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SWAPA TA failure just cost me $1,200 per month

shearedshaft

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 16, 2004
Posts
190
Total Time
Lots
I am a senior FO at SWA and my pay rate was scheduled to go from $108 to $121 after the TA (from about $120/hour to $135/hr).

I fly 120 trips per month, so the TA failure cost me $1,200 per month. Every month.

Would I write a check for $1,200 per month to keep ELITT the same? Nope. How about to let lance captains continue to take senior FO lines and give them to junior FOs? Nope.

This is the interesting part: I've asked every FO I've come in contact with in the last week what they thought their gross pay raise was going to be if the TA passed. Not one had an answer.

Luckily, SWA just announced 9% lower revenues for last month, so I'm sure our pay raises will be even better (not) when we go back to the table.

You guys don't know a good thing when it's looking you in the eye.
 

radarlove

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 21, 2005
Posts
677
Total Time
years
Now that's funny right there. Your guys gave up raises equal to a commuter guy's whole salary. And for what?
 

murano

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Joined
Feb 21, 2005
Posts
143
Total Time
10000+
Wow, you sound like a UAL pilot circa 2000: "Give me my raises... I don't care about the outsourcing Section 1 allows." Your biggest pay raise will come when SWA grows its own fleet (instead of Volaris & WestJet) and you upgrade to Captain. Then you'll get your lousy $1200 a month and then some.
 

turbodriver

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 19, 2005
Posts
396
Total Time
enough
I am a senior FO at SWA and my pay rate was scheduled to go from $108 to $121 after the TA (from about $120/hour to $135/hr).

I fly 120 trips per month, so the TA failure cost me $1,200 per month. Every month.

Would I write a check for $1,200 per month to keep ELITT the same? Nope. How about to let lance captains continue to take senior FO lines and give them to junior FOs? Nope.

This is the interesting part: I've asked every FO I've come in contact with in the last week what they thought their gross pay raise was going to be if the TA passed. Not one had an answer.

Luckily, SWA just announced 9% lower revenues for last month, so I'm sure our pay raises will be even better (not) when we go back to the table.

You guys don't know a good thing when it's looking you in the eye.

The passage of the Alaska TA will keep me on the street for a couple more years........

Compare that with your precious $1200.
 

PeanuckleCRJ

Hurrrrrrrr
Joined
Jul 21, 2004
Posts
1,684
Total Time
mucho
Scope? You don't need that. Management will take care of you. They think of you first!

Keep that head in the sand- at least 51% of your homies had sense enough to keep SWA Connection from starting.

Ask the legacy guys around here how little that 1200 dollars a month would look compared to the cuts they've taken.
 

Bobo135R

Well-known member
Joined
May 3, 2004
Posts
53
Total Time
8,000+
Dude....get real... it's not all about you.... -Bobo (a SWA junior FO)
 
Joined
Apr 26, 2005
Posts
6
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10000
As a mid-level seniority captain I gladly turned down over $1200 a month at 100 trips for pay to protect us from outsourcing and losing our productivity.

You're welcome clueless.

PS. I'd be willing to bet you're retired military and this is your first airline rodeo
 

RedDogC130

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 6, 2005
Posts
1,329
Total Time
enough
I would give up $1200 a month to keep ELITT the way it is. That is how I keep my flexibility. Hey maybe we will get 3% like every other group got...happy now. You like the new open time process without a test to see if it works? So as a senior FO are you not going to be a Lance when the time comes? Get your head out of the clouds. This is supposed to be what is good for the "group" not "you" There are things that we each give up to make it better....quit your crying you will get the COLA just have to wait a bit. They will not come back with less because they will surely get another NO vote with a bigger margin
 

1031Guy

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Joined
Oct 11, 2005
Posts
103
Total Time
5000+
Boo-hoo...$1,200 a month. You want something to b!tch about? Try Age 65. How much did that cost you???
 
Last edited:

GuppyWN

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 5, 2005
Posts
3,204
Total Time
14000
I am a senior FO at SWA and my pay rate was scheduled to go from $108 to $121 after the TA (from about $120/hour to $135/hr).

I fly 120 trips per month, so the TA failure cost me $1,200 per month. Every month.

Would I write a check for $1,200 per month to keep ELITT the same? Nope. How about to let lance captains continue to take senior FO lines and give them to junior FOs? Nope.

This is the interesting part: I've asked every FO I've come in contact with in the last week what they thought their gross pay raise was going to be if the TA passed. Not one had an answer.

Luckily, SWA just announced 9% lower revenues for last month, so I'm sure our pay raises will be even better (not) when we go back to the table.

You guys don't know a good thing when it's looking you in the eye.



