SWA starts proviing runs to SJU

[Bill Nelson]

Yeah the Puerto Rican market is underserved and just stuffed with high ticket paying pax!

SWA determines the ticket price for every market they serve. The only ticket price increase in their markets that stick are those they initiate or agree too. All other attempts get repealed. That is factual.
SWA has the largest most effective domestic feed. They will create the market with the network and they will moderate the ticket prices until competitors cede market share that they will gobble up. Proven effective year after year for 41 years. How many consecutive years has your company made money and how much has your domestic market share shrunk?

Good luck.

 

[BILL LUMBERG]

Leave Bill Nelson alone.....he's a warrior with a kool-aid funnel on 24/7/365.

Again, this is not news.....

"NO way....that's great! WE'VE LANDED ON THE MOON!"
-LLoyd Christmas-

 

[GIZMONC]

Still don't get this "proving run" it isn't required as far as I know. Can someone explain why they have to do it?

FAA told SWA they needed to start from scratch. Although SWA and FL are on the same operating certificate, FAA is requiring SWA to start from scratch on the certification process. Probably why SWA hired Randy Babbit to get someone in house who has an insight was to what is goig on in reguards to approval process as well as who to go to and what to do as to not delay the process. SWA has the pilots and fa's ready it just needs to get all the other ducks in a row. Once it is approved, flights will be loaded into the system and sell fast.

 

[Squirrel29]

But I never heard of needing to do proving run for classII navigation. Etops yes. Last company we was issued the certificate without doing any provings runs to SJU or the carribean.

 

[SKC]

I didn't say that ACARS is required, the underlying concept was that without it, you would need to get your performance numbers for an airport that isn't in your Op Specs as a Destination, Alternate, or Tech stop.

Yes, all that stuff needs to be established beforehand; that was the point I was trying to make. I guess you were to jet-lagged to get it. :laugh:

SWA doesn't obtain performance numbers via ACARS like your TLRs. I'm betting every possible Caribbean alternate will be in the OPC just for that type of event.

 

[carl p]

But I never heard of needing to do proving run for classII navigation. Etops yes. Last company we was issued the certificate without doing any provings runs to SJU or the carribean.

I was at a prior 121 carrier that was required to do proving runs for class II nav.

 

[Ty Webb]

Not jet lagged enough to realize you don't know what is required for international operations under ICAO member states, first of all, you WILL require airport along the route that comply with the one hour rule on one engine at 10K, ring a bell? If you don't get those airports along the route and the charts for them, no certification of that route. Second, not all adequate airports along specify routes need to have ground handling nor fuel contracts, there are contingency plans for this, in our case we have several fuel and regular credit cards in case of a diversion to an airport along the route that is not either of the airports you discribed.

Look, Chief, I'm not sure why exactly you're choosing to direct your arguments to me . . . if you go back and read the original posts, you'll see that I was saying that, as a purely domestic carrier, SWA does not have any of these things yet. That was my point, yet you want to either debate me on it, or try to impress us with your vast knowledge of all things international. You're basically arguing with yourself. . . . hence my comment about you being "jet lagged".

To further clarify, I'm not flying for SWA, I'm currently on the other side of the partition . . . my first near-International flight as PIC was in 1990.

 

[Ty Webb]

SWA doesn't obtain performance numbers via ACARS like your TLRs. I'm betting every possible Caribbean alternate will be in the OPC just for that type of event.

Copy dat. . . . . Does that thing have the ability to print out your takeoff performance data? If not, they'll need some way to comply with that requirement, as well.

 

[goahead]

Proving runs to SJU? Didn't Pan Am, Eastern, and Trans-Caribbean take care of this in the mid 1950's? Lots of 737's in and out of SJU daily(although the smaller of the jets serving the airport). It is not ETOPS unless you are flying from the Northeast when Bermuda is closed so why again does this route need a proving run? FA's practicing the life vest/raft demo? Use of long range navigation for the pilots? "This guys, is an HF radio. These were used during WWII to communicate great distances".

Meanwhile our guys are doing real proving runs on the 787 this week. Proving runs that make sense.

Where's the like button!

 

[redflyer65]

Let's see . . . for starters, no International Ops Specs, No International dispatching software. No ACARS. No international procedures training, no approach charts . . . No ground handling contracts in place. No fueling contracts. No approved weather sources.

