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SWA Is Smart...

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qxeplt

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 27, 2001
Posts
199
Southwest keeps employees happy
By Mitchell Schnurman
Star-Telegram Staff Writer

Low costs are a way of life at Southwest Airlines, but here's a little secret: Many of its pilots are among the best-paid in the business.

That would seem to be a pricey contradiction, except that the key is variable pay, not guaranteed salaries.

Southwest pilots earn about 20 percent less each month than their colleagues at mainline carriers, but many Southwest pilots eventually lap the competition because of stock options, profit sharing and performance bonuses.

Those variable elements have made millionaires out of some Southwest pilots without ratcheting up the company's expenses.

Not surprisingly, stock options have been eagerly adopted by most of the airline's other workers.

At Southwest, it's a virtuous circle, holding down labor costs, boosting productivity and rewarding the people responsible for the company's success. That, in turn, drives more growth, more job opportunities and a stronger stock price.

Executives at other airlines marvel at the trust between Southwest managers and employees. But Jim Parker, Southwest's chief executive, says it's just a matter of everyone realizing that what goes around comes around.

How they work together now, how they treat one another, how they succeed or fail -- those experiences dictate the attitudes going forward.

"It's a round world," says Parker, a key negotiator on some of the company's breakthrough contracts.

Other airlines, including United, have tried to emulate the Southwest approach. But none can match Southwest's stellar performance on the bottom line and on Wall Street.

When losses mount and the stock price tumbles, workers can rebel. At other airlines, they demanded raises in "hard pay" -- compensation they can count on -- without worrying about the impact on expenses.

Now the big airlines are in deep trouble, not only because of the slow economy and the 9-11 attacks, but also because their labor costs are so high.

Southwest has maintained its cost advantage and profits despite the worst financial decline in aviation history. And Southwest hasn't laid off any workers, a colossal achievement that scores big in labor talks.

"Job security has never been more important," said Greg Crum, a Southwest pilot and vice president of flight operations, who pointed out that about 8,000 pilots industrywide are on furlough.

The Southwest plan has attracted some criticism. Pilots who join the company after a contract takes effect get a new strike price on their options. That can reduce their total returns and create some resentment in the cockpit.

But here's the most telling referendum on the deal: Southwest pilots overwhelmingly approved the latest contract, even though it wasn't due to expire for two years and didn't come close to closing the gap with Delta's "hard pay."

Half of the pilot union's leadership balked at the proposal. But Southwest pilots approved it by a ratio more than 2-to-1 in August, extending it to 2006.

Delta pilots, the highest-paid in the business, earn 22 percent to 24 percent more than Southwest pilots with the same experience on the same Boeing 737s, according to Air Inc., an Atlanta company that provides career information to pilots.

"They agreed to take less pay," Air Inc.'s Kit Darby said about Southwest. "But you have to look at the whole package. They get a lot of stock options and profit sharing."

In 1994, Southwest pilots agreed to a groundbreaking, 10-year contract that locked in pay rates for five years in exchange for hefty stock options. Senior pilots, for example, received options for 10,000 shares.

Since then, Southwest's stock has split four times and its price has soared, even after accounting for the latest downturn in the industry. The initial stakes for those senior pilots now total 50,625 shares, with a base price, adjusted for splits, of $3.95 a share.

Last January, when Southwest was trading at more than $23, those stakes were worth just under $1 million. At Friday's price of $14.35, the paper value is $525,000 for each of the pilots.

The contract extension signed in August appears to be another savvy deal. It gives pilots an average of about 9,500 shares each, with a strike price of $12.84.

By Thanksgiving, Southwest's stock was trading above $16, and pilots were up $34,580, at least on paper. By year-end, much of the gain had been given back, but the airline industry is cyclical.

That underlines the tricky nature of stock options. Their actual value hinges on when workers get them and at what price, and when they sell them, again at what price.

The upside potential is great, but the process requires careful tending.

Southwest's pay has other valuable elements. Its profit-sharing plan has been huge because the company has made money for 29 consecutive years and is easily the most profitable airline. Southwest has typically contributed 10 percent to 15 percent of each worker's pay into a profit-sharing account, and employees decide how to invest the funds.

For pilots, some of whom earn more than $155,000 a year, the profit-sharing numbers can add up quickly. But Southwest does not have a traditional pension plan, which has been a staple at the mainline carriers and a major income source for retirees.

One pilot said that Southwest's profit sharing is approximately the equivalent of a traditional pension. Maybe by some measures. But the current crisis in the airline industry has put traditional pensions under pressure while employees at Southwest have cash in their accounts.

