. Trying to predict how far down the lines will go is more or less an exercise in futility.

When you are on reserve, every little bit makes a big difference in quality of life.

I could not agree more.

Section 6 starts in a few months. Clean up the enite (sic) contract then.

Great. Let's roll the vote on PBS into that morass. Take off and nuke the entire site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.

 

[aircombat]

Uh, they don't have an agreement. They do not have a union. And they are using AOS for PBS.

other good reasons why we can't become cheaper. They will just lower the bar one notch lower than us if need be.

 

[aircombat]

Am I the only one that think it’s ironic how many of the people supporting this LOA have an avatar or quote concerning Obama or his healthcare bill. The similarities between this LOA and the “public option” are uncanny.

First you have to have the vague catch phrase such as “Change or Growth”. No strong details will be offered so that you can jump to your own conclusions and it will be your fault when it doesn’t happen.
Then they both were constructed under secretive closed doors and pushed through in an expeditious manner. They both are long and filled with additives in order to buy votes and distract from the real issue. Finally, they both favor the less working minority at the expense of the harder working majority.