SWA Won't Share Its Pain With Workers

[Benhuntn]

162 cities in 147 countries in 7 yrs. If you want international flying join the AF. As for me I am trying to get 63 SWA cities in 5 yrs. I got food poisoning in Ethiopia, China, Korea, Bali, Argentina, and Chile. I enjoy MAF overnights and I pass on AMA during the butchering process time. LBB sounds fun if the Chicks are naked. I would rather make good money at a good company than eat first class meals in the back of a jet making crap.....

 

[momalley81]

Well that is all fine and dandy. I find it funny that most of you deny that you fly tons of legs per trip that would make any mere mortal totally exhausted, and that you might actually have to layover in a hole like AMA, LBB, and MAF. Well, not everything is bad over there, at least you have Harlingen.


Bye Bye--General Lee

Thats where your totally wrong GL. You dont know what you are talking about.

The VAST majority of flying at SWA does not make a pilot fly tons of legs per day. It just is not the norm anymore. Since you like to ask me to prove things (which I did beyond a shadow of a doubt) I am now asking you to prove your argument. Prove it, that every pilot at SWA flies 7-8 legs a day. Prove it.

Furthermore, if you knew anything about the SWA operation you would realize that SWA has very little exposure to AMA, LBB, and MAF. I only think 2 aircraft overnight in LBB. Only one overnights in HRL. As far as AMA and MAF goes I dont know.

And lastly I will state this: if Delta is so incredibly great and wonderful then why did a 25 Year Delta B-767 Captain and a 10 year Delta B-767 FO both come over to SWA to start all over again? Why?

 

[Sluggo_63]

And lastly I will state this: if Delta is so incredibly great and wonderful then why did a 25 Year Delta B-767 Captain and a 10 year Delta B-767 FO both come over to SWA to start all over again? Why?

I don't have a dog in this fight, and I really could not care less, but I would be careful with this question, because I'm sure that pre-9/11 there were many more SWAers who left for the 'greener pastures' of legacy flying than the other way around after 9/11. The same could be said for FedEx and UPS pre-9/11. These three especially were the ugly high school girl who no one would talk to, that shows up at the ten year reunion smoking hot.

 

[General Lee]

Thats where your totally wrong GL. You dont know what you are talking about.

The VAST majority of flying at SWA does not make a pilot fly tons of legs per day. It just is not the norm anymore. Since you like to ask me to prove things (which I did beyond a shadow of a doubt) I am now asking you to prove your argument. Prove it, that every pilot at SWA flies 7-8 legs a day. Prove it.

Furthermore, if you knew anything about the SWA operation you would realize that SWA has very little exposure to AMA, LBB, and MAF. I only think 2 aircraft overnight in LBB. Only one overnights in HRL. As far as AMA and MAF goes I dont know.

And lastly I will state this: if Delta is so incredibly great and wonderful then why did a 25 Year Delta B-767 Captain and a 10 year Delta B-767 FO both come over to SWA to start all over again? Why?

Great debate, and really easy answers for me. Your airline has never been a traditional long haul airline. If you look at your timetable, most flights continue on to other cities, and to make those 25 minute turns, the pilots usually continue on too, unless it is a base. One guy I talked to in BWI said he was going BWI--SLC--OAK---ONT. That sure is one heck of a day, for anyone, especially if you are over 50. Southwest just announced in fact that you were cutting back on some of the transcon flying (BWI--OAK, PHL--LAX, CLE--PHX, are all getting the axe soon). Will those planes be parked? No. They will thrown into flights that are more profitable, which entail more stops. Your super productive trips mean one thing---lots of flying, and usually that means legs. You don't do 4 leg 4 day trips, unless you can give me an actual example of one.

Overnights in LBB. You may only have 2 planes overnighting there, but that doesn't mean two crews. Usually that would mean 4 crews. From DAL you have 8 flights on a weekday to LBB (flights 207, 1112, 805, 20, 1011, 36, 1575, and 52), from ABQ you have one (1189), from LAS you have one (1609), from Austin you have two (649 and 783), and from ELP you have one. (443, an overnight) That is thirteen crews that have to go in there per day, into LBB alone. More obviously to MAF and AMA. That stinks, and someone has to do it. I am happy I don't.

And I never said Delta is the greatest place on the planet. It is getting better than it was in the past few years. Why would a 25 year Delta guy go to Southwest? He had to. He obviously took his lump sum pension and then decided he still wanted to fly for an airline. He will soon learn that he really had it easier at DL, right after his first exhausting trip with SWA. He will remember his great days flying for Delta, prior to the BK, when things were easier. The other guy probably made a decision when things were bad here. A few guys left DL for Emirates too, and I am sure they are hating the Middle East right now. Did they and your guy make the right moves? They were emotional moves, which sometimes do not work out. If things get better here, which I think will happen, they will learn about it and always wonder.

Any more questions?