Southwest also has a 401(k) plan that matches the pilots' contribution, dollar for dollar for 7.3 percent of pay -- more than double the average match.

"We emphasize the value of the entire package," Parker said.

Surely that's one reason that ramp workers recently agreed to a contract extension, even though it freezes pay for two years. Their deal includes stock options, which have become a staple with nearly all worker groups at Southwest.

Darby calls the Southwest approach "self-adjusting." If there are no profits, there's no profit sharing, and the stock options aren't a hard cost.

"The problem is that you have to sell employees on doing it," Darby said. "They start out wanting cash."

Southwest makes it work because employees have faith in management: not just to boost stock values but to treat workers well and to keep its business model humming.

The company uses only one kind of plane, which cuts maintenance costs and turnaround time. It also lets Southwest pilots spend more hours in the air without wasting energy jockeying for higher-paying slots on larger jets.

At most other airlines, pilots move ahead by being promoted to bigger planes. But that career ladder also drives up training costs and makes it harder to match pilots with planes.

Southwest says it pays competitive rates for all its employees. By adding stock options to the mix, it keeps pay from skyrocketing and motivates workers to push harder.

That keeps the company growing, which creates more jobs. Southwest pilots have typically advanced to the captain's seat in less than six years, about half the time of pilots at many other airlines -- and that promotion adds the biggest boost to pay.

"At the end of the day, Southwest pilots aren't losing out," Darby said. "They've taken a risk, and it's paid off."

It's paid off for the company, too. And its customers.
 
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Good Article

Good Article. Now I just wish that pilot shortage thing that Kit's been talk'n about for the last umpteen years would just kick in.
 
Yeah Baby, Exactly!
 
Yes, but.....

LUV's business plan is great, but it is only a part of SWA's success.

I think the main factor for their success is the people. If SWA people weren't willing to enthusiastically execute their business plan, than it would never work, i.e., not helping when help is needed, not being responsible with company time and money, and on the extreme, throwing chocks into a running A319 engine.

Not enough can be said for a group of people that work effectively as a team in a effort to succeed.

Adios,

SR
 
Wow! That Koolaid over there must be as good as a beer after a 14 hour duty day!
 
Yeah, the Koolaid is good when you are paid well and you aren't getting hosed every time your back is turned. People who criticize koolaid just haven't tasted the good stuff yet.
 
My $.02...

Let's see, where did I put that old asbestos suit........??

During my career I have been on both ends of aviation, started as a line boy, then the flying end & eventually the management/owning end. Here are a few observations;

(take them or leave them, like them or don't - you're problem, not mine - I am just relating what I have observed)

1. A large percentage of pilots feel that they should ONLY be responsible for "flying the airplane". If I had a $1 for everytime I had to deal with pilot's EGO over having to do something that they felt was "beneath them" I would be sailing a 50+ foot ketch around Tortola.

2. "Employees" are not usually included in the decision making & day to day efforts required to make a business run smoothly. (@90+% of companies) Everyone WANTS to believe that their opinions, ideas and efforts are listened to and used by "management". IF a company makes you feel needed and important, you will do whatever is required to be part of the "team".

3. People who work for companies where the "norm" is - worker angst, fear & loathing of management (probably for good reasons), doing "my job" only and not caring to help out wherever needed - seem to feel threatened (or just angry) by those who enjoy working for a company who are happy to lend a fellow employee a hand when needed.

If worker produtivity and general happiness can be achieved by using a management model that rewards good attitudes and happy workers - what can you possibly find at fault with that!?!?

In this month's "Spirit" magazine (SWA's in-flight mag) the "Star of The Month" James Sanchez said; "In the words of Confucius, 'If you can find the right job, you will never work a day in your life.' "

Personally, I chose SWA over ALL other places to fly a jet because of the legacy of caring and a corporate culture that some people in the industry just don't seem to understand.

Call me whatever you care to, Kool-Aid drinker, etc., etc.... if that's what it takes to insure another 49 consecutive quarters of profit - you will easily recognize me in the terminal - I'll be the guy with the red Kool-Aid moustache!:D

Good Luck to everyone - let's hope that 2003 will return our floundering economy & fragile industry back to a pattern of healthy and growing times.

Regards - Tred
 
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I call it pretty pathetic if you're happy with your whole retirement being based on a 401K and AIRLINE STOCK! You guys deserve better. I won't address your pay rates or work rules, because that's beyond hope, but you guys need to get a A/B fund. That will hardly make a drastic effect on consecutive quaterly profits.
 
