Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
  • Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
  • Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
  • Share the passion for aviation
  • Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun

Staying safe in Brazilian skies

Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
  • Invite your friends
  • Share the passion of aviation
  • Friendliest aviation community on the web

FL420

Blues vs. Birds-Tailhook
Joined
Oct 11, 2005
Posts
626
Two European airlines have adopted special precautions for flying in Brazil
http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/N10457538.htm

BRASILIA, Brazil, Dec 10 (Reuters) - Two European airlines have adopted special precautions for flying in Brazil, a leading Brazilian newspaper reported on Sunday, a day after the country's president pledged to resolve a nationwide air traffic crisis.

The airlines will tell pilots they doubted the safety of Brazilian air space and instruct them to fly at the edges of air traffic lanes and take other defensive measures, Christoph Gilgen of the Federation of International Air Traffic Controllers Associations (Ifatca), told Folha de S. Paulo.

The two airlines were not identified.

Ifatca seriously discussed rating Brazil's air space "dangerous" -- a label it uses for some African nations - but opted instead for "under suspicion," the newspaper said.

Brazil's air traffic has been mired in chaos since the worst plane crash in the country's history two months ago. On Sept. 29, two aircraft clipped wings over the Amazon, causing one, a passenger jet, to spin out of control and crash into the jungle, killing all 154 people on board.

The other, a smaller executive jet, made an emergency landing at a nearby military base.

Preliminary results of an investigation showed both aircraft had been cleared to fly at 37,000 feet (11,000 metres) and there may have been gaps in radar coverage.

Brazilian air traffic controllers, angry at being blamed for the crash, have staged work slow-downs to protest long hours and poor pay, causing air traffic to snarl, airports to close and airlines to cancel hundreds of flights.

Ifatca could not be reached on Sunday for comment on the report.

Brazilian President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva pledged to fix the air traffic problems as he left a regional conference in Bolivia on Saturday.

"It makes no sense for Brazil to go on suffering problems with its airports," he told TV reporters. "Maybe people have to suffer because of rains or because a (control) tower collapses, but they won't suffer because of equipment failures anymore."
 
A control tower collapses!?!?

Brazilian President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva pledged to fix the air traffic problems as he left a regional conference in Bolivia on Saturday.

"It makes no sense for Brazil to go on suffering problems with its airports," he told TV reporters. "Maybe people have to suffer because of rains or because a (control) tower collapses, but they won't suffer because of equipment failures anymore."


Nah, they won't suffer because of equipment failures at all. They'll suffer because their gov't will blame the pilots instead of the equipment failures. :puke: Then they'll turn around and charge the pilots for manslaughter and work up local public opinion against the pilots in the Brazilian papers by saying its all the fault of rich airplane owners and pilots that were flying aerobatics in multi-million dollar corp barges. :puke: :puke:

Now, how often does a Brazilian ATC Tower collapse? Must be pretty often if the president of the country himself suggests it! Man! I'm glad I don't fly that far south! :uzi:
 
The best way to fly safely in Brazil?

Take the bus.
 
I admit I've not read a lot about this case, but USA Today from a few days back mentioned that the main case revolves around the use of the transponder. What's up with that? Was the transponder INOP, or not turned on?
 
I admit I've not read a lot about this case, but USA Today from a few days back mentioned that the main case revolves around the use of the transponder. What's up with that? Was the transponder INOP, or not turned on?

Brazil ATC (read: Air Force) claimed that the Legacy's transponder was off. It was just another wild accusation they made during their initial CYA denial of fault.
 
I admit I've not read a lot about this case, but USA Today from a few days back mentioned that the main case revolves around the use of the transponder. What's up with that? Was the transponder INOP, or not turned on?
It's apparent that the TCAS II in the Legacy did not work. They haven't released any info from the CVR or the DFDR on the Gol B737 so we have no idea what cockpit indications, if any, the B737 crew had.

There could be many reasons the Legacy TCAS II didn't give an RA or at least a TA:
∙ an electrical malfunction in the box, wiring or antenna of either the Legacy or the B737
∙ a "switchology" problem in either the Legacy or the B737 that prevented an RA(e.g. - Mode C[or Mode S in this case,] altitude reporting switch OFF in one or both aircraft or TA only selected)
∙ a "switchology" problem in either the Legacy or the B737 that prevented a TA and an RA(e.g. - Mode C[or Mode S in this case,] altitude reporting switch OFF in one or both aircraft or Mode A switch OFF in one or both aircraft)

Since Joe and Jan reported their transponder switches were properly positioned and if this is corroborated by the Legacy DFDR, the problem lies either with the B737 "switchology" or a malfunction in the equipment on the B737 or Legacy.

In my past experience, the potential for unforeseen mechanical malfunctions is greatest in brand new aircraft and even worse in an aircraft just coming out of overhaul. Given a choice, I would always prefer to fly a dirty ratty old bird off the line than to go pickup and test fly a new aircraft from the factory or a freshly-painted one just out of intermediate depot-level maintenance.

I have gone to pick up F-4s from Progressive Aircraft Rework(PAR aka Paint And Return) and discovered on preflight that both static ports had been fiberglassed and painted over in one aircraft; the Emergency Stores Jettison button had been removed from another aircraft and a third aircraft had two Emergency Stores Jettison buttons. I had no clue which one, if either, of the buttons was wired up. All three of these aircraft were supposed to have had at least one test flight before being returned to service for me to ferry back to the squadron.

I know speculation is bad but if I were forced to make a bet I would bet on a malfunction involving the installation of brand new sophisticated electronics in a brand new airplane, probably the Legacy since the B737 had been on line for awhile. I reserve the right to change my opinion based on the release of information derived from the B737 CVR and DFDR.
 
Last edited:
I dunno...I've seen pictures of some pretty awful bus accidents.

How about just don't go to Brazil?

Nu

Dude, I can sum up the need to go to Brazil in just two words.

Brazillian women. :pimp:
 

Latest resources

Back
Top