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[momalley81]

Great debate, and really easy answers for me. Your airline has never been a traditional long haul airline. If you look at your timetable, most flights continue on to other cities, and to make those 25 minute turns, the pilots usually continue on too, unless it is a base. One guy I talked to in BWI said he was going BWI--SLC--OAK---ONT. That sure is one heck of a day, for anyone, especially if you are over 50. Southwest just announced in fact that you were cutting back on some of the transcon flying (BWI--OAK, PHL--LAX, CLE--PHX, are all getting the axe soon). Will those planes be parked? No. They will thrown into flights that are more profitable, which entail more stops. Your super productive trips mean one thing---lots of flying, and usually that means legs. You don't do 4 leg 4 day trips, unless you can give me an actual example of one.

Overnights in LBB. You may only have 2 planes overnighting there, but that doesn't mean two crews. Usually that would mean 4 crews. From DAL you have 8 flights on a weekday to LBB (flights 207, 1112, 805, 20, 1011, 36, 1575, and 52), from ABQ you have one (1189), from LAS you have one (1609), from Austin you have two (649 and 783), and from ELP you have one. (443, an overnight) That is thirteen crews that have to go in there per day, into LBB alone. More obviously to MAF and AMA. That stinks, and someone has to do it. I am happy I don't.

And I never said Delta is the greatest place on the planet. It is getting better than it was in the past few years. Why would a 25 year Delta guy go to Southwest? He had to. He obviously took his lump sum pension and then decided he still wanted to fly for an airline. He will soon learn that he really had it easier at DL, right after his first exhausting trip with SWA. He will remember his great days flying for Delta, prior to the BK, when things were easier. The other guy probably made a decision when things were bad here. A few guys left DL for Emirates too, and I am sure they are hating the Middle East right now. Did they and your guy make the right moves? They were emotional moves, which sometimes do not work out. If things get better here, which I think will happen, they will learn about it and always wonder.

Any more questions?


Bye Bye--General Lee

I asked you to prove that SWA pilots fly "tons of legs" per trip (your words not mine) You obviously have the data that all SWA pilots fly tons of legs and come home "totally exhausted" (your words again) You have yet to prove anything.

When you made the ignorant statement that DAL and LUV were worth the same, I told you to truth with facts and data. You told me to prove it and I did so.

I am asking you to PROVE the claims you are making. PROVE it. Dont just come on here and talk about something you know nothing about. PROVE that SWA pilots fly tons of legs everyday that they fly.

Can you do that?

 

[Charlie Brown]

Any more questions?


Bye Bye--General Lee

I have one: Do you have a life outside of FI?

I mean you must be really bored to look up all those flights, have 9000+ posts mainly knocking JB and SW. If I didn't know better, I would think you were almost jealous.

 

[SWA/FO]

9,023 posts / 58 months on FI = 156 post per month.
Average month 30 days: 156/30 = 5.2 posts per day.

that must mean: he doesn't fly, has long ground times,long layovers or no life

ALL THE ABOVE

 

[FlyinGuy]

Gen...Many of us could care less where we spend the night. If I get good food, a place to workout, and a good mattress and pillows it does not matter if I am in Midland or Frankfrut. Flying is a job. It pays my bills and allows me to have a great QOL.

How much extra flying have you had to do over the past 5 years to make up for all the cash that you gave to the company?

 

[General Lee]

162 cities in 147 countries in 7 yrs. If you want international flying join the AF. As for me I am trying to get 63 SWA cities in 5 yrs. I got food poisoning in Ethiopia, China, Korea, Bali, Argentina, and Chile. I enjoy MAF overnights and I pass on AMA during the butchering process time. LBB sounds fun if the Chicks are naked. I would rather make good money at a good company than eat first class meals in the back of a jet making crap.....

Thanks Sarge for your input. That's great that you got to wear your green jumpsuit in front of Phillipeano hookers. Did you get the clap too? Wow. And I LUV the part about LBB sounding fun if "the chicks are naked." Wow, Southwest was lucky to get you! And guess what sarge, we don't make CRAP, we actually make more than most of the other legacies. We actually helped you get your higher wage, even if some on here don't believe it.

I would rather have someone else pay for my trips overseas, or actual have the option (the key word) to maybe go back to domestic and do that again. Sounds better than being paid well to get totally bored and exhausted. But, some military meatheads like yourself(who look for the naked chicks in LBB) would rather have the latter. Good for you SARGE.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Gen...Many of us could care less where we spend the night. If I get good food, a place to workout, and a good mattress and pillows it does not matter if I am in Midland or Frankfrut. Flying is a job. It pays my bills and allows me to have a great QOL.

How much extra flying have you had to do over the past 5 years to make up for all the cash that you gave to the company?

Sounds like you have a boring life. If you need to be out on the road for 3 or 4 nights, wouldn't you want to go somewhere that interests you? Oh, you would rather sit on your bead and watch Sex and City?