Southwest pilots earn about 20 percent less each month than their colleagues at mainline carriers, but many Southwest pilots eventually lap the competition because of stock options, profit sharing and performance bonuses.

Those variable elements have made millionaires out of some Southwest pilots without ratcheting up the company's expenses.

Nimtz,

It's been proven at SWA with profit share funded 401k and employee and company match you will do as good as any A or B fund anywhere else. The big difference is with the SWA 401K retirement, you control the funds, it's in your account, not tied up in some under funded, who knows whether you'll see that money A fund.

A post a couple years ago researched SWA's 401K and American's A fund, both based on the Boeing 737 retirement and it was a total wash.

BTW, SWA Is Smart…
 
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A fund

Yep, looks like for many of us that the A fund is simply that.....a fund.....a fund that's probably gone for good.

Looks like it's gonna be 401k's and clip'n coupons for the next few years.
 
Look at today’s retirees with 401ks. After they have taken a huge hit in the market they are trying to eek out a few percent to live on. A 401k is a sorry excuse for a pension. These guys at Southwest don't have to worry about retirement though because by the time they hit sixty there will not be many years left in them. The problem is while they are all patting themselves on the back for running the majors out of business the whole industry is going down the drain. Who wants to make a career out of flying your but off for low pay and no retirement. The jobs at United that are being lost are quality airline jobs with reasonable work rules and good benefits. The guys at Southwest need to get on board with ALPA and get an A fund. These start up, low cost airlines will continue to nip at the heals of the majors but when they start really competing with them the pilots need get their stuff together and start getting paid!! The way things are heading when my little two year old grows up the only pilot jobs around will be regional and low cost carriers. It's great that southwest is making money on the backs of the naive employees but there is a whole industry that's going down the tubes. I don't have to preach to the people on this board about what it takes to get in the left seat at a major. Don't sell yourselves short.
 
Those poor overworked people

"The problem is while they are all patting themselves on the back for running the majors out of business the whole industry is going down the drain."

"It's great that southwest is making money on the backs of the naive employees but there is a whole industry that's going down the tubes. "

Um, ............... ALPA to the rescue? Right
 
I brought this over from the thread "SWA 2003..." seems as if it belongs here...



Read somewhere that UAL will post a loss of $35+ PER share for 2002....

Regardless IF they survive or not,( I hope they do for all of my UAL buddies) chances are pretty good that they will be MUCH less competitive due to the massive amount of layoffs, planes parked (to be parked) IF the restructuring is approved.

Growth @ SWA is possible. Probably a good time for ALL LCCs to grow.... seems that it is the biz model that will become (has become?) the future of (at least) the domestic market.

Watch for the NEW financial catastrophe in 2003 - Pension Fund Fraud and/or underfunding problems. I Expect class action suits against investment management firms and actuaries as companies attempt to weasle out of payments and/or obligations.

As with tax reform in 1986.... more burden will be placed on the WORKER to fund his/her own retirement plan. As pensions (read A PLANS) quickly become a thing of the past..... the Bills are already in commitee for reforms, believe it that corporate America wants these reforms to pass, watch who you vote for in 2 years..... the handwriting is on the walls - why do you think they have already voted FOR, and passed, increased contributions to 401ks/SEPs/SIMPLEs/IRAs etc. ??

Unlike some, I don't pretend to be able to predict the future, just MY opnion that there are some pretty drastic changes coming our way in the airline industry.... don't count on many more bailouts... those who survive are going to have to make money, NOT lose money!!!

Tred


PS-
I will add the following comment for this thread - $200K+/yr. is great pay - for any industry. There are very few companies that offer a pension plan ("A" Plan) to ANY of their employees. Actually, I can't think of ANY firm that offers executives, or rank & file employees, a "pension". You either wake up and contribute to your 401k, or plan on living off a SS check and a part-time job at McDonalds.

I understand the frustration that is faced by those who are losing jobs, pensions and pay rates that "were" the norm for our industry. However, IMHO, there IS change happening in the business.... accepting the change and making it work for you will be the key to your happiness as a professional pilot.

To stand your ground for a $400K+ income, $85K+ lifetime pensions and work rules that allow you to be paid for 90 hours when you only work 70 hours IS admirable, but may not be very practical going forward.

I know the term "BIG picture" is over used and can be condescending and even aggrevating, but perhaps it is appropriate due to the possible "paradigm" shift that may be happening in our beloved profession.

