Sterile Cockpit over the Hudson

[buscap]

And did anyone else notice Captain SULLY fessed up to busting sterile cockpit, with his comment about how nice the Hudson looked?

Funny how the talking heads in congress have not called for his liver on a plate.

Oh well...where's my beer......???

(yes...I know this is a lame thread)

 

[satpak77]

lets see Sully successfully pulls off in the real airplane what nobody can replicate in the sim, nobody dies, he is a hero, and somebody on flightinfo wants to point out how he "busted" sterile cockpit by saying the river was pretty

 

[kf4amu]

He was just pointing out potential emergency landing sites. Great CRM.

 

[SmitteyB]

While he did a good job and he is a hero, he still violated sterile cockpit.

 

[onewithwings]

...and why is this in the "Regional" forum?

 

[AiRegency]

lets see Sully successfully pulls off in the real airplane what nobody can replicate in the sim, nobody dies, he is a hero, and somebody on flightinfo wants to point out how he "busted" sterile cockpit by saying the river was pretty

Your confusing Sully with the United Sioux City crew. Pilots have been put in the sim to replicate Sullys senario and the majority of pilots successfully accomplished the same thing. Also, did you notice that Sully hit the water (according to the papers so take this with a grain of salt) nearly 3 times harder then the airbus was designed to hit in a ditching senario. In his defense here, however, most pilots could not ditch within the design limits airbus had built in. Of course who can blame them? Who gets to practice ditching in the sim?
But buscap is correct. Sully violated sterile cockpit. If he had been flying a CRJ the feds would probably be saying that if he hadn't been casually chatting beneath 10,000 then maybe he could have seen and avoided the giant flock of geese.

F*** it!

 

[Nindiri]

Because the OP is making a point about the double standard applied to the Colgan accident crew, a regional airline.

 

[flyf15]

Sully made one small comment on the order of stuff said by every crew in every airplane across the country.

Regional airline crews, such as Colgan or Comair in LEX, have at times shown a completely awe-inspiring lack of regard for sterile cockpit and its importance. So bad that it makes my head spin.

 

[Raoul Duke]

lets see Sully successfully pulls off in the real airplane what nobody can replicate in the sim,

no one else can pull it off because everyone trying in the sim made it to KTEB

 

[dojetdriver]

Regional airline crews, such as Colgan or Comair in LEX, have at times shown a completely awe-inspiring lack of regard for sterile cockpit and its importance. So bad that it makes my head spin.

You mean like these legacy pilots?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TmCtJhCPEeQ

http://www.airdisaster.com/special/special-dl1141.shtml

http://www.tailstrike.com/310888.htm

I believe these guys got faulted for sterile cockpit as well;

http://www.ntsb.gov/NTSB/brief.asp?ev_id=20001208X05238&key=1


I believe it was in this one too;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northwest_Airlines_Flight_255

http://www.ntsb.gov/NTSB/brief.asp?ev_id=20001213X31759&key=1

 

[dojetdriver]

Regional airline crews, such as Colgan or Comair in LEX, have at times shown a completely awe-inspiring lack of regard for sterile cockpit and its importance. So bad that it makes my head spin.

You mean like these legacy pilots?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TmCtJhCPEeQ

http://www.airdisaster.com/special/special-dl1141.shtml

http://www.tailstrike.com/310888.htm

I believe these guys got faulted for sterile cockpit as well;

http://www.ntsb.gov/NTSB/brief.asp?ev_id=20001208X05238&key=1


I believe it was in this one too;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northwest_Airlines_Flight_255

http://www.ntsb.gov/NTSB/brief.asp?ev_id=20001213X31759&key=1

Let me guess, your username says it all?

 

[AC560]

Because the OP is making a point about the double standard applied to the Colgan accident crew, a regional airline.

It would be a double standard if the outcomes/situations were equal, which they are not.

Violation of the sterile cockpit was contributory to one of the incidents and not the other. Thus why the situations are handled independently.

 

[pilotyip]

All of those who have busted "SC" please give up posting on FI, the board would be empty.

 

[embpic1]

All of those who have busted "SC" please give up posting on FI, the board would be empty.

Agreed.

 

[buscap]

Just my little attempt at "Let he who is without sin...blah...blah...blah"

And by the way, success is a terribly unreliable measure of performance unless extrapolated over a proper number of attempts.

 

[ATR-DRIVR]

While he did a good job and he is a hero, he still violated sterile cockpit.

Hmm..let's see here...you are in the Slob? Is that right - um - is it Captain..? So you're saying that you have NEVER said anything below 10,000 ft other than REQUIRED CHECKLIST ITEMS, ATC COMMO, OR REQUIRED CALLOUTS, is that correct...?

 

[PBRstreetgang]

Because the OP is making a point about the double standard applied to the Colgan accident crew, a regional airline.