As to how much money I have lost in the last few years, probably a good bit. Saying that was my fault is wrong, since I never did crash a plane. But, I have gotten a large check (about $120,000) and have had my 401Ks for last year and this year ($88,000 total) filled thanks to my claim as a creditor. (all after taxes) I also am waiting for another check for the pension dump, which will probably fill my 2008 401K allottment ($44,000) and then another $30-40 thousand in cash. And, since my 401K is full for the year, we get an additional 11% raise because the company still gives 9% to the DC fund in my name, and a 2% match to the 401K----which because it is full now comes each month in cash. Has some of that made up for my lost pay? YES. Will it last me for another few years waiting for contract talks? I don't know. We do get automatic raises, and if we are profitable (as they are saying) we could get another 6% raise this year.

How did the USAir guys do when they got out of BK? They just got a $4400 check after Xmas. Our Capatins got $400,000 before taxes, and I got near $300,000 before taxes(401K fill ups included). I don't think we did that bad, and even the retired pilots got something back, along with most of the creditors (compared to the Untied BK). Would I want you or me to go through another BK? Nope. It was sad that we got there, but we kept the majority of our work rules, got a BK claim and a pension claim, and are now expanding again. Not everyone wants to fly for Southwest or fly your type of trips on the same plane forever. That is the point I am continually trying to make here. A lot of you can't believe it because you think Gary Kelly is the return of Jesus.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[canyonblue]

We actually helped you get your higher wage, even if some on here don't believe it.

Bye Bye--General Lee

Nobody helped Southwest pilots, Southwest doesn't work that way.

Southwest has never equated us with other Airlines who fly the 737 for the purposes of pay. We are an entirely different operation as they would like to point out. Well, now I am glad we aren't equated with the other 737 operators out there.

 

[General Lee]

I have one: Do you have a life outside of FI?

I mean you must be really bored to look up all those flights, have 9000+ posts mainly knocking JB and SW. If I didn't know better, I would think you were almost jealous.

I have a great life. I do mostly turns from ATL, and my wife works full time. I am not jealous of any other pilots, rather I enjoy debating the aviation industry. Some don't like my opinions, which is fine, if they can back it up. Most cannot. I have more than 9000 posts because I enjoy responding, to people like you, and getting and giving input. I have been on here for years obviously, and I actually enjoy this board. Yes, there are other things I enjoy in life, but this is certainly one of them.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Nobody helped Southwest pilots, Southwest doesn't work that way.

Southwest has never equated us with other Airlines who fly the 737 for the purposes of pay. We are an entirely different operation as they would like to point out. Well, now I am glad we aren't equated with the other 737 operators out there.

Yes, I understand you are different, but at the time our 738 rates were just as high as your current ones, and you did compare them. To say otherwise is ridiculous, since it would have been STUPID not to compare them. You were doing better at the time than DL, and you flew the same type planes. You can't say you didn't compare them, that is false.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[canyonblue]

Sounds like you have a boring life.

Bye Bye--General Lee

Anyone else see the perplexity in this statement?

Posts: 9,025

 

[General Lee]

9,023 posts / 58 months on FI = 156 post per month.
Average month 30 days: 156/30 = 5.2 posts per day.

that must mean: he doesn't fly, has long ground times,long layovers or no life

ALL THE ABOVE

Or, I answer all the naysayers and give opinons to various subjects each time I am on the computer. I don't just answer once and then get off and do something else, I answer 20 or 30 each time. Do your math again genius.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[canyonblue]

Caught on tape!!!

General Lee at home posting, from this exclusive web cam!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0AyOzKKBGo

 

[General Lee]

Anyone else see the perplexity in this statement?

Posts: 9,025

This is how people respond when I am correct. They try to go for the gut, and instead look helpless. Try to debate instead of getting personal.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[FlyinGuy]

General...My life is at home, not on the road. When I am on the road, I do not waste my time watching TV or roaming around killing time until I can go to sleep. Also if you do mostly turns, then why do you keep telling us about how great the other side of the world is.

 

[General Lee]

General...My life is at home, not on the road. When I am on the road, I do not waste my time watching TV or roaming around killing time until I can go to sleep. Also if you do mostly turns, then why do you keep telling us about how great the other side of the world is.

That is true, and I do travel on Delta with the wife frequently. I have the opportunity now to travel as an FO, since I have the option to fly INTL FO or go for junior Captain. I like the fact that I have options, and I think people who are looking at airlines should know their options---travel the world or fly domestic, or just fly domestic for SWA. People should know before interviewing.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[FlyinGuy]

General, would you not agree that if people do not know what type company they are interviewing for, then they do not diserve the job. People go to SWA because of the reputation of the company. They do not come here because they are going to get to fly the "big iron". They know what type of flying they are going to do...and they choose it. We can go around all day about what is better, but in the end everyone has a different view of what is good for them. I am glad you like your job...I like mine too!