Just food for thought, once again MY thoughts to stir (hopefully) some intelligent, thoughtful debate that I have come to enjoy (occaisionally) on this forum!!:D

Can't wait to see the responses...... oh boy.... Tred
 
In the long run, a profession will get paid "what they are worth," with said worth determined by Supply & Demand, as well as what value they provide to their employer. Teachers do incredibly valuable work, but the supply is pretty high. Star quarterbacks may not contribute much to "society," but turning a team into a playoff regular is worth big bucks to the guys who pay the salaries -- and star QB's are hard to find.

There is only so much that negotiations can accomplish. If every pilot in the world banded together & said, "we either get paid $1M / year, or we don't fly," then some few pilots would get that wage (seem to remember a stat that a certain trans-Pacific FedEx flight produced $1M in revenue each flight), and a whole bunch wouldn't fly. Of course, nobody would honor such a pact for very long, and supply & demand would start to run its course, and the wages won by hard bargaining sooner or later would start to come back down.

Some times airline management makes stupid decisions (not that this is big news). It seems to me that UAL's management put themselves in a position where they couldn't say "no" to some of the union demands, even if the proposals were more than United could realistically pay over the long term. So UAL pilots got an "industry leading" contract. But the fact that the pilots (and other groups there) could GET such a contract does NOT mean that those pay rates were *sustainable*. Your employer may have to pay you whatever you negotiate, but the free market doesn't have to pay that much if it is more than the economic value of your work!

Recent history seems to show that very little of UAL's cost structure from the last few years is sustainable. Pilot pay, while only a part of the problem, IS part of the problem. Do I blame the pilots? Nope. They'd suffered from some awful conditions & givebacks, wanted to be compensated, asked for the moon, and by golly they got it. It isn't their job to run the airline or know what is affordable; management had given away so much & put themselves in such a position that they had no ability to negotiate for less. Bad on management. They created a situation that could not continue beyond the best of economic times.

Some places follow a more even-keel approach without the cycles of boom & bust, industry leading contracts followed by industry-leading furloughs & an industry-leading bankruptcy. "Slow but steady wins the race." Pay rates at SWA (generally acknowledged as the best airline management in the US today) aren't the highest, although total compensation (by the time you include total hours flown each year, profit sharing, 401k matching, stock appreciation, etc) is not that far off. There is a LOT more to compensation than $/hour, even if hourly wage is the easiest number to compare. Some people cry (or scream) about an "industry average wage," but what exact population one should find the average *of*, tends to be a rather moving target. How does one average in the salary for second year F/O's at UAL, DAL, AMR, etc right now?

The bitterness of a recent post is really a tragic thing to behold, but I just don't subscribe to the whole "holding down the profession's wages" theory. UAL's wages in their last contract didn't appear to be held down by anything... they went up to levels that are, in hindsight, unsustainable.

> The jobs at United that are being lost are quality airline jobs with reasonable work rules and good benefits.

I'd love to get paid $1M each year for flying jets, but the sad truth of the matter is that I don't bring that much value to the table. Not many pilots do. Even if some union could negotiate such a wage, if the pilots don't bring that much value to the job, then it won't be sustainable. Which is what we're seeing unfolding right now, with a great deal of pain & misery for those affected by it.

While there is room for improvement in the compensation, contract, work rules, & plenty of other issues at SWA, it is of tremendous value to know that it's a job at a stable, profitable airline; that continued growth will mean that there aren't any 10-year F/O's waiting to upgrade, and that retirement $, while less than I'd *like* to have (just like the $1M/year I'd like to make), is not subject to evaporating away to nothing if the company should go bankrupt, or have dishonest bookkeepers (ENRON).

If I had REALLY wanted to make a million dollars every year, I could have tried to become a corporate attorney or a brain surgeon or a venture capitalist. But I didn't. I became a pilot, and I enjoy my job. The money is nice, and while "more would always be better," I don't really want to pursue an "industry leading contract" if industry leading layoffs, instability, & turmoil are the accompanying price.

To those who think I should be dissatisfied with my situation because I don't make more than I do, I can only say that I'm sorry for your situation.
 
INDUSTRY LEADING PAY

If everyone got the INDUSTRY LEADING pay they *deserved* , then it would only be the average industry pay...

Infact, that is what happened to CEO compensation. No one wants their company to pay less than average CEO compensation. Which is why CEO's today get 10 million dollar golden parachutes after wrecking the companies they are paid to run.

So if Delta's union negotiates a sh!t hot contract, and United's unions decide thy derserve as much, and management buckles, we are all in for it.

It is funny listening to "Gearup 727". Yeah SWA is to blame for all the industry's problems. Man if they just didn't try to offer a better product for a cheaper price, we could stay competive. If they would just get onboard with ALPA we would ALL have INDUSTRY LEADING pay... but wouldn't that make it AVERAGE pay?
 