Other than that, it's a breeze.

Ty,

I'm don't understand your post. Then why is Southwest flying an 800 to SJU all week then? By the end of the year we will have around 22 737-800s with ETOPS (not that you need that for SJU), and each of those 800s are fully equipped. Pretty much every option you could order from Boeing...including printers/HF/etc, etc.

As Lear stated, STX is close by and there will be international contingency airports. It ain't rocket surgery.

 

[Ty Webb]

Well, I give up . . . Apparently, my post wasn't very clear.

The point that I was trying to make is that it's not quite as simple as it was being made out to be in this thread ("what's the problem, if you need gas, just drop in on a tech stop, etc."). Just dropping into an airport that isn't as simple as it sounds, especially if you don't have a way to get all the things we take for granted- approved Wx, DX, approved Fuel vendor, performance planning, charts, etc.

There are many details that need to be worked out and put into place in advance, and the proving runs are to demonstrate that it works.

Regards,
Ty

 

[madjack]

I'm not an international expert (I will leave that to others) but it seems SWA has really been slow in capitalizing on the overseas markets...but for years the mantra here has been "there are plenty of opportunities in the Domestic market" that will be developed b4 SWA makes a foray across a pond...

 

[Metrojet]

Ty,

I'm don't understand your post. Then why is Southwest flying an 800 to SJU all week then? By the end of the year we will have around 22 737-800s with ETOPS (not that you need that for SJU), and each of those 800s are fully equipped. Pretty much every option you could order from Boeing...including printers/HF/etc, etc.

As Lear stated, STX is close by and there will be international contingency airports. It ain't rocket surgery.

"It ain't ROCKET SURGERY" ????? Pardon my ignorance there Red - i am going to have to google what you mean by that comment

Metrojet

 

[Metrojet]

"It ain't ROCKET SURGERY" ????? Pardon my ignorance there Red - i am going to have to google what you mean by that comment

Metrojet

Found it!


Rocket Surgery11 up, 103 downhttp://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=rocket surgery#http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=rocket surgery#A word dumbasses use, in confusion with rocket science and brain surgery, when trying to insult someone else for not being able to perform a brainless task.
Rocket Surgery11 up, 103 downhttp://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=rocket surgery#http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=rocket surgery#A word dumbasses use, in confusion with rocket science and brain surgery, when trying to insult someone else for not being able to perform a brainless task.
Rocket Surgery11 up, 103 downhttp://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=rocket surgery#http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=rocket surgery#A word dumbasses use, in confusion with rocket science and brain surgery, when trying to insult someone else for not being able to perform a brainless task
Rocket Surgery11 up, 103 downhttp://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=rocket surgery#http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=rocket surgery#A word dumbasses use, in confusion with rocket science and brain surgery, when trying to insult someone else for not being able to perform a brainless task
word dumbasses use, in confusion with rocket science and brain surgery, when trying to insult someone else for not being able to perform a brainless task.

 

[redflyer65]

Wow Metrojet. I'm glad you took the time to look that up. It's a very simple term to state something isn't as hard as it seems. You want to take it farther than my intent, then have at it.

And just for the record, I wasn't using it to demean Ty..just proving a point. I get what Ty was saying and I was just pointing out a different point of view. Very simple.

RF

 

[Dumb Pilot]

. Just dropping into an airport that isn't as simple as it sounds, especially if you don't have a way to get all the things we take for granted- approved Wx, DX, approved Fuel vendor, performance planning, charts, etc. Ty

I don't mean to argue with you Ty, I just don't understand why you assume that this is an issue, if you are flying from any point A within the lower 48 to any point B, SWA doesn't have operations personnel in all the airports available on that route, an emergency diversion into an airport that is not within their system will be handled the same way in this route than in any other airport that is not in their system, unless they divert to a crop dusting field..., this route will take them over the Bahamas, many airports there that service several airlines and are fully equipped with WX, maintenance, ground handling etc. the same goes for the Turks and Caicos, the Dominican Republic also has fully equipped facilities in Puerto Plata and Punta Cana that have several handling companies, there have been many diversions into these airports over the years and they go quite smoothly actually, you are not diverting into Lybia or Somalia, it's the Caribbean.