There is more to the contract that "your" raise. How about
  • almost limitless near international codeshare
  • no flying to hawaii or carribean for you
  • no "one leg on SWA" codeshare
  • unlimited distribution of other airlines tickets
  • whacked lance program
  • more restricted DTC
  • much more restricted ELITT
  • worse Reserve system
  • no cancellation pay
  • loss of mach adjustment
  • unknown open time system
  • worse raises than any other SWA workgroup
  • worse retirement than the Flight Attendants
It's not all about you bro. How about trying to pull the rope in the same direction.

Gup
 
Last edited:

Eagle757shark

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 31, 2006
Posts
575
Total Time
6000
Scope? You don't need that. Management will take care of you. They think of you first!

Keep that head in the sand- at least 51% of your homies had sense enough to keep SWA Connection from starting.

Ask the legacy guys around here how little that 1200 dollars a month would look compared to the cuts they've taken.
Protect your SCOPE guys. It is the only way to protect your future income and jobs.
 

michael707767

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 20, 2002
Posts
1,640
Total Time
13,500
Protect your SCOPE guys. It is the only way to protect your future income and jobs.

Exactly. 1200 a month will be gone when your jobs start to be outsourced. Look at the mistakes made by Delta, NWA, United, etc. How many more pilots would be at the mainline with tighter scope? How many more FOs would be captains?

I would not sell out my pilot group for 1200 a month. Sadly, our MEC would.
 

shearedshaft

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 16, 2004
Posts
190
Total Time
Lots
How does voting no help my scope? If you have seen the contact, you'd realize that the failed TA restricted all domestic code share. It didn't restrict near-international by any reasonable amount, but that market is tiny.

So voting no, was in effect, a vote "yes" to allow SWA to domestic code share (there is no restriction other than a side letter with an easy out for the company). Voting yes was voting to restrict it, voting no was a vote to allow it, at least in the near term.

So no, me writing a check each and every month for $1,200 so we can have weaker code share restrictions is not in my best interest.

And to those guys that think we're now going to get 15% raises instead of my 10%, dream on. Did you read the headlines? SWA revenue down almost 10% last month?

Why would I vote no for a 10% raise in the hopes I'd get a 15%? That is greedy.
 

Beechball

Member
Joined
Dec 13, 2001
Posts
23
Total Time
12000+
If someone voted no just on the sheer dislike of the raise is absolutely selfish and assenine. Look back at what Gup wrote and you'll see the big picture. His list is pretty much the same as mine. Besides, decreased flying means you'll have to work your a_s off to make 120 TFP which is NOT a raise....it's falling into the company's hands of what they want you to do...make more by working substantially more.

I'm more about protecting work rules than dollars. The dollars will come later if you protect your work rules. Unfortunately, 60% of the captains didn't look at this TA in terms of "how does this affect the F/O's" they looked at it as "This TA doesn't affect me much, so I'll vote YES." Some unity we have.
 

StopNTSing

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 16, 2003
Posts
715
Total Time
9500+
How does voting no help my scope? If you have seen the contact, you'd realize that the failed TA restricted all domestic code share. It didn't restrict near-international by any reasonable amount, but that market is tiny.

So voting no, was in effect, a vote "yes" to allow SWA to domestic code share (there is no restriction other than a side letter with an easy out for the company). Voting yes was voting to restrict it, voting no was a vote to allow it, at least in the near term.

So no, me writing a check each and every month for $1,200 so we can have weaker code share restrictions is not in my best interest.

And to those guys that think we're now going to get 15% raises instead of my 10%, dream on. Did you read the headlines? SWA revenue down almost 10% last month?

Why would I vote no for a 10% raise in the hopes I'd get a 15%? That is greedy.

Friend, the ONLY reason we got such iron-clad language on domestic code-share is because the company has NO PLANS to code share with another airline in the domestic markets! If RJs had a place in the low-cost airline business model of SWA, trust me, we would have had them a long time ago. They make even less sense in the depressed-yield environment we are in now.
 

Mookie

luckiest man alive
Joined
Sep 25, 2002
Posts
879
Total Time
6900
I am a senior FO at SWA and my pay rate was scheduled to go from $108 to $121 after the TA (from about $120/hour to $135/hr).

I fly 120 trips per month, so the TA failure cost me $1,200 per month. Every month.

Would I write a check for $1,200 per month to keep ELITT the same? Nope. How about to let lance captains continue to take senior FO lines and give them to junior FOs? Nope.

This is the interesting part: I've asked every FO I've come in contact with in the last week what they thought their gross pay raise was going to be if the TA passed. Not one had an answer.

Luckily, SWA just announced 9% lower revenues for last month, so I'm sure our pay raises will be even better (not) when we go back to the table.

You guys don't know a good thing when it's looking you in the eye.


Anyone else think General Lee just created a new handle on here to stir things up???:)

if not, this guy is so clueless its scary that he got his atp.
Mookie
 
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