T-41 questions

[hawg2hawk]

Here's kind of a trivia question for the GA experts. Don't know if it would be better addressed in the mechanics forum, but if so, mods please feel free to move it.
One of the AF bases I visit frequently in the helo has 2 or 3 old T-41 (A's, I think) sitting out oxidizing on the side of the ramp with the engines taken out.
They were all previously used by the aero club for civilian (part 61) flight training, and so were N-numbered, had an FAA airworthiness certificate, etc. I asked why they were out there and was told that they were "timed out".
So now I'm confused, because as far as I know, a T-41 is just an R172 with a different paint job -- assuming they don't have some irreparable damage somewhere, what's up? I can't find any AD's specific to the T-41 that might explain them being "timed out".
I'll be interested to find out what the answer is.

 

[hawg2hawk]

Nobody? Wow. Think it would have better luck in the mech forum?

 

[PC12Cowboy]

t41...a b c d...Cessna's are r 172 e...and have an AD data base available....ask at the aero club....unfortunately....they cannot be sold ...unless you can convince DRMO to sell it with out going back to DMAFB
pm me if you want more info

 

[labbats]

I thought the T-41 had the 210hp engines for mountain flying. I could be wrong though.

 

[PC12Cowboy]

IO-360 B C D
O 300 A
B and D had Constant speeds and the Charlie..was fixed climb pitch
for academy flying
Funny thing is the CP and I were talking about them today coming back from SNA

 

[JRSLim]

Timed out?

We've got 9 T-41s ( 7 Charlies and 2 Bravos ) at the Peterson Aero club ( http://usafftc.tripod.com/aircraft.htm) -- vintage 1968, they fly daily and are far from being 'timed out'. so I would imagine the ones you have seen are not airworthy for some reason or if the Aero Club doesn't want/need them anymore- they've been mothballed because as mentioned- they can't be sold off. Which is a shame, I'd buy one in a hearbeat.
What was said before was correct - R172E, 210HP, Continental IO-360s Fixed pitch Cs and Constant speed Bs - and the Bravos also have four seats.

We have two airframes and several wings that are used for spares. If you want, let me know what base did you see them at, I may be able to get some info, just for the sake of curiosity.

 

[Doubleo6point9]

We've currently got 3 T-41's at the Academy ourselves. Only one is up flying right now though because the prop got dinged on our other C model and the B model is awaiting it's 100 hr. Overall they're pretty good airplanes aside from the vintage 60's avionics that's still in our C models.

 

[hawg2hawk]

Thanks for the insights.
You probably see where I'm headed with this. I hate to see a perfectly good airplane in the penalty box. The DRMO thing is an issue, but there are at least a few privately owned T-41's out there. I think. Right? In any event, they are talking about hauling these out to the range to be strafe targets, so what the hell. Always ask.
I'll call the aero club tomorrow (since they're open that day) and get the low down and I'll let you know what I find out.

 

[hawg2hawk]

We've currently got 3 T-41's at the Academy ourselves. Only one is up flying right now though because the prop got dinged on our other C model and the B model is awaiting it's 100 hr. Overall they're pretty good airplanes aside from the vintage 60's avionics that's still in our C models.

You a CFI at the Academy aero club? I got my PPL there, seems like a LONG time ago.

 

[avbug]

Quite a few T-41's are floating around in the civillian world. Civil Air Patrol sold off quite a few when moving to 182's some years ago. They're good airplanes, and they don't have time restrictions to airframe life.

Most likely the flying club had timed out engines and couldn't afford to replace them at the time.

Last time I was at Kirtland I saw several on the west ramp.

 

[hawg2hawk]

Avbug, thanks for the info.

I didn't notice the T-41s at KIKR. Where are they parked?

 

[avbug]

I don't know if they're still there. They were over on the west side by the flying club building, south of the customs hangar. Sort of over by the intersections of bravo and delta taxiways, but on the air force ramp. I believe the spot is marked M1 on the jepp chart.

I haven't been back over there for a little bit now...my info may not be accurate presently.

I did lots of running around in the T-41(b)s, and I thought they were great little airplanes.

 

[Doubleo6point9]

You a CFI at the Academy aero club? I got my PPL there, seems like a LONG time ago.

Yep sure am. How long ago was that? Did you go through the IFT portion or through the 141 deal?

 

[hawg2hawk]

Yep sure am. How long ago was that? Did you go through the IFT portion or through the 141 deal?

Both, if I understand your question. I'm not sure how IFT is done there now, but I got my PPL through the aero club when I was a freshman, then went through the T-41 program for IFT when it was still a part of the 94th ATS. Back then we had active duty AF IP's with standup and the whole 9 yards. Things have changed a bit, I suspect.
PPL in '88 or so, T-41 in late 1990 or early 1991.

 

[Doubleo6point9]

Both, if I understand your question. I'm not sure how IFT is done there now, but I got my PPL through the aero club when I was a freshman, then went through the T-41 program for IFT when it was still a part of the 94th ATS. Back then we had active duty AF IP's with standup and the whole 9 yards. Things have changed a bit, I suspect.

Ah ok. Yeah I have a few students who are currently doing the same. Things have changed since then. the 557th is pretty much in charge of things now and the Embry-Riddle guys get about 95% of the IFT students and we get the other 5% or so. And all of the IP's are now civilian or retired military as well. They've also finally decided to put some freakin lights on the airfield as well. But that won't happen till about 06 I believe.

 

[Huggyu2]

Beale AFB has one or two T-41 aircraft, too.