They were incompetent and killed 49 innocent people, Sully did just what he had to and no-one got hurt, minor difference.
Game, set, match, next.
PBR

 

[Nindiri]

It would be a double standard if the outcomes/situations were equal, which they are not.

Violation of the sterile cockpit was contributory to one of the incidents and not the other. Thus why the situations are handled independently.

Nah, it's a double standard because the crews are being held to different standards. The fact that the outcomes were different is irrelevant to the fact that both crews violated the rule.

And I'm not putting Sully down. Personally, I think the whole "sterile cockpit" rule is a joke. Being professional about your responsibilities is more important than some goofy "feel-good" rule.

 

[Nindiri]

They were incompetent and killed 49 innocent people, Sully did just what he had to and no-one got hurt, minor difference.
Game, set, match, next.
PBR

I have no idea what the Hell your point is.

Someone asked why this thread was in the regional forum. I answered.

Game, set, match, next.

 

[buscap]

[/QUOTE]And I'm not putting Sully down. Personally, I think the whole "sterile cockpit" rule is a joke. Being professional about your responsibilities is more important than some goofy "feel-good" rule.[/QUOTE]

Thank You!!!

We have a winner!!!!!!!

 

[FlyinFife]

Hmm..let's see here...you are in the Slob? Is that right - um - is it Captain..? So you're saying that you have NEVER said anything below 10,000 ft other than REQUIRED CHECKLIST ITEMS, ATC COMMO, OR REQUIRED CALLOUTS, is that correct...?

Umm...the sterile cockpit concept allows you to vocalize more than just these three items. Issues that are directly related to the safe outcome of the flight can and should be discussed:

"That's a pretty big thunderstorm right in front of us" or
"That airplane looks pretty close to us" or
"Let's review the missed approach procedure one more time" or
"Let's review the windshear recovery procedure" etc.

 

[kf4amu]

Umm...the sterile cockpit concept allows you to vocalize more than just these three items. Issues that are directly related to the safe outcome of the flight can and should be discussed:

"That's a pretty big thunderstorm right in front of us" or
"That airplane looks pretty close to us" or
"Let's review the missed approach procedure one more time" or
"Let's review the windshear recovery procedure" etc.

or "Look at the Hudson, sure looks pretty...(good for an emergency landing site".

 

[SmitteyB]

Hmm..let's see here...you are in the Slob? Is that right - um - is it Captain..? So you're saying that you have NEVER said anything below 10,000 ft other than REQUIRED CHECKLIST ITEMS, ATC COMMO, OR REQUIRED CALLOUTS, is that correct...?

Oh I have violated sterile cockpit. I never said I did not.

I am however a little upset with the double standard being applied here today. Sully violated sterile cockpit, so did 3407.

However- anyone familiar with the accident investigations see's that when they were vectored onto the approach and the approach sequence began they didn't say another word that wasn't standard. When they were violating sterile cockpit, they were flying airplane fine. When they "focussed" the airplane stopped flying. Gotta be fatigue.

 

[MCDU]

There is a difference in a comment and getting into a conversation. Comments happen all the time below 10000ft., but their should not be discussions. Big difference. Sully had a comment and the Colgan PFT Capt was having a discussion with his low time F/O.
Kind of ironic what they were discussing about. I feel bad for the F/O. She should not have been put in such a position.

M

 

[SmitteyB]

There is a difference in a comment and getting into a conversation. Comments happen all the time below 10000ft., but their should not be discussions. Big difference. Sully had a comment and the Colgan PFT Capt was having a discussion with his low time F/O.
Kind of ironic what they were discussing about. I feel bad for the F/O. She should not have been put in such a position.

M

2,200TT is not a low time FO in the regionals.

 

[kf4amu]

2,200TT is not a low time FO in the regionals.

Maybe it should be.

 

[JustaNumber]

I don't know if this has or should have any bearing, but it is a little easier for an Airbus pilot to maintain sterile cockpit, than for a Saab pilot, simply due to the significant difference in amount of time each spends below 10k. The Airbus guy can climb that high in just 3 or 4 minutes, while the Saab guy might spend the entire flight below 10. Just food for thought.

 

[SLUF4]

well it is below 10,000 except cruise flight so once the saab is in cruise feel free to discuss. I think we probably all have violated this rule at least once, but I'm taking it more seriously these days

 

[PeanuckleCRJ]

Colgan 3407 didn't break sterile cockpit too bad. There were some extraneous words said, but they were at least pertinent to their flight conditions and they chilled out before the approach really commenced.

What is terrible was their absolutely piss poor airmanship and total lack of SA.

 

[pilotyip]

RElaxed SC

I don't know if this has or should have any bearing, but it is a little easier for an Airbus pilot to maintain sterile cockpit, than for a Saab pilot, simply due to the significant difference in amount of time each spends below 10k. The Airbus guy can climb that high in just 3 or 4 minutes, while the Saab guy might spend the entire flight below 10. Just food for thought.

the SC rules can be relaxed in crusie even if it is below 10K