I'm not saying that Southwest is putting United, Eastern, Braniff or anyone else out of business. I'm saying that the pilots at these low cost airlines like Jet Blue, Airtran and Southwest should strive for retirements and schedules that are more inline with what the majors have traditionally offered. If they don't then a new paradigm will have been created for pilots of the future where A and B Funds are a thing of the past. Southwest will not dry up and blow away if they start a retirement system for pilots.

I agree that the pilot groups and United and Delta have stretched the limits when it comes to pay and benefits. Most airlines have started with the pilot and other work groups enjoying a good relationship with management. The company gets bigger, a middle management is inserted between the workers and the top management. Middle management in trying to control costs pisses off the employee groups. The employee groups unionize and work toward industry leading wages. The airline becomes high cost, gets bad management and when an economic down turn comes it starts taking on water. Southwest will be no different. It is early in the evolution of an airline. United is at the end of the evolution. Southwest didn’t put United out of business.

The pilots at SW should have an A fund. You may not think you're worth it but I think you are worth it and I'm not even a Southwest pilot. Don't sell yourselves short. Making Southwest pay you a retirement would put SW on and equal footing with other airlines who pilots are paid well and have retirements. What's the point of sitting back and saying ha ha my airline makes more than yours partially because I don't have the benefit package you have. Who wants to have the last laugh in that situation? I am not trying to throw any rocks at the SW guys but creating a new paradigm where pilots are compensated on a lower scale really doesn’t do any of us any good in the long term.
 
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Fully agree that traditionally, airlines that started out doing well have ended up as described:

> Middle management in trying to control costs pisses off the
> employee groups. The employee groups unionize and work
> toward industry leading wages. The airline becomes high cost,
> gets bad management and when an economic down turn
> comes it starts taking on water.

Where I disagree is with the idea that such is inevitable (at least at Southwest). SWA is one of the most unionized carriers in America, but (due to many things, including smart management, careful hiring practices, and a sincere effort to maintain the corporate culture) it is, as yet, NOT on the high cost path described. This high cost path, however, is what is being advocated with the statement

> I'm saying that the pilots at these low cost airlines like Jet Blue,
> Airtran and Southwest should strive for retirements and
> schedules that are more inline with what the majors have
> traditionally offered.

SWA labor should strive for the things that have created so many problems for the other carriers? No, thanks.

As I said, there is room for improvements in the contract, but SWA pilots aren't paid badly and have a more SECURE retirement in personal 401k's than U or UAL pilots do in company A/B funds. The guys who valued big $ over all else wouldn't be interested in SWA, but plenty of people value security & stability over the highest possible hourly wage.

Generally, SWA pilots are pretty happy with their situation at the moment. Why they would want to emulate the high-cost systems at airlines that are failing & ruin the good thing that they have going is beyond me.
 
We are looking at myriad possiblities to enhance our retirement in the next section 6. I don't believe you will see an "A" fund as one of the possibilities. Maybe raising our company match from 7.4 percent to something else. I believe the BOD will do what the pilots want and I haven't flown with anyone who advocates an "A" fund. While I agree with your statement that SWA will not immediately go under with an "A" fund, what happens twenty five years from now when some new CEO runs us into the ground? Why would I want your form of retirement? How secure does a 55 year-old United pilot feel about his retirement now?

Let me ask you a question, would you rather have the current Social Security system, or back when you first started working
would you rather have taken all that money and invested it yourself? I for one would rather have a stack of cash in the bank knowing that it was all mine and no politician or event could take it away.

I am into my third year at SWA. My first year I got an extra 15% in profit sharing (similar to a B fund, can't spend till retirement). My second year ended making right at $80,000 without working extra much. I only need 250 retirements and the addition of 40 airplanes to make captain (about 2 years from now unless we start growing more rapidly) I fly 3 on, 4 off and our overnights are definitely industry leading. We have a lot of fun flying, our flight attendents are a blast. And last, but not least, WE DON'T LEAVE PILOTS standing at the gate with a half full airplane just because we only have one jumpseat.

Am I kool-aid drinker? Absolutely not. I voted against our current contract extension because I thought we could do better and I thought the economy would turn around. I was wrong. Now I'm glad it passed. I'll take the 7000 options at just over
12 bucks and let it ride.

I am sorry that United is in the $hitter; I have many good friends there, and many furloughed. I hope they can pull it out. I am sorry for the guy in my new hire class who went there. I know they are a victim of their management, not their contract. But do I want what they have? I don't think so